Ergo Clears

[TeacherGeek]

So am I right that it's just Cherry Clear STEM in another Cherry housing/spring

If that is so, why doesn't Cherry just produce Cherry Clear with a lighter spring?

[SpAmRaY]

Historically it was swapping a spring from a cherry red/brown/blue (they are all the same weight) into a clear switch to give a more tactile bump.

But as other springs became available it was anything lighter than a stock clear spring swapped into a clear, with many preferring 62g korean springs.

I don't necessarily agree they had to be lubed but as you go lighter the lube might help the stem not get stuck if you push how light of a spring you wanted to use and it can help the switches be smoother. But you've got to be careful lubing tactile switches.

But many have noted it helps to use the stock clears to break them in before swapping.

Anymore it's kind of pointless with all the switch variety available, new people don't quite grasp how limited the options used to be.

And as far as why cherry doesn't make it's own version, my opinion is there isn't enough demand and/or cherry isn't exactly innovative, they have tried some new things in recent years but that was mainly a response to gateron making moves and to try and capitalize on the 'gamer' market.

I would say if corsair or maybe coolermaster wanted it cherry would make it.

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[wholypantalones]

cherry isn't exactly innovative, they have tried some new things in recent years but that was mainly a response to gateron making moves and to try and capitalize on the 'gamer' market.

Silent, speed and low profile switches seem to be innovative enough for other switch makers to adopt those innovations and sell them. Cherry is too concentrated on the gamer market these days to care about the little percentage of mechanical keyboard enthusiasts who realize there are other options out there.

[lightsout714]

Anymore it's kind of pointless with all the switch variety available, new people don't quite grasp how limited the options used to be.

Ha so true, the old black, brown, red, blue selection got old fast (clears being the exotic option that was available now and then).

But I will say in my experience with ergo clears, which was swapping used old cherry clear stems into brown housing/springs on an old poker II. They were unusable without lube. They just got stuck all the time. And these were old harvested clear stems.

That is not everyones experience so take it for what its worth.

[jamster]

@SpAmRaY What are the new options which have superseded ErgoClears (bigger tactile bump of the Clears + lighter weight 62-65g springs)? I've not paid attention to recent switch announcements as I'm happy with my current boards. Stopped paying attention shortly before all the Zelios stuff came out.

I like ErgoClear MX, but have to say that I could really have done without having to assemble the switches myself.

[SpAmRaY]

@SpAmRaY What are the new options which have superseded ErgoClears (bigger tactile bump of the Clears + lighter weight 62-65g springs)? I've not paid attention to recent switch announcements as I'm happy with my current boards. Stopped paying attention shortly before all the Zelios stuff came out.

I like ErgoClear MX, but have to say that I could really have done without having to assemble the switches myself.

I'll have to defer to others on that as I personally have avoided following that rabbit hole.

Honestly it's a bit overwhelming when you consider there are dozens of switches available today which didn't exist just a few years ago.

I will throw out there I believe the box switches have some very tactile offerings but fair warning there have been issues with certain keycaps being cracked with the box stems so you'll have to do research on that as well.

This thread goes into the box switch issue
 https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=96323.0

Here's another good general thread on the mass amount of switches

https://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=95675.0


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[Sintpinty]

Apparantly in deskthority forums it says this:

The switches are usually made by enthusiasts by combining parts from other switches.

On request, Cherry has stated that they will actually produce Ergo Clears in a slider-colour of choice, with a minimum order of at least 750,000 switches. Keyboard enthusiasts have yet to agree if such switches should be called Beiges, Pinks or Violets.[Citation needed]

But i mean, Zealios is the king of similar feel to ergo clears

[lightsout714]

Apparantly in deskthority forums it says this:

The switches are usually made by enthusiasts by combining parts from other switches.

