[Solved]

[Koelian]

*Solved*

[tp4tissue]

The swing from side to side that you're talking about is not a bad thing, because as a mechanical slider, if it doesn't swing at all, the key wouldn't move.

The swing is caused by clearance,   and generally MORE clearance means smoother key travel.







If you must have an inside the box keyboard representative of the ubiquity of submission to the regime of our time.

Then I'd recommend the coolermaster quickfire rapid, or equivalent corsair or rosewill v2.

[Koelian]

*Solved*

[ctm]

As far as I can tell, there is no version of that which comes with a number pad...

QuickFire XT has a numpad.

Also you might be interested in Unicomp. They are very reliable and key feel is great (clicky). They are also inexpensive. The downside though, is they only have 2-key rollover. Depending on what games you play, this might be a problem.

[Tactile]

You don't give a price range so I'm guessing. The Ducky One is one of the highest bang-per-buck keyboards around. Very good build quality and a very respected brand.

[Koelian]

*Solved*

[evenlock]

The XT is good, but I like Ducky One with ABS double shot/PBT (depends on version) + macro and profile on the fly. Filco are like tanks, they works after being in a washing machine  . Leopold, meka g1 are nice too.
Sometime there are nice discount or drop in the web (like the "old"6gv2 or rosewill rk9000 v2), where do you live? You can think also to buy a second hand keyboard...

[Koelian]

*Solved*

[evenlock]

oh Europe! A store called ccl in UK is selling the Rosewill at 40£. I've read something about usb connection problem with that keyboard, but maybe it has been fixed; but it's really good price damn! If you buy Just care about it and be soft ...

[jcc04]

oh Europe! A store called ccl in UK is selling the Rosewill at 40£. I've read something about usb connection problem with that keyboard, but maybe it has been fixed; but it's really good price damn! If you buy Just care about it and be soft ...

I would recommend checking out banggood or aliexpress since you wont get chewed out from the shipping cost, or check the classifieds and get a used board.

[Koelian]

*Solved*

[jcc04]

oh Europe! A store called ccl in UK is selling the Rosewill at 40£.

That's a really good price even with shipping but it's the UK layout, all the symbols are in the wrong place as far as my muscle memory is concerned.

If you buy Just care about it and be soft

You make it sound like it's particularly fragile, while I had the impression both this and the Quickfire are fairly hardy.
Not that anything particularly intense is going to happen them, they're just going to sit on a desk.

banggood or aliexpress

I'm not sure if I'm searching wrong, but neither seems to have it. It would be the UK layout anyway.

get a used board

Regardless of price, that doesn't sound like a good idea to me.
Why should I get something of dubious cleanliness and that is already worn down?

You probably wont find the quickfire on those sites but there are plenty of other boards on there which are of better quality and a better base to upgrade on.

Used isn't a terrible idea and I think a lot people go for a used board since mechanical boards hold up so well.

[Koelian]

*Solved*

[Targa-TV]

Sadly I'm in Italy where the prices are high, the wages low, disoccupation is at an all-time high and retirement has been abolished.

Non avrei potuto descrivere l'Italia meglio.
Anyway if you don't want to throw money for your first mech (as I did) I suggest looking into the used market. That means checking ebay at least every day for at least a few weeks, that's what I did.
If you don't want buckling spring, I saved this but it's cherry mx Red, not brown (which I don't recommend, but anyway).
Other than ebay you have the KeyCo in the UK, which has switches in spades, and Italian and blank layout. In Italian there is only the Filco, which is arguably one of the best out there but it's roughly 150€.
We of the ISO layout are an unlucky bunch, more so if you want the Italian layout, you can go custom or with group buys but it takes money and time. My suggestion is, even if it seems like a good mech with Italian layout doesn't exist right now just keep browsing, keep your max price in mind, and don't compromise. It's better off starting with the Italian layout straight from the box than looking for it later on.
Buona fortuna, tienici aggiornati!

