Author Topic: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?  (Read 34130 times)

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Offline Hyde

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Before I start I guess I'll have a little bit of introduction, my first mouse I ever used is a generic Logitech 2 button optical mouse that you can get for $5 from computer store.  Since then I've owned Logitech G5, Razer Naga, CM Storm Xornet.

I have also tried Razer Abyssus and Logitech G700 briefly.  But at work they have those generic HP mouse that look similar to this type of mouse:



Oddly enough I find I still like this shape the best, maybe because of my grip style or something (small hand + claw grip) but this makes me wonder why doesn't manufactures make gaming mouse with this shape?  I guess Zowie Mico is the only one that came to my mind but I heard huano switch sux also I think it's a bit hard to get Zowie gear in Canada so I haven't try it yet.  Though I do admit the only thing I miss is the back/forward buttons.  If only they can make something like this with a back/forward button then it would be awesome.

The only thing that I can think of that match the shape + back/forward button is probably Razer Copperhead or Razer Diamondback, and too bad they don't make them anymore :(

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Offline swagpiratex

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Are you just describing a Microsoft Intellimouse? That has a scroll wheel and side buttons. Don't they have that in the Intellimouse? It retains the basic shape. If that's the case, you can try out the SteelSeries Sensei.

Gaming mice were developed because they cater to a niche of users that prefer a specific grip. I don't think they bother with the general "non-gaming" populace  ;D

Offline akuJIWA

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http://img.alibaba.com/img/pb/139/797/289/289797139_651.jpg

Like this?

I still think IME 3.0 is the best mouse I've ever used even after using Steelseries Sensei.
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Offline Hyde

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I think I didn't try Intellimouse or Sensei cuz it's a bit big for my hand.  Otherwise for the longest time I was considering getting a Kana, I think in the end I opt out because it has crappy UPE mouse feet also I heard the click pressure was somewhat hard.

Though I do have 1 white microsoft basic optical (the one showned in the picture at the top) lying around the house maybe I should give it a try and see how it goes :P  It has native 1000 dpi it's a bit slow for my taste but it's not too bad I guess lol

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Offline akuJIWA

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1000 dpi is slow? I play with 450-600 dpi.... If you have small hand, try Kinzu?
« Last Edit: Sun, 26 August 2012, 11:05:57 by akuJIWA »
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Offline Hyde

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lol I play between the range of 1300-1600 DPI.  Though I have to say I'm pretty happy with my CM Storm Xornet right now, so I probably should save my money.  Though it's kinda like most people here we're always tempted to buy/try more mice/keyboards :P

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Offline Hyde

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Logitech G100

http://www.logitech.com/en-my/mice-pointers/mice/8397

Actually I just found out about this, I wonder when it's coming out.  Looks pretty promising except no back/forward button, but maybe Logitech realize they need something to compete against zowie mico / razer abyssus / steelseries kinzu lol

And OMG did you guys see the size of the teflon feet on that thing, Logitech is not holding back at all

EDIT:  Seems like it's been out already, I wonder if they're not bring it over to north america :(
« Last Edit: Sun, 26 August 2012, 16:00:39 by Hyde »

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Offline akuJIWA

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Logitech G100

http://www.logitech.com/en-my/mice-pointers/mice/8397

Actually I just found out about this, I wonder when it's coming out.  Looks pretty promising except no back/forward button, but maybe Logitech realize they need something to compete against zowie mico / razer abyssus / steelseries kinzu lol

And OMG did you guys see the size of the teflon feet on that thing, Logitech is not holding back at all

EDIT:  Seems like it's been out already, I wonder if they're not bring it over to north america :(

G100? Don't they have G400 already lol
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Offline swagpiratex

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That looks like a good size for your style of grip. I wonder what's the most comparable wired version that's available here in the US.

Offline sth

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yeah man you are ****ing nuts*, better check into a hospital. couldnt be possible that marketing hype fails to deliver when it comes to consumer disposable electronics like mice. no way, you are out of your goddamn mind.

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Offline NewbieOneKenobi

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Re: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?
« Reply #10 on: Fri, 07 September 2012, 18:24:27 »
You're absolutely not crazy. Office mice are not necessarily worse than gaming mice. There's typically less DPI, fewer buttons, not so much stuff to set up in the drivers. Basic Logitechs and A4techs are lovely except for the dpi and I'm really wondering if I wouldn't be better off just getting an old cheapest A4tech like I'm used to (the old basic 3-button non-ergo shape) and just giving up 1:1 (would need to crank up the sensitivity in Windows). This said, Omron switches are good to have.
« Last Edit: Fri, 07 September 2012, 18:26:32 by NewbieOneKenobi »

Offline Hyde

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Re: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?
« Reply #11 on: Fri, 07 September 2012, 19:36:02 »
I'm waiting on the new CM Storm Recon, hopefully it will be close enough in size and shape.  But from the pictures I've seen it looks a bit bigger than how I liked, I guess I'll find out when it's finally released.

Otherwise the old Logitech G3 seems like a good option too, too bad the new G300 just failed bad in shape.  It's like whyyyyy Logitech whyyyyyyyy

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Offline rowdy

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Re: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?
« Reply #12 on: Sat, 08 September 2012, 05:53:12 »
That Microsoft mouse is exactly the model I am using at the moment.  I have tried a few other mouses, but settled on this one as the scroll wheel works, it is not too heavy, glides well over my desk, and although I have slightly larger hands it still seems to fit fairly well into my hand.
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Offline Velma

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Re: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?
« Reply #13 on: Wed, 12 September 2012, 18:20:30 »
try Zowie AM


you dont have to worry about the dual-side buttons because they added it just to make sure it would be usable by both left and right handed people, you can disable to buttons on either side.
« Last Edit: Wed, 12 September 2012, 18:22:56 by Velma »

Offline munch

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Re: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?
« Reply #14 on: Wed, 12 September 2012, 23:35:37 »
AM is a bit too big compared to those. The steelseries Kinzu V2 Pro is probably your best bet, although the sensor isn't the best it is still miles better than the ones you mentioned in the original post.
really good button quality and nice scroll wheel.

Offline Burz

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Re: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?
« Reply #15 on: Thu, 13 September 2012, 02:14:26 »
I like my cheap Gear Head LM6000U laser mouse ( was $12 at Microcenter). It has 1600dpi, fast and accurate response and decent buttons/mousewheel. I actually prefer it to my Logitech Anywhere MX, which has an odd scrollwheel and 800dpi.

It doesn't always 'work' however: If I am switching from one computer to another, I have to keep the GH unplugged for 5-7 seconds before plugging back in or else it won't work.

It's less bean-shaped than the Intellimouse, but its close and just big enough to feel nice in my palm.

Now I need to get a TKL or compact keyboard to make reaching for the mouse less of a pain.
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Offline Saturn

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Re: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?
« Reply #16 on: Mon, 17 September 2012, 21:51:39 »
To me, the most perfectly shaped mouse of all time was the MS Intellimouse Optical.  Ambidextrous, not too big or too small.  Fit my hand just perfectly (both hands, actually).

I think the Steelseries xai and sensei use a nearly identical shape, but I don't like the +5% acceleration built into the sensor or the unnecessary features.

Offline ra7c7er

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Re: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?
« Reply #17 on: Tue, 18 September 2012, 08:33:42 »
Best shape is subjective so no it's not crazy but then again it won't be the best shape for everyone.

Offline xorpher

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Re: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?
« Reply #18 on: Tue, 18 September 2012, 08:39:30 »
Logitech MX510 is my favorite mouse, though I'm sure it's successors are even better.
My current MX has lasted about 6 years, so I can attest to its quality as well.

It's the perfect shape for my hand to rest perfectly atop. And I find having the two thumb buttons a massive
help while browsing the internet as well as in some games, though for gaming I have started using the
Naos 3200 due to it's better optical performance and variable DPI.

But in terms of comfort, I find the Logitech MX mice cannot be beat.

Offline raisinbun

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Re: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?
« Reply #19 on: Tue, 18 September 2012, 21:49:44 »
Logitech MX510 is my favorite mouse, though I'm sure it's successors are even better.
My current MX has lasted about 6 years, so I can attest to its quality as well.

It's the perfect shape for my hand to rest perfectly atop. And I find having the two thumb buttons a massive
help while browsing the internet as well as in some games, though for gaming I have started using the
Naos 3200 due to it's better optical performance and variable DPI.

But in terms of comfort, I find the Logitech MX mice cannot be beat.

You should have looked at G400 instead :rolleyes:

Offline Internauta

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Re: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?
« Reply #20 on: Sat, 22 September 2012, 00:03:53 »
I think the Steelseries xai and sensei use a nearly identical shape, but I don't like the +5% acceleration built into the sensor or the unnecessary features.
Those features can all be turned off using their Steelseries Engine software.
I love my Steelseries Sensei, and the on-board profiles and logos are a really nice touch.

Offline snooze2looze

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Re: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?
« Reply #21 on: Sat, 22 September 2012, 12:52:18 »
Yes you are crazy.

MX518.

Offline keyb_gr

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I actually think that the old MS Mouse 2.0 wasn't a bad design at all. Sure it's not ambidextrous, has no scroll wheel and is mechanical - but the shape itself is pretty good assuming right-handed use. We have a stash of those in the server (/ computer crap storage) room @work, typically yellowed badly but presumably functional. I may have to grab one next time I'm there. Modding some modern innards into one of these might be interesting...

In general I never had much of a problem with old, comparatively flat mice. The Intellimouse Optical 1.1 proved a little too high and bulbous.

BTW, what do people think of Fujitsu M480/500T (K431/426) mice? I got a K431 with my PC at work, not a bad shape at all and runs like crazy on big teflon feet. Seems like one doesn't go broke buying one either.
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Offline Internetlad

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Honestly, no. Not because I don't think it does, but because everybody has different hands. The best shape for you won't be the best shape for me. Hell between the basic differences in hand sizes and finger length, some people prefer the "claw" grip and some prefer the "finger extended" grip.

I met a lady who, I **** you now, could NOT use a mouse unless it was flipped upside down so the buttons were facing TOWARDS her. WTF right?
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Offline modulor

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I used a standard Microsoft Intellimouse Optical 1.1 as my primary for a long time and loved it, but I find ambidextrous mice a bit uncomfortable for regular use.  A previous employer had upgraded their desktop systems back in 06' and got a bunch of MX518, so I acquired one and used it for about 3 years.  I upgraded from that to the Microsoft Intellimouse Explorer 3.0, and found it to be much more comfortable for my hand, and as solid (if not more so) than the MX518.  The larger shape is definitely ideal for my hand size and palm grip, and I now use it at work since my last home mouse upgrade a year ago, a DeathAdder 3.5. 

As much as I dislike most of Razers products, I've really enjoyed the DA 3.5 so far.  It has a great sensor and is similar enough in shape to the MIE 3.0 to be a decent successor, as I was looking for something with higher DPI options.

Offline NKRO

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I think back in the days when mice were relatively new and still seeing active development on the fundamentals, companies like Microsoft and Logitech probably devoted a lot more resources to the ergonomics and design of their mice. These days, most people either use their laptop trackpad, whatever is supplied with their system, whatever is cheapest and available locally, or they are gamers. Gamers are the only group willing to spend real money on a mouse, so they are focused on aesthetics over ergonomics.

These days, it seems like they are trying to come out with newer designs with flashy LEDs, the highest DPI numbers possible, or slick marketing campaigns rather than focusing on what actually matters.

Offline Internetlad

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Other than one of the quick key buttons on the side breaking (I assume a plastic tab came out of place or broke because the unit basically fell inside the mouse and will only function if you press the very bottom of it where it still sticks out) I've had no issues with my deathadder.

I don't care much since there is a second button right beside it that I now use as my talk key, but still that's pretty frickin shoddy for a 50 dollar product. That said I was probably bashing it with my thumb like a madman.

Unicomp needs to make a mouse made of heavy plastic, metal and buckling spring buttons.

Gamers are the only group willing to spend real money on a mouse, so they are focused on aesthetics over ergonomics.

A very broad statement, and one I disagree with. As a gamer I very much consider the ergonomics of the size, weight and form of my input products, and people who play professionally would literally be shorting themselves to not consider buying a product suited towards their body (see my prevous post)

I'm sure there are scrubs that crap their pants when they see an LCD on the top or side of their mouse, but they're the same people who go crazy for cold cathode interal glow, windowed cases, LED underglow for their mazdas and what word Apple can make up for an existing technology this week. (RETINA DISPLAY. . . You mean IPS?)

/rant
« Last Edit: Mon, 01 October 2012, 16:19:04 by Internetlad »
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Offline NKRO

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A very broad statement, and one I disagree with. As a gamer I very much consider the ergonomics of the size, weight and form of my input products, and people who play professionally would literally be shorting themselves to not consider buying a product suited towards their body (see my prevous post)

I'm sure there are scrubs that crap their pants when they see an LCD on the top or side of their mouse, but they're the same people who go crazy for cold cathode interal glow, windowed cases, LED underglow for their mazdas and what word Apple can make up for an existing technology this week. (RETINA DISPLAY. . . You mean IPS?)

/rant
Yes, but people that hang about on keyboard forums are not the mass-market gamer audience most gaming mice are targetted at. Mice like the Razer DeathAdder, Roccat Savu, Logitech G400 etc. that use "perfect" sensors are low-end or mid-tier gaming mice. The "best" mice are all wireless laser mice with 5000+ DPI (anything over 1600 is worthless) covered in LEDs and all sorts of other things to try and sell a "premium" product, with the design mostly intended to look impressive rather than being focused on ergonomics first.

And FYI, "Retina Display" is not just about using an IPS panel, it is about pixel density, such as having 2880x1800 on a 15" display rather than the standard 1440x900/1680x1050 panels regular laptops have and color accuracy. (most "retina displays" are 100% sRGB with accurate gamma and near 6500K white balance)

Offline tcv

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I like the Intellimouse but after using Razer and Logitech products, I've learned that logitech makes the best mice.

Razer mice have the glossy feel and are very shiny. I prefer logitech. Their feel is great and they're made for performance, not for looks.

Offline Hyde

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Yeah I kind of realize that after I used my work's cheapo $5 HP mouse, it's actually exactly the same shell / shape as the logitech basic mouse.  I brought my das keyboard to work but I didn't bother to change the mouse because those are actually super comfortable to use.  It's a shame that gaming companies doesn't realize the basics of ergonomics anymore.

I'm currently waiting on the CM Storm Recon because I believe it should have the closest size and shape to what I'll like.  (I have small hand and use claw grip btw)

I'll keep you guys updated if I end up getting one :D

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Offline phetto

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"Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?"

You certainly are not crazy. They are much better for me when i play fps games.
I have a theory.
If you have a mouse that fits your hand like a glove, you wont have the same reflexes etc, because you tend to relax more.
If you have a mouse that isnt, a mouse similar to Microsoft basic, intellimouse 1.1 etc, you are not very relaxed in your hand, and therefore much more focused..

I think you get the picture. Anyone else had any thoughts to this? :P:P

Offline Hyde

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LOL I'm not sure about that theory, but I'm glad someone from overclock.net thinks the same :P

http://www.overclock.net/t/1311046/mice-with-similar-design-as-hp-mouse

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Offline phetto

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My previous fav mouse was the razer diamondback and razer krait.
2bad the sensor is outdated :(

Have one NIB :P

Offline thegunner100

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I've been using my logitech G5v2 for at least  4-5 years now. Perfect size for claw grip, and the recessed space for the thumb fits nicely. The two thumb buttons are also very nicely placed for access, though I rarely ever use them now.

I leave mine at 1600 DPI all the time on a 22.5(school) and 23.5(home) monitor. Wish they kept the G5 design, the G500 isn't quite as good imo.
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Offline Hyde

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I had a G5 before but I find the button clicks too hard, maybe because my hand is small so I was forced to press it further back (where it requires more force).  But I can imagine it would be good for people with bigger hands.

Though I also pick up my mouse a lot so I don't like mouse with "butt" that angled downward into the table.  Example:  All SteelSeries mice, Razer DeathAdder / Mamba / Taipan, Logitech G400 / G500, Microsoft Intelli Mouse ... etc

In my opinion those feel more like a palm mouse than claw/fingertip.

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Offline tp4tissue

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Does anyone know where I can get a Logitech G100, the New version?

Never mind, found it, $30 kinda steep.  :))


Offline phetto

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Does anyone know where I can get a Logitech G100, the New version?

You can buy it as a package with a crappy keyboard on most sites. Dont you have pricerunner? :P :P

Offline The_Beast

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I've been using my Mx518 for around 6-7 years and it's been "replaced" with a G500. By "replaced" I mean it's still on my desktop but it's now in a more of a backup kinda role. I'm really loving the free-scroll on the G500 and the third thumb button.
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Offline tp4tissue

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I've been using my Mx518 for around 6-7 years and it's been "replaced" with a G500. By "replaced" I mean it's still on my desktop but it's now in a more of a backup kinda role. I'm really loving the free-scroll on the G500 and the third thumb button.

Every time you use the g500 from now on, You'll be thinking, argg. this thing has acceleration...

Offline The_Beast

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I've been using my Mx518 for around 6-7 years and it's been "replaced" with a G500. By "replaced" I mean it's still on my desktop but it's now in a more of a backup kinda role. I'm really loving the free-scroll on the G500 and the third thumb button.

Every time you use the g500 from now on, You'll be thinking, argg. this thing has acceleration...

It was jarring at first but I turned it off for the most part.
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Offline tp4tissue

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I've been using my Mx518 for around 6-7 years and it's been "replaced" with a G500. By "replaced" I mean it's still on my desktop but it's now in a more of a backup kinda role. I'm really loving the free-scroll on the G500 and the third thumb button.

Every time you use the g500 from now on, You'll be thinking, argg. this thing has acceleration...

It was jarring at first but I turned it off for the most part.

How did you do this, I thought it was an inherent attribute of the sensor?

Offline davkol

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« Last Edit: Mon, 10 December 2018, 15:05:38 by davkol »

Offline fohat.digs

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I will agree with you, and I think my Microsoft mouse is older than yours and wider at the back.

Since going left-handed for desktop mousing, I gave up on anything but symmetrical mice, since I never know how the laptop will sit.

I have big hands, and use extended fingers. I also pick the mouse up quite often, so it must be easily gripped for that. Probably for that reason, side buttons have never appealed to me, and I never game.

When I alternate, after some days, weeks, or months, I almost always like the change.

"Boy this skinny Logitech is light and easy."

or

"The big bottom on this Microsoft makes it easy to push around."

I have at least 2 or 3 of each of these mice, when I see one in good condition at a yard sale or salvage store, I pick it up.
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Offline mattrm

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Personally, I've always liked the Microsoft Intellimouse shape the most.  They don't seem to make them any more and the newer models aren't the same size.  Ought to buy a few more while you can still get hold of them incase my current one breaks.

Offline TheQsanity

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Some of the cheap dell ones are nice cant find the model number but it is called a stock mouse I think.
https://www.google.com/shopping/product/5600970899811455762?q=dell%20mouse&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&channel=fflb&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.r_qf.&fp=9108080408047c79&bpcl=35243188&biw=925&bih=918&tch=1&ech=1&psi=XRF1UNC-PNSuqwHJ8YGYBQ.1349849433349.3&sa=X&ei=bhF1UOOvLujO2gXIrIH4Dw&ved=0CI0BEOUNMAE

Razer has the Deathadder, Abyssus, Salmosa, Salmosa Korean edition.(That was in order from size large to small)

Logitech maybe the best though.

On Logitech's higher end they have a nice Palm-grip mouse that is quite similar to the intelle-mouse. Performance MX(it is wireless)
« Last Edit: Wed, 10 October 2012, 01:18:23 by TheQsanity »
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Offline keyb_gr

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I finally scored a PS/2 Intellimouse 1.3A from The Stack(R). This one appears to have seen a fair bit of use and is crying out for a Retr0brite job, but after a little cleanup it's working just fine. About 10 years old by the looks of it, possibly acquired with P4/SDRAM machines (the last ones of which have been retired from active service recently). Datasheet says 400 ppi, and in fact it runs about as fast as my 400dpi opticals (if obviously a bit less smoothly). Last datasheet revision was in 2006... so those must have been among the last mechanicals sold.

Now that's a bit of a different grip compared to the Intellimouse Optical 1.1A or the Logitech M-BJ69. Compared to those, your hand sits a bit further back, and your fingertips are approximately in the middle of the keys rather than near the front edge. Clicks require a bit more force than on those newer rodents (less leverage). However, using the scroll wheel is a breeze. It has fewer clicks per revolution, but turns very lightly and never requires any contortions whatsoever. By contrast, the wheel on the Intelli Optical 1.1A seems impossibly high at times (partly because it does in fact rise above the keys a fair bit more, no doubt).

It appears that when the fingertips moved to the front edge, they forgot to shift the scroll wheel as well... or more likely, it just wasn't doable mechanically. Hence why scroll wheel ergonomics became a bit of a fail. Granted, the lil' Logitech isn't much worse than the MS oldie if you hold it the right way, but still, isn't that interesting?

JFTR, I don't exactly have small hands... fairly long fingers, in fact.
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Offline chaumeow

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I don't pick up my mouse like you do, but at least the Logitech/Microsoft $10-$15 mouse are better than the $49 Mac Mouse.
I wonder if Logitech is being overlooked due the rising popularity of Razer...
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Offline deegaf

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Re: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?
« Reply #47 on: Thu, 29 November 2012, 17:10:56 »
I prefer Logitech mice over Razer or Microsoft.  It just feels better.  I have small girl hands and Logitech makes tons of those. I wanna try some Senseis though.

Offline Hyde

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Re: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?
« Reply #48 on: Thu, 29 November 2012, 22:04:03 »
I prefer Logitech mice over Razer or Microsoft.  It just feels better.  I have small girl hands and Logitech makes tons of those. I wanna try some Senseis though.

I thought about trying Sensei but I think it might be too big.  It's the largest SteelSeries mice.

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Offline deegaf

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Re: Am I crazy to think the basic Logitech / Microsoft mouse has the best shape?
« Reply #49 on: Fri, 30 November 2012, 05:35:08 »
I thought about trying Sensei but I think it might be too big.  It's the largest SteelSeries mice.
[/quote]

Ah, good to know. I've seen a couple of video reviews, but it's still kind of hard to see the size that way without actually trying it in person. 

Before I was into keyboards, I was into mice, and I've bought and returned so many mice it's not even funny... hahaha