On request, Cherry has stated that they will actually produce Ergo Clears in a slider-colour of choice, with a minimum order of at least 750,000 switches. Keyboard enthusiasts have yet to agree if such switches should be called Beiges, Pinks or Violets.[Citation needed]

But i mean, Zealios is the king of similar feel to ergo clears

I mean isn't that the whole point of zealios? A from the factory "ergo clear". The switch everyone was hoping for and playing with, with different weight korean springs.

Pretty cool little piece of info about Cherry. I bet someone could have done that a few years ago  and made some decent money. Not sure what the per switch cost would be at that volume. But nowadays with all the variety probably not so much.

[Sintpinty]

cherry isn't exactly innovative, they have tried some new things in recent years but that was mainly a response to gateron making moves and to try and capitalize on the 'gamer' market.

Silent, speed and low profile switches seem to be innovative enough for other switch makers to adopt those innovations and sell them. Cherry is too concentrated on the gamer market these days to care about the little percentage of mechanical keyboard enthusiasts who realize there are other options out there.

Cherry MX Switches, Beside Zealios are by far the best switches on the market in terms of quality. They really hit it home when it comes to their original switches

[jamster]

I mean isn't that the whole point of zealios? A from the factory "ergo clear". The switch everyone was hoping for and playing with, with different weight korean springs.

Pretty cool little piece of info about Cherry. I bet someone could have done that a few years ago  and made some decent money. Not sure what the per switch cost would be at that volume. But nowadays with all the variety probably not so much.

I honestly can't remember whether the Zelios switches have a bigger tactile bump on them (like how MX Clears have a bigger bump than Browns).

I bought from one of Zeal's first batches of purple switches, but it was so long ago that I can't remember what they felt like. My Ergo springs were from him too, sidestepped the huge PIA of dealing with the Korean seller.

[TeacherGeek]

Cherry MX Switches, Beside Zealios are by far the best switches on the market in terms of quality. They really hit it home when it comes to their original switches

I thought Gateron's are smoother than Cherry's?

[tp4tissue]

CHERRY is doing the right thing by NOT over-iterating pointless flavors of the same water.

The original Red Brown Black Blue Clears were more than enough for this switch body.

All the current variations available to g4m3rs are just off-brand sodas.

They're fine, but not much has changed.



Steelseries hall effect has been the ONLY true step forward of late..

Tp4 am holding off until a big company game compatible analog comes along.

Would also prefer it if they made a silenced version of the analog.

[wholypantalones]

Cherry MX Switches, Beside Zealios are by far the best switches on the market in terms of quality. They really hit it home when it comes to their original switches

I thought Gateron's are smoother than Cherry's?

I've had some scratchy cherries and I've had some scratchy gaterons, it's hit and miss really just like vintage blacks. Gaterons are pretty wobbly though.

[lightsout714]

CHERRY is doing the right thing by NOT over-iterating pointless flavors of the same water.

The original Red Brown Black Blue Clears were more than enough for this switch body.

All the current variations available to g4m3rs are just off-brand sodas.

They're fine, but not much has changed.



Steelseries hall effect has been the ONLY true step forward of late..

Tp4 am holding off until a big company game compatible analog comes along.

Would also prefer it if they made a silenced version of the analog.

Naaaah, sure we have an abundance now. But the standards are boring. Typing on these T1's and nothing stock Cherry comes close.

[jamster]

Cherry MX Switches, Beside Zealios are by far the best switches on the market in terms of quality. They really hit it home when it comes to their original switches

I thought Gateron's are smoother than Cherry's?

The one thing I remember about the Zeal (Gateron) switches is that they were a damn sight smoother than any of the MX switches I've used.

[nevin]

Just swapped over to ergo clears. No way i was paying zeal prices. Worth the effort, very pleased with the result.

[Sup]

Cherry MX Switches, Beside Zealios are by far the best switches on the market in terms of quality. They really hit it home when it comes to their original switches

I thought Gateron's are smoother than Cherry's?

I've had some scratchy cherries and I've had some scratchy gaterons, it's hit and miss really just like vintage blacks. Gaterons are pretty wobbly though.

I disagree with the wobble of gateron switches. They are in term the same as Cherry now. I think you had a very old batch but now they feel wobble wise the same.

[wholypantalones]

Cherry MX Switches, Beside Zealios are by far the best switches on the market in terms of quality. They really hit it home when it comes to their original switches

I thought Gateron's are smoother than Cherry's?

I've had some scratchy cherries and I've had some scratchy gaterons, it's hit and miss really just like vintage blacks. Gaterons are pretty wobbly though.

I disagree with the wobble of gateron switches. They are in term the same as Cherry now. I think you had a very old batch but now they feel wobble wise the same.

Like I said, they're hit and miss. I've had milky bottom gaterons a year ago that we're scratchy and a batch three months ago that we're pretty bad. They're still pretty wobbly from what I can tell regardless of the batch.

[lightsout714]

Just swapped over to ergo clears. No way i was paying zeal prices. Worth the effort, very pleased with the result.

Did you lube them? If not do they stick in the down position sometimes?

Also what springs did you use?

[nevin]

@lightsout714 - When i built the board a while ago, i started out with gateron browns because they were cheap. Recently i got some cherry clears, did some testing and indeed the cherry clears are very stiff. So i swapped the stem & top housing from the cherry clears into the gateron brown bottoms & springs. I used the cherry tops as they sounded slightly deeper than the clear gateron tops, there was no difference in how one top felt over the other (gateron vs cherry). While i had them open i did lube them but didn't have any issues binding/sticking while i was testing (un-lubed) before i decided what combination i wanted to go with. All i used was some dry PTFE lube (spray) on the stems and a dab of super lube (H-3) on both ends of the springs. I did not do anything to the inside of the bottoms of the switches. I put all the stems in a container for one half (aprox. 35 stems) and sprayed & shook/bounced to hit most of the stem (not scientific or surgical by any means). Then used a q-tip to apply small amount of super lube to the ends of the springs. Now, both sets of switches were rather new, not harvested out of an old board or NOS (new old stock).

combination thats working for me (at least for now, only have a day of use on them so far)
- cherry top housing (black)
- cherry clear stem (new)
- gateron brown spring (gaterons were black bottom, clear top)
- gateron brown bottom housing (black)

Also playing with some GMK QMX silencing clips (plate mount) on some keys. I have both kinds, the original pcb mount (black rubber) & newer plate mount (white/transparent rubber/silicone?). The newer plate mount ones do seem a bit tighter around the cap stem than the original ones, but they are still not getting stuck.

Again, your results may vary and i haven't had a full day on these yet, but i really like the result so far.

[_PixelNinja]

I mean isn't that the whole point of zealios? A from the factory "ergo clear". The switch everyone was hoping for and playing with, with different weight korean springs.

In my experience, v1 Zealios are more analogous to well worn-in/vintage clears in terms of tactility, i.e. less tactile than Ergo Clears for a given spring weight. I have never been fond of the clear housings however. They have a high-pitched, plasticy note, whereas Cherry housings —especially when fitted with switch films— deliver a more full, deeper tone.

[nevin]

Totally agree on the clear polycarbonate top housings. The Gateron browns were the the first & only ones i had that were like that. It wasn't until i started playing with the set of Cherry clears & mixing parts testing that i really noticed the difference. When i first built the board i knew the sound was different then my Cherry brown board but i figured it was more due to the chassis/case than the switches. Boy was i wrong. (Keeb.io Viterbi (open frame) vs. KBTalking Pure/GH60, no plate, heavy cast case)

i've never played with the switch stickers. i've seen them, but don't know a lot about them. what's the premise? wobble? sound only?

[lightsout714]

@lightsout714 - When i built the board a while ago, i started out with gateron browns because they were cheap. Recently i got some cherry clears, did some testing and indeed the cherry clears are very stiff. So i swapped the stem & top housing from the cherry clears into the gateron brown bottoms & springs. I used the cherry tops as they sounded slightly deeper than the clear gateron tops, there was no difference in how one top felt over the other (gateron vs cherry). While i had them open i did lube them but didn't have any issues binding/sticking while i was testing (un-lubed) before i decided what combination i wanted to go with. All i used was some dry PTFE lube (spray) on the stems and a dab of super lube (H-3) on both ends of the springs. I did not do anything to the inside of the bottoms of the switches. I put all the stems in a container for one half (aprox. 35 stems) and sprayed & shook/bounced to hit most of the stem (not scientific or surgical by any means). Then used a q-tip to apply small amount of super lube to the ends of the springs. Now, both sets of switches were rather new, not harvested out of an old board or NOS (new old stock).

combination thats working for me (at least for now, only have a day of use on them so far)
- cherry top housing (black)
- cherry clear stem (new)
- gateron brown spring (gaterons were black bottom, clear top)
- gateron brown bottom housing (black)

Also playing with some GMK QMX silencing clips (plate mount) on some keys. I have both kinds, the original pcb mount (black rubber) & newer plate mount (white/transparent rubber/silicone?). The newer plate mount ones do seem a bit tighter around the cap stem than the original ones, but they are still not getting stuck.

Again, your results may vary and i haven't had a full day on these yet, but i really like the result so far.

Thanks for the in-depth write up. Again as I stated above my experience is from a number of years ago. I swapped the stems out of some stock cherry browns, with clear stems that were used from an old board. (not sure exactly how worn they were).

But they loved to stick in the down pressed position for some reason, and if not stick they would slowly come back up. Not all of them but definitely enough to be annoying. I didn't try much because at the time (Poker II) I really didn't like the 60% layout and ended up selling the board.

I would be curious to try it again today if I had all the parts. But currently I am happy with T1's, and find that I prefer a heavier switch (spring) than the stock red/brown weight.

[_PixelNinja]

i've never played with the switch stickers. i've seen them, but don't know a lot about them. what's the premise? wobble? sound only?

Stickers have virtually no tangible effect. Switch films however can make quite a difference. They were designed to reduce wobble on switches which tend to have play between the top and bottom housings, but they have a nice side effect on the sound.

Wodan's video showcases this pretty well:

[tp4tissue]

i've never played with the switch stickers. i've seen them, but don't know a lot about them. what's the premise? wobble? sound only?

Stickers have virtually no tangible effect. Switch films however can make quite a difference. They were designed to reduce wobble on switches which tend to have play between the top and bottom housings, but they have a nice side effect on the sound.

Wodan's video showcases this pretty well:

This is similar to the Supplement industry..

Some one has a disorder ,  (keeb collection) ,   

Some one takes advantage of this guy's disorder, creates keeb accessory

Everyone buys accessory.

Retraction is printed, accessory does nothing

Lawsuit, accessory actually damages keeb.

Move onto NEXT Seller.



Much like DHA (fish oil) supplements which are now linked to prostate cancer. !!

[Sintpinty]

CHERRY is doing the right thing by NOT over-iterating pointless flavors of the same water.

The original Red Brown Black Blue Clears were more than enough for this switch body.

All the current variations available to g4m3rs are just off-brand sodas.

They're fine, but not much has changed.



Steelseries hall effect has been the ONLY true step forward of late..

Tp4 am holding off until a big company game compatible analog comes along.

Would also prefer it if they made a silenced version of the analog.

Greens are good in terms of the more deeper click but are way too heavy for my standards

[lightsout714]

CHERRY is doing the right thing by NOT over-iterating pointless flavors of the same water.

The original Red Brown Black Blue Clears were more than enough for this switch body.

All the current variations available to g4m3rs are just off-brand sodas.

They're fine, but not much has changed.



Steelseries hall effect has been the ONLY true step forward of late..

Tp4 am holding off until a big company game compatible analog comes along.

Would also prefer it if they made a silenced version of the analog.

Greens are good in terms of the more deeper click but are way too heavy for my standards

I agree I thought I would love them and they were fun at first. But after a while just not realistic (tiring).