[Targa-TV]

I don't like CM but Amazon warehousedeals offers a reasonable price here.
This cherry mx red Asus doesn't go very far above 100€.
As I said, GL.

[Koelian]

*Solved*

[Targa-TV]

Cherry MX switches are up for 50 million keystrokes. That's a LOT of strokes. A used mech is still a good mech, as long as the owner didn't spill anything on it and you can ask for pictures of the plate. Ok I had a lot of luck in purchasing a very lightly used Filco, it's totally unblemished, but I've read plenty of posts in here of people buying used old boards from ebay and being satisfied with their purchase.
I don't what the VAT (l'IVA) is in the US but I don't think it's fair to compare the American market to ours, it's a totally different world.
You didn't buy a switch tester? What if you buy a 104 keyboard and find the switch not to your liking?
I personally prefer linear switches (so far) because I'm a light typist. I noticed that I need to apply more pressure for the browns than the reds to pass the "bump". There's no bump in the linears, I just press the key and it registers on the screen and my fingers never tire out. Much better for long typing sessions imo.
But I'm new to the mech world myself. Reading stuff around I noticed that switch types are extremely subjective. That's why I recommend buying a tester first buying the whole board.
The keyboardco website was to link some of the most famous brands out there since there are so many, it was to list some of them so you can start browsing with those in mind. Or not, it's up to you.

[Koelian]

*Solved*

[TopreFan333]

I'm really not fond of used things.
If they're selling it, it means there's something wrong with it. Even if somehow it's fine, I'd still be shooting myself in the foot with one of the major benefits of mechanical, the durability will already be gimped.

Definitely not true. This isn't a used car lot, and just because someone gets rid of a keyboard, it really doesn't mean there's something "wrong" with it other than that the seller decided s/he just HAS to try _________ [potential "endgame" board]. Basically, there are people here doomed to a hell of never being satisfied with their keyboard, and you can profit off that

Also, I'm gonna hazard a guess and say that a goodly portion of the boards sold here have "low mileage" and have spent as much time being tweaked, photographed, sound recorded and posted about than used for intensive typing.

[Koelian]

*Solved*

[klennkellon]

You can get a Unicomp with an Italian layout.

http://www.pckeyboard.com/page/product/KBDCFG

The shipping to Italy will likely be somewhat expensive, but you get a new, buckling spring keyboard with great keycaps, with the layout you want. And from my experience Buckling Springs are less wobbly than Cherry MX switches.

[TopreFan333]

This isn't a used car lot

And that's a bad thing.

With a used car:
- I can judge the reason for selling it
- There are serious legal repercussions for lying about certain things (eg. tampering with the odometer)
- I know a bit about cars so I can make an informed decision
- I can test drive the car, I can accelerate and brake hard, I can make a few hard turns, I can go over bumps
- I know where the guy selling the car lives

With a used appliance on the internet:
- I have no means of verifying the reason the seller claims for getting rid of something supposedly good (if one is even given)
- There are minimal, if any, repercussions
- I know very little about keyboards
- I cannot test the keyboard
- There is no "physical" encouragement

I have not owned a single brand new car. Most of my immediate family also hasn't.
That's because I know how to pick a good used car and the one time tampering to mask an issue was uncovered, the law was on my side.

To be fair, all the successful used cars I bought were directly bought from the owner and the one time I got one from a lot, it was the one time I got burned with the tampering.

So don't buy a used keyboard, dude. Your loss. Nobody's gonna twist your arm. And honestly if that's your attitude I as a potential seller would not probably want to deal with you in the first place.

[Koelian]

*Solved*

[evenlock]

oh Europe! A store called ccl in UK is selling the Rosewill at 40£.

That's a really good price even with shipping but it's the UK layout, all the symbols are in the wrong place as far as my muscle memory is concerned.

If you buy Just care about it and be soft

You make it sound like it's particularly fragile, while I had the impression both this and the Quickfire are fairly hardy.
Not that anything particularly intense is going to happen them, they're just going to sit on a desk.

