Ideal Space Gap

[Vladimir]

I wanna know what is the minimum space needed between the clusters.
I've got the impression that 0.25u is not enough.
You could think about the space between the "main" letter cluster and the Function row, for example.
But this is actually the case:

0.25u


0.50u


In others words, the 0.25u would be too close? It would interfere or be uncomfortable?
Or even provoke misclick?

[xondat]

I think .25u is fine.

In between F4 and F5 is .5u, and F12 and Print Screen is .25u. Having caps on makes it look fine. I don't think I'd be hitting the wrong key or something.

[Vladimir]

If you think 0.25u is enough, why keep 0.50u  between F4 and F5?

[tp4tissue]

ideally there shouldn't be a gap..

It's simply not necessary..

[AMongoose]

ideally there shouldn't be a gap..

It's simply not necessary..

I really miss the gaps when using my laptop.
It has homing indicators on the arrow keys making those easy to get to but the right control is hard to find without the gap.

[Vladimir]

ideally there shouldn't be a gap..

It's simply not necessary..

I really miss the gaps when using my laptop.
It has homing indicators on the arrow keys making those easy to get to but the right control is hard to find without the gap.

Thank you.
I do believe that it's really needed for those who use it a lot.
I don't know if tp4tissue don't type the Functions very much or if he get used to a "gapless" layout but for me it's easier to find with my fingers if there's a gap. I believe it's the same reason that makes typing the numbers in the row above qwerty so uneficient.

Still, I didn't ask if there's a need, but the size of the gap.
I don't mean no offense by that.

Well, my thanks to xondat anyway.
For now I'm gonna stick with 0.25u...

[Phenix]

Would an gap in the number row
esc-1/3-1234-1/3-5678-1/3-90ß

make sense?? (I would remove the key left to backspace, for an 60% layout.

would this make it easier to enter values?

[vvp]

If you need the additional space then it means that your keyboard is too big. Cut the slack away and add layers and thumb buttons to switch layers easily 

[Kominyetska]

If you need the additional space then it means that your keyboard is too big. Cut the slack away and add layers and thumb buttons to switch layers easily 

Layers work well when you have 2 hands on the keyboard. During some tasks (like video editing) I find myself with 1 hand mousing and the other hitting shortcut keys. Having to reach for a button to switch layers would ruin the speed at which I can edit. Sometimes, you just need those keys to be real and not virtual.

[vvp]

I would say that is why you want good thumb clusters and all the modifiers keys (including the layer shifts) on them.

[Phenix]

Which options are there for more thumb keys?
Ergodox-like boards (kinesis, dactyl)
clueboard
ve. A

which else? IIRC some leejus

[davkol]

JIS layout + SpaceFn

[romevi]

0.25u looks fine.

[vvp]

Which options are there for more thumb keys?

I know only about these:

• Ergodox/Kinesis/Maltron like
• Esrille like:
  http://www.esrille.com/keyboard/
  https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=45456.msg1464260#msg1464260
• King's Assembly like:
  https://s3.amazonaws.com/ksr/assets/002/083/354/beb90bb6b0851c62d0ab3325de0e24ec_large.jpg?1401605401
• Datahand like (thumb cluster looks good but side to side movement to press buttons with fingers is not usable for me):
  http://research.microsoft.com/en-us/um/people/bibuxton/buxtoncollection/a/m/IMG_0273.png

[Vladimir]

0.25u looks fine.

Thanks.

Would an gap in the number row
esc-1/3-1234-1/3-5678-1/3-90ß

make sense?? (I would remove the key left to backspace, for an 60% layout.

would this make it easier to enter values?

It would be needed some time to get used to, but i think it would be a improvement, yes.
Although something like the NumPad will always be better. So u can type all numbers with one hand.
The functions on a row is more like a space management than a eficient design. The space gap makes it a little better (for me).

If you need the additional space then it means that your keyboard is too big. Cut the slack away and add layers and thumb buttons to switch layers easily

If you have 100 keys, there's no way that your KB won't be big.
A small KB is not necessarily better. A lot of people don't like it.
Also, I would not discuss why (here), but I don't think Fn layer is something good.
Thumb keys is a no brainer, i agree, but the KB might still be big and need the gaps for some clusters.