Author Topic: Questions About Mechanical Keyboards  (Read 3883 times)

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Offline dragonxx21

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Questions About Mechanical Keyboards
« on: Fri, 30 August 2013, 16:22:54 »
Hey there, I've recently been looking into getting a mechanical keyboard for my laptop, as I mostly use it at home, and am an avid gamer, and think that getting a mechanical keyboard would make gaming and typing a little better. So I guess my first question would have to be: Is it worth it to get a keyboard, knowing that I'm going to be using it on a laptop? My second question would be: For gaming, I've narrowed my choices down to three types of switches that pique my interest, brown, red, and black. From the (limited) research I've done, I've read that black and red seem to be more geared towards gaming, and less towards typing, and browns are somewhere in the middle, with black having a little more resistance than red. What type of switch would be better, or is it simply a matter of preference? Also, I live in Canada, so my options are a little more restricted, as I don't get access/have very limited access to American stores. Ex. Amazon listings either don't ship to Canada, or have incredibly expensive shipping fees. Luckily, I have found out about NCIX (though don't know how good they are), and they are based in a city that's a few hours away from me, so shipping fees aren't a problem, and they have quite the selection of keyboards. I've looked through the recommended keyboards and NCIX has the Ducky Shine II, Filco Majestouch 2, and the CM Storm Quick fire. The Ducky Shine II is actually quite around my price range, with the TKL version only being around $100~$120 with the Filco going for around $140~$150 . How good is the Ducky Shine II, and how hard is it to get used to the TKL format, being a full size user my whole life? Also, with the Ducky Shine 3 currently on preorder, would it be a good idea to wait for that? That's about it for my questions for now, thanks if you've read this far, and are willing to answer some of my questions.

Links:
Ducky Shine II Red Switches TKL - http://ncix.ca/products/?sku=82604&vpn=DK9087S2-RUSALP&manufacture=Ducky&promoid=1360

Filco Majestouch 2 Red Switches Full Size - http://ncix.ca/products/?sku=70719&vpn=FKBN104MRL%2FEB2&manufacture=Filco

Ducky Zero Shine DK2108S Full Size - http://ncix.ca/products/?sku=82591&vpn=DK2108S-RUSALT&manufacture=Ducky&promoid=1190

CM Storm Quickfire - http://ncix.ca/products/?sku=77975&vpn=SGK-4020GKCR1&manufacture=COOLERMASTER
Keyboards Owned:

Realforce Topre 91 Key JIS Profile - Main
CM Quickfire Rapid Blue Switches
IBM Model M in Industrial Shell

Offline divito

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  • Location: Ontario, Canada
Re: Questions About Mechanical Keyboards
« Reply #1 on: Fri, 30 August 2013, 16:43:02 »
So I guess my first question would have to be: Is it worth it to get a keyboard, knowing that I'm going to be using it on a laptop?

It's always worth it if you want a good computing experience, with something that will last a long time. On top of that, moving to a new laptop, or desktop, the keyboard can easily stay part of the equation.

My second question would be: For gaming, I've narrowed my choices down to three types of switches that pique my interest, brown, red, and black. From the (limited) research I've done, I've read that black and red seem to be more geared towards gaming, and less towards typing, and browns are somewhere in the middle, with black having a little more resistance than red. What type of switch would be better, or is it simply a matter of preference?

The "gaming switches," as you've discovered, tend to be the red and black variety, with black having a stiffer spring. It really does come down to preference though. While I type a lot, I game a lot too, and rather than go with a linear switch (red and black), or even brown, I love the feel, sound, and general nature of blues, and use those with no trouble in any games I play. 

Also, I live in Canada, so my options are a little more restricted, as I don't get access/have very limited access to American stores. Ex. Amazon listings either don't ship to Canada, or have incredibly expensive shipping fees. Luckily, I have found out about NCIX (though don't know how good they are), and they are based in a city that's a few hours away from me, so shipping fees aren't a problem, and they have quite the selection of keyboards.

I'll assume that you're in BC then based on your NCIX comment? Though they do now have GTA locations. NCIX was my go-to computer parts retailer until recently. I always used them because they didn't charge PST and with express shipping, I could usually save money. Those days are kind of past though, and I simply use the local Canada Computers to pick up my stuff.

If it is at all possible, I'd try making the 'few hours' trip to one of their stores to try out some of their keyboards because it'd go a long way to helping you make a selection.

I've looked through the recommended keyboards and NCIX has the Ducky Shine II, Filco Majestouch 2, and the CM Storm Quick fire. The Ducky Shine II is actually quite around my price range, with the TKL version only being around $100~$120 with the Filco going for around $140~$150 . How good is the Ducky Shine II, and how hard is it to get used to the TKL format, being a full size user my whole life? Also, with the Ducky Shine 3 currently on preorder, would it be a good idea to wait for that? That's about it for my questions for now, thanks if you've read this far, and are willing to answer some of my questions.

