Author Topic: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?  (Read 9799 times)

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Online tp4tissue

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #50 on: Tue, 08 November 2022, 19:45:19 »
god damn it,  Tp4 feels like he's getting sucked into it again,  compulsively reading amp modding, measurements, ripple, dc blocking,  wima,  /foams at mouth.

Offline smarmar

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #51 on: Wed, 09 November 2022, 16:23:57 »
My PC is the source atm, I'm listening to FLAC through Plex (I rip all my albums and put 'em on there, so easy)
idk bluejuice,  Plex doesn't have enough audiophile street-cred...
Never mind the software, there's not even mention of a dedicated soundcard - audiophile club membership revoked :p
Haha - I didn't think a soundcard was necessary as the USB had ample power to get the signal to the DAC. :))

TP: Plex runs fine for my usage. Plays flac perfectly. And the indexing? Oh my lord it's easy, just slap the ripped audio into a folder and plex takes care of the rest. <3
A wise man once said to me "If you don't have your files backed up in at least three different locations, those files do not exist.", and he was referring to local hard storage, not cloud-based. Just sayin'. :)
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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #52 on: Wed, 09 November 2022, 16:55:10 »
Someone should make an inexpensive set of reference equipment to test audiophile gear.

That way, we'll know if we're getting BSed.  As is, reading spec sheets and reviews is a bit wobbly,

For example, Tp4 knows with absolute certainty that the vast majority of Monitors come with trash level factory calibrations, and they drift extremely quickly, especially from NEW condition.  You can see this readily with a basic colorimeter.

I'd imagine analog audio has even less stability.   but there's no ref equipment to check with since high accuracy analyzers are more expensive than most of the gears.

If people can't test at large,  the market can't elevate.

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #53 on: Wed, 09 November 2022, 21:17:39 »
This really grinds mah gear,  this audiophile dude on the internet, complains about how an amp isn't "linear" because it's class d and has a half db roll off starting at 18000.

Tp4 can't even hear 16500+

Guaranteed all music masters can't hear above that either since they're probably adults.


wow porpoise (dolphin looking) can hear 150,000

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #54 on: Wed, 09 November 2022, 23:11:09 »
This chase for a perfect amplifier, if you turn your head less than 1 degree, you probably get more than 3db worth of dip somewhere.

What is the point of having super linearity if the transducer can't deliver it in any real listening scenario.


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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #55 on: