Author Topic: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide  (Read 3006 times)

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Offline noisyturtle

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Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« on: Thu, 07 June 2018, 16:20:29 »
I constantly find myself daydreaming about taking my own life, no doubt someday I likely will, but until that moment is right one of the biggest things that holds me back is going out with regrets. Now imagine a program that helps suicidal people not seek mental help, because let's be very real here - some people do not want help and realize they are destined to live a life of emotional pain no matter the path they take. But it's also true many of us living with these conditions actually DO want to accomplish or live out some goal or fantasy before passing. Just because happiness is unobtainable doesn't mean someone at the end of their line doesn't have dreams. Even if it is something simple like wanting to spend one last day with each of their family members but not having the money for plane tickets to visit them.

Now imagine this non-profit actually generates it's wealth through the donations of those using the services. If you plan on dying you won't need your possessions, so there can be a donation system from those using the service to live out their dreams paid for by those who previously lived out their dreams before them. It's quite beautiful in a way. What do you think?

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #1 on: Thu, 07 June 2018, 16:27:51 »
I constantly find myself daydreaming about taking my own life, no doubt someday I likely will, but until that moment is right one of the biggest things that holds me back is going out with regrets. Now imagine a program that helps suicidal people not seek mental help, because let's be very real here - some people do not want help and realize they are destined to live a life of emotional pain no matter the path they take. But it's also true many of us living with these conditions actually DO want to accomplish or live out some goal or fantasy before passing. Just because happiness is unobtainable doesn't mean someone at the end of their line doesn't have dreams. Even if it is something simple like wanting to spend one last day with each of their family members but not having the money for plane tickets to visit them.

Now imagine this non-profit actually generates it's wealth through the donations of those using the services. If you plan on dying you won't need your possessions, so there can be a donation system from those using the service to live out their dreams paid for by those who previously lived out their dreams before them. It's quite beautiful in a way. What do you think?

Really good idea.  But don’t kill yourself.  Find someone who needs and deserves help and donate your time to them.

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #2 on: Thu, 07 June 2018, 16:31:08 »
Suicide fantasy is not uncommon.

it's -Not- uncommon

Because Dopamine dis-regulation IS Common..



This is especially true in today's developed societies where the Mind is perpetually satiated by non-ceasing stimulating experiences.



Cut back on that lifestyle, and the regulation system will return to normal.

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #3 on: Thu, 07 June 2018, 16:33:15 »

Find someone who needs and deserves help and donate your time to them.


The cost to this is extremely high, only someone of means are actually able to do this effectively.

That isn't to say one of modest life shouldn't try,  but probably not practical.

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #4 on: Thu, 07 June 2018, 16:43:20 »
True, but the payoff is high

Offline noisyturtle

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #5 on: Thu, 07 June 2018, 17:01:36 »
This is one of the problems in modern society, everyone wants to feel like they are helping. People need to be able to accept the reality that some folks are not wired for happiness, it's ****ed but that's the biological absolute for a lot of people. I hate that these conversations always deviate to that realm of the subject.

Offline meepmeep

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #6 on: Thu, 07 June 2018, 17:06:48 »
Great idea on the surface, though in practice I presume it would be abused.

Offline xtrafrood

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #7 on: Thu, 07 June 2018, 17:22:47 »
It's hard for me to imagine a future in which the west is ok with such a non-profit. In my mind there would have to an exponential increase in the current amount of people struggling to survive in order for the numbers to make sense.

Please excuse my callousness; politics are not my forte.

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #8 on: Thu, 07 June 2018, 17:37:24 »
This is one of the problems in modern society, everyone wants to feel like they are helping. People need to be able to accept the reality that some folks are not wired for happiness, it's ****ed but that's the biological absolute for a lot of people. I hate that these conversations always deviate to that realm of the subject.

This is your perception.


There is no absolute happiness state.

The hedonic system is designed to evaluate a sine-like analog stimulus input.



You do x,  sine goes to 1,  you do h, sine goes to 0,  you do j, sine goes to -1.


The system is an input processor.  It does not dictate the GOAL, or at all DEFINE the purposeful state of being.



You are not designed to BE HAPPY.

You are designed to seek MEANS-to-continue-to-be-ALIVE.. the consequence of which, the hedonic processor may evaluate and reinforce as a (Pleasurable Experience)



Living in modernity,  This primitive programming stalls because very little needs to be done if the simple goal is TO LIVE..


So, the system de-syncs from its original purpose.



Now... The Pleasure response itself is the goal...  but humanity continued to flourish..

UNTIL we discovered things like alcohol, cocaine, and today meth..



After we've achieved total control over pleasure..

The ease of saturating our chemical pleasure circuitry leads to  Noisyturtle-Suicide-Mode..




Ultimately It's YOUR responsibility to extend humanity's goal even further... beyond personal lifespan, beyond personal pleasure..


Offline iri

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #9 on: Thu, 07 June 2018, 17:54:17 »
cool idea
(...)Whereas back then I wrote about the tyranny of the majority, today I'd combine that with the tyranny of the minorities. These days, you have to be careful of both. They both want to control you. The first group, by making you do the same thing over and over again. The second group is indicated by the letters I get from the Vassar girls who want me to put more women's lib in The Martian Chronicles, or from blacks who want more black people in Dandelion Wine.
I say to both bunches, Whether you're a majority or minority, bug off! To hell with anybody who wants to tell me what to write. Their society breaks down into subsections of minorities who then, in effect, burn books by banning them. All this political correctness that's rampant on campuses is b.s.

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Offline noisyturtle

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #10 on: Thu, 07 June 2018, 18:40:43 »
It's hard for me to imagine a future in which the west is ok with such a non-profit. In my mind there would have to an exponential increase in the current amount of people struggling to survive in order for the numbers to make sense.

Please excuse my callousness; politics are not my forte.

Well suicide rates are apparently up by around 30% in the US alone, I think this generation has difficulty living and accepting the current times. I am sure we can speculate all day on why gen x and y's are so unhappy, and it certainly seems to be a global feeling as rates are up in European countries and Japan.
https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/suicide-rates-are-30-percent-1999-cdc-says-n880926

Everyone spends so much energy in prevention, no one thinks about the other side of it.

Offline pixelpusher

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #11 on: Thu, 07 June 2018, 19:33:41 »
TP actually makes sense on this one.  I can’t solve my own problems so I certainly would not try to solve problems for others.  However, it makes sense that if we are always stimulated, satiated, generally doing well, the bar has been set high.  If happiness is measured relatively, that’s a problem

Offline xtrafrood

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #12 on: Thu, 07 June 2018, 19:37:59 »
It's hard for me to imagine a future in which the west is ok with such a non-profit. In my mind there would have to an exponential increase in the current amount of people struggling to survive in order for the numbers to make sense.

Please excuse my callousness; politics are not my forte.

Well suicide rates are apparently up by around 30% in the US alone, I think this generation has difficulty living and accepting the current times. I am sure we can speculate all day on why gen x and y's are so unhappy, and it certainly seems to be a global feeling as rates are up in European countries and Japan.
https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/suicide-rates-are-30-percent-1999-cdc-says-n880926

Everyone spends so much energy in prevention, no one thinks about the other side of it.

Up by 30% of what number? My point is that there are simply more people struggling day to day without the thought of suicide. The number of struggling people in the west would have to reach a tipping point to where there are assisted suicide centers (non-profits aren't cheap) rather than assisted suicide injections or pills. Holy moly. And all the monstrosities that could befall such a program. Gangs were very successful and very profitiable during the last great depression. Yikes.

Offline sinusoid

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #13 on: Fri, 08 June 2018, 13:56:37 »
Erm, this is kind of off-topic, but I'd like to argue that staying alive while having suicidal tendencies is actually beneficial to the species, and to the human condition. I know this sounds trivial, but bear with me here for a second.

First of all, as long as one exists, one will influence their surroundings, voluntarily or not. This increases the overall diversity of the system, because when units that "are not supposed to be alive" exist nevertheless, they generate variables that would otherwise not appear in the system, because they would disappear with the unit's self-extermination.

The ones that don't die and we get to hear about, usually dwell in the humanist arts. Artists, musicians, writers. Beksinsky is probably one of the more significant contemporary examples of that, and so was his son. Read up his bio, it's a miracle this dude was alive by his 40's without landing in a nuthouse from all the stress, both self imposed, and external (such as constant fear for the life of his son).
197610-0
Personally, I learned that I had several people like this in my surroundings that shaped my identity and personality. I'd be a totally different person without them, and I feel like there would be "less of me" without the influence of their uncommon outlook on reality. I do realize this is a purely egocentric approach, but, if, say, P.K.D ick [1] made it on the 23rd of March, 1972, we wouldn't get A Scanner Darkly. And he wouldn't get to meet Ridley Scott, and see the preliminary visuals and sfx shots for Bladerunner (which he liked a lot, and said it was exactly as he envisioned them)

Second of all, we are all mostly a product of our circumstances. Our upbringing and conditioning determines our future to a high degree. Our power to influence the world, our surroudings, and other people, or lack of thereof, is a result of many variables that we cannot change for the most part of our lives - like having rich or poor parents. We can, however, influence ourselves. In our species, the brains retain neuroplasticity throughout a significant portion of our lives. Neural networks are exceedingly good at adaptation to weird or uncommon circumstances. Constant suffering or unwillingness to exist, without malevolence towards the rest of the specie, from my observation, creates very interesting individuals. In b4 Harlan Ellison, I have no mouth and I must scream

Third of all, and this is from my own experience, we should avoid irreversible decisions, or minimize their impact. We're all really future-stupid, and most of our decisions, even the significant ones, are dictated by really trivial stuff - like our semantic layer, our expectations, and overall subjective interpretation of surrounding reality. Our suffering is largely subjective as well. Hell is just a frame of mind - know this one? It's from the 16th century. Christopher Marlowe, The Tragical History of the Life and Death of Doctor Faustus. In b4 Byron, in b4 Shakespeare, in b4 Poe. Seriously, people struggled with their own existence for centuries, it's nothing special, and you're not supposed to do anything about it. Keep calm, increase entropy, suffer till the end.

I'll end this with a quote from Lem:
for moral reasons ... the world appears to me to be put together in such a painful way that I prefer to believe that it was not created ... intentionally




[1] Seriously? You can't write D*ck without it getting starred out? SERIOUSLY?



edit:

You do x,  sine goes to 1,  you do h, sine goes to 0,  you do j, sine goes to -1.

I like this metaphor for some reason :3
« Last Edit: Fri, 08 June 2018, 14:04:18 by sinusoid »

Offline vivalarevolución

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #14 on: Fri, 08 June 2018, 14:39:25 »
This sounds like a great program to take advantage of by doing something cool and then changing your mind about the whole suicide thing.
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Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #15 on: Fri, 08 June 2018, 18:53:56 »
This sounds like a great program to take advantage of by doing something cool and then changing your mind about the whole suicide thing.
That'd be tke kicker you'd have to sign your life away beforehand.

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Offline suicidal_orange

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #16 on: Sat, 09 June 2018, 03:50:02 »
Great idea, not sure it's possible in stupid countries (those where suicide/euthanasia is illegal) though - anyone can sign up, take money, and do something fun but even if they have signed a contract saying they will kill themself and leave money to the organisation there's no way to enforce it.  Unless you made them sell themselves into human slavery doing the admin for the rest of their lives, but not sure that could be made legal either...
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Offline Coreda

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #17 on: Sat, 09 June 2018, 04:09:44 »
As a concept it's not hard to imagine something like this, though I'd expect it might be more popular to fundraise for people choosing euthanasia due to some debilitating physical condition than someone who suffered from depression and such, given people tend to want to save lives where possible (unless like viva suggested above it also functioned in a preventative capacity).

Offline noisyturtle

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #18 on: Sat, 09 June 2018, 08:05:25 »
I imagine applicants would undergo a psych evaluation, and an assessment whether or not they are a candidate for the program or if this is simply a passing emotion or fraud for them. On top of that perhaps some sort of smaller pre-donation to the program when submitting, upon rejection you would have most of that returned minus processing fees, but if accepted it would go towards your wish.

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #19 on: Sat, 09 June 2018, 08:19:15 »
TP actually makes sense on this one.  I can’t solve my own problems so I certainly would not try to solve problems for others.  However, it makes sense that if we are always stimulated, satiated, generally doing well, the bar has been set high.  If happiness is measured relatively, that’s a problem

Understanding how the system works is a very good place to start.

Humans generally chase emotional-highs.

Merely step back and recognize that --Highs-- are sensor responses designed to Annotate any REAL-LIFE action which --Historically (by evolutionary experience)-- has promoted Survival..


For example,

Tp4 posts on Gekhak..

Female Post Messages Tp4..

::" hai Tp4, u iz Super-Kewl, let's hang out..

Tp4 gets a mental boost, the dopa/deltafos circuit kicks in,  Tp4 systems analysis records Post m0ar, m0ar gets females..



This is just an example,  No single females have ever contacted Tp4, chairman of Gekhak #Ronery4ever association.

Offline duckboi

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #20 on: Sat, 09 June 2018, 08:22:13 »

This is especially true in today's developed societies where the Mind is perpetually satiated by non-ceasing stimulating experiences.

Cut back on that lifestyle, and the regulation system will return to normal.

This is going back a little bit but could you give an example on how to actually "cut back on that lifestyle"? It seems pretty hard to accomplish to me.
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #21 on: Sat, 09 June 2018, 08:56:35 »

This is especially true in today's developed societies where the Mind is perpetually satiated by non-ceasing stimulating experiences.

Cut back on that lifestyle, and the regulation system will return to normal.

This is going back a little bit but could you give an example on how to actually "cut back on that lifestyle"? It seems pretty hard to accomplish to me.

Absolutely..

It's a daunting task..

You wake up ,  Bacon $2,  Turn on the Computer, Nekkid females on every banner ad , You go outside,  females wearing Short-Shorts on rollerblades..


The simplest prescription for change would be a walk-back on pleasure seeking.

The Capitalists will always remark,

- Don't deprive yourself
- You're worth it
- Buy my stuff
- Just DO IT
- Do WHAT ?
- The Stuff that you'd do AFTER YOU BUY MY STUFF..
- Buy this stuff to DO more buying stuff.. (DLCs)



It's not all their fault, we are all complicit in our own demise.

It comes down to being mindful, and aware of how much desire and purpose is truly Internally-generated vs an Externally driven-Reactive force..

There's no one thing gone-awry, it's a little of everything culminating in 1 big Overstimulus.







Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #22 on: Sat, 09 June 2018, 09:18:20 »
So what if you get one person their death wish is to kill someone and then another's who is like whatever I just wanna die....boom....win win.

Future here we come.

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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Make-A-Wish/Non-profit for people planning suicide
« Reply #23 on: Sat, 09 June 2018, 11:34:35 »
So what if you get one person their death wish is to kill someone and then another's who is like whatever I just wanna die....boom....win win.

Future here we come.



Pretty sure that's already on dark-web ..