Well, Rosewill is solid and tanky keyboard, I was talking about the usb connector, not the entire keyboard. Anyway there are few people reported it, and you are in warranty for 1-2 years...and for 40pound is good price.

The Europe problem is language and layout. Forget ISO-IT and go for ANSI-US or ISO-UK (closer to your "main" layout). You can find and get keycaps too and you don't pay overpriced keyboard.

[klennkellon]

Yes. I'm such a horrible person for protecting myself from scammers and profiteers.
I should just blow the very limited resource that is cash and pray to button Jesus that I randomly picked the one used board that isn't garbage.

If you can't figure out why people that are not knowledgeable about a certain product should not venture into the used market for it, then I think you might have bigger issues that a poor person on the internet not wanting to listen to you.

Unicomp

For mostly gaming? I've looked around and people generally say two things:
1 - They are very good for typing
I don't do too much of it at home

2 - They are supposedly obscenely loud
I can't really tell what this actually means, they sound quite loud from videos but without a frame of reference and from microphones quite close to the buttons, I don't quite know what to make of that.
Is it something that gets zoned out by the brain once it gets used to it or is it a constant annoyance?
I saw one guy in particular mention he couldn't use it for gaming because the keyboard was so loud it could be heard clearly from beyond several walls.

Also, I saw a few videos mention they feel quite flimsy because they decided to not put the metal plate in them and just make them out of thin, creaky plastic.

And then there's the rollover issue where I'm not sure if it means "any two buttons" (which is quite bad) or "only very specific and uncommon 2 button combinations and essentially a 5/6 key rollover otherwise" (which I don't think I mind).

Buckling springs are loud, but it's a quite pleasant sound. Quite metallic and bassy. Unlike more common MX Blues which are high pitched, shrill, and plasticy. Whether it's annoying or not is up to the person.

The Unicomps have 2KRO. So this means some key combinations of more than 2 keys are not guaranteed to work. Really this isn't much of a problem unless you do some gaming where you need to press a lot of keys at once. Chances are your rubber dome you're upgrading from is 2KRO anyways.

Worth noting that these Unicomps are essentially modern versions of the IBM Model M. Here is a comparison of the two and a review of the Unicomp. Build quality is fine but the cases are quite creaky.

[Petch]

Do you really need the Italian layout? If it's the larger enter key alone, just swap to ANSI - it's a whole key closer to the home row, and the left shift is actually useable

[Koelian]

*Solved*

[TheRightHand]

Try this new online shop http://mechkeyboards.eu/

[Targa-TV]

Hello,
Did you take a look at Amazon.it?
It seems that troubles with the layout happen only if you buy from third parties, if buy the board from Amazon though there should be no problems. At least, the pictures show the Italian layout.
I'm referring to boards like this or this.
These have leds but you can switch them off.
I also thought about switching to ANSI because of the wider after market but then I was like "wtf if vendors can keep stock for the UK-DE-NO layouts I don't see why they can't keep the .ai files for the other 'minor' ISO layouts."
Do you know, a seller actually told me I had to provide the .ai file for the Italian layout myself, as if it were impossible to google it and download one. Crazy stuff.

[Koelian]

*Solved*

[klennkellon]

welp I give up.

[TalkingTree]

Forgive if I'm saying obvious or already voiced opinions, but I didn't bother to read the whole thread.
My two cents: If you're gonna try your very first mechanical keyboard, actually, anything will work.
Rubber domes can be so crappy that the worst mechanical keyboard would feel great in comparison.
Try some € 30 keyboard on Amazon or, better yet, try some local second hand stores such as subito.it.

EDIT: Ok, I read it whole, scrap the low budget and used ones. Koelian, can I ask you where in Italy you live?

[Koelian]

*Solved*

[klennkellon]

do you want people to help you or not

[TalkingTree]

As a very big fan of anonymity, that feels a little bit personal. Why do you ask?

Because I can arrange you a keyboard, not a fullsize one because I don't have it, but I have enough switches and PCBs for a 60%.