Personally haven't used a TKL as a daily driver, so I can't comment on that. I use the Num Pad fairly often, but as long as I have my 6-key and arrow keys, I think I'll be okay.

As for the difference between the Shine 2 and 3 is reportedly only in regards to some of the lighting functions and "superfluous" features, as forum-goers have mentioned; so waiting isn't really necessary unless that's your thing.

I'm still pretty new overall to the scene, but I hope I could help a bit. Everyone else here is super helpful so you should be alright.
Varmilo (MX Grey) KeyCool 87 (MX Clear) Quickfire Stealth (MX Green)

Offline abdulmuhsee

  • Posts: 196
Re: Questions About Mechanical Keyboards
« Reply #2 on: Fri, 30 August 2013, 16:58:52 »
Hey there, I've recently been looking into getting a mechanical keyboard for my laptop, as I mostly use it at home...

Quote
...and how hard is it to get used to the TKL format, being a full size user my whole life?

I haven't seen a laptop yet with a full size keyboard, so if you have no problem using your laptop keyboard, then you shouldn't have any problem using a TKL keyboard.  Most are actually a bit bigger than laptop keyboards since the arrow keys remain in the same place as a full sizer instead of being squeezed in near the shift and enter keys. 

As long as you don't use the numpad, then there really isn't any adjusting that you need to do; it's all about whether or not you need the extra 4-6 inches of space (or the numpad of course).

To me, I'd think it would be somewhat awkward to plug a separate keyboard into your laptop, and mechanical keyboards will not make you better at games and most likely will not increase your typing speed.  It's all about whether or not you like the idea of experiencing a different or better feeling from the keyboard or the idea of a longer cycle life.

Offline dragonxx21

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Re: Questions About Mechanical Keyboards
« Reply #3 on: Fri, 30 August 2013, 17:09:05 »
The "gaming switches," as you've discovered, tend to be the red and black variety, with black having a stiffer spring. It really does come down to preference though. While I type a lot, I game a lot too, and rather than go with a linear switch (red and black), or even brown, I love the feel, sound, and general nature of blues, and use those with no trouble in any games I play. 

Blues would definitely be an option, and I would enjoy typing so much, if it weren't for the fact that I generally play during the later hours of the day, and people in my household probably wouldn't be too happy to hear me tapping on my keyboard in the middle of the night.

I'll assume that you're in BC then based on your NCIX comment? Though they do now have GTA locations. NCIX was my go-to computer parts retailer until recently. I always used them because they didn't charge PST and with express shipping, I could usually save money. Those days are kind of past though, and I simply use the local Canada Computers to pick up my stuff.

If it is at all possible, I'd try making the 'few hours' trip to one of their stores to try out some of their keyboards because it'd go a long way to helping you make a selection.

I probably can't make the trip to one of their stores, one of the downsides of living on an island. The cost of taking a car onto a ferry to head to the mainland is quite pricy, and I'm not a fan of long distance public transit. Although, there are a few local computer stores here that do sell mechanical keyboards (just not with the same variety as NCIX) so I can probably head there and try out some of their selection. It would help with finding appropriate switches at least.


Personally haven't used a TKL as a daily driver, so I can't comment on that. I use the Num Pad fairly often, but as long as I have my 6-key and arrow keys, I think I'll be okay.

As for the difference between the Shine 2 and 3 is reportedly only in regards to some of the lighting functions and "superfluous" features, as forum-goers have mentioned; so waiting isn't really necessary unless that's your thing.

I'm still pretty new overall to the scene, but I hope I could help a bit. Everyone else here is super helpful so you should be alright.
Quote

Yeah, the numpad is about the biggest concern I have with getting a TKL, as it seems that it would take a while to getting used to not having the numpad there. With the Shine 3 going for around $30~$50 more than the Shine 2, I think I might as well just go with the Shine 2 since it all seems to be aesthetics (I only want the purple backlight anyway :P). Any help is good help, thanks a lot for your feedback, it has helped a lot.


I haven't seen a laptop yet with a full size keyboard, so if you have no problem using your laptop keyboard, then you shouldn't have any problem using a TKL keyboard.  Most are actually a bit bigger than laptop keyboards since the arrow keys remain in the same place as a full sizer instead of being squeezed in near the shift and enter keys. 

As long as you don't use the numpad, then there really isn't any adjusting that you need to do; it's all about whether or not you need the extra 4-6 inches of space (or the numpad of course).

To me, I'd think it would be somewhat awkward to plug a separate keyboard into your laptop, and mechanical keyboards will not make you better at games and most likely will not increase your typing speed.  It's all about whether or not you like the idea of experiencing a different or better feeling from the keyboard or the idea of a longer cycle life.

What I basically mean is the full size layout, not necessarily the size. I do use the numpad quite often, so that is mostly the reason for me asking. Also, I should rephrase what I meant. By making my gaming and typing a little better, I meant a bit more enjoyable. After gaming for a while my hands tend to tense up a bit, and I think that getting a mechanical keyboard with less resistance might help that a little bit.
Keyboards Owned:

Realforce Topre 91 Key JIS Profile - Main
CM Quickfire Rapid Blue Switches
IBM Model M in Industrial Shell

Online tp4tissue

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Re: Questions About Mechanical Keyboards
« Reply #4 on: Fri, 30 August 2013, 17:10:33 »
Mmm...

well let me tell you a story...   

dragonxx21 buys his first mechanical keyboard.

Eventually

dragonnxx21 buys an Ergodox

dragonnxx21 never buys another keyboard

Ergodox 2 comes out

dragonnxx21 buys the Ergodox 2


Offline dragonxx21

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Re: Questions About Mechanical Keyboards
« Reply #5 on: Fri, 30 August 2013, 17:16:21 »
Mmm...

well let me tell you a story...   

dragonxx21 buys his first mechanical keyboard.

Eventually

dragonnxx21 buys an Ergodox

dragonnxx21 never buys another keyboard

Ergodox 2 comes out

dragonnxx21 buys the Ergodox 2

I just looked up the Ergodox and it both intrigues me and confuses me at the same time.

Edit: After looking at the Ergodox for a while, are DIY boards any good? Like, maybe not one like the Ergodox (which is way too much for me right now), but a cheaper one.
« Last Edit: Sat, 31 August 2013, 01:35:22 by dragonxx21 »
Keyboards Owned:

Realforce Topre 91 Key JIS Profile - Main
CM Quickfire Rapid Blue Switches
IBM Model M in Industrial Shell

Offline abdulmuhsee

  • Posts: 196
Re: Questions About Mechanical Keyboards
« Reply #6 on: Sat, 31 August 2013, 10:38:53 »
By making my gaming and typing a little better, I meant a bit more enjoyable. After gaming for a while my hands tend to tense up a bit, and I think that getting a mechanical keyboard with less resistance might help that a little bit.

You could also take a look at Ripster's actuation force chart; for the Cherry switches here, it looks like reds, blues, browns, and blacks have the lowest resistance, and you can see which is clicky, tactile, and linear.  Reds would behave somewhat like a rubber dome, being linear, but have noticeably less actuation force.



To give you an idea of what the numbers mean, I'm using a switch with about 70g actuation force, and a rubber dome keyboard feels, to me, to be somewhere around 60-65g compared to it.  A laptop key feels noticeably lighter than that.  I don't know the exact numbers, but that's my subjective experience.  If you'd like something that has less resistance than a rubber dome, then I'd go with something at 55g or less.

Offline daerid

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Re: Questions About Mechanical Keyboards
« Reply #7 on: Sat, 31 August 2013, 10:40:18 »
"ErgoDox 2" doesn't even make sense.

If anything, it'd be AcidFire's Nexus.

Offline dragonxx21

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Re: Questions About Mechanical Keyboards
« Reply #8 on: Sat, 31 August 2013, 15:26:44 »

You could also take a look at Ripster's actuation force chart; for the Cherry switches here, it looks like reds, blues, browns, and blacks have the lowest resistance, and you can see which is clicky, tactile, and linear.  Reds would behave somewhat like a rubber dome, being linear, but have noticeably less actuation force.

Show Image


To give you an idea of what the numbers mean, I'm using a switch with about 70g actuation force, and a rubber dome keyboard feels, to me, to be somewhere around 60-65g compared to it.  A laptop key feels noticeably lighter than that.  I don't know the exact numbers, but that's my subjective experience.  If you'd like something that has less resistance than a rubber dome, then I'd go with something at 55g or less.

Thanks a lot for this. I think I'll go with the red switches because black is too close to rubber dome and I can't go with tactile switches.

Edit: To the person who tipped me off about the ErgoDox... I officially hate you, because I am extreme tempted to buy it, even though it's about $70 over my ideal budget, and would require a ton of time to assemble it. I really love assembling things, but I'm a little too afraid of screwing things up (last time I soldered something was probably close to 5 years ago in a middle school tech class).
« Last Edit: Sat, 31 August 2013, 23:33:20 by dragonxx21 »
Keyboards Owned:

Realforce Topre 91 Key JIS Profile - Main
CM Quickfire Rapid Blue Switches
IBM Model M in Industrial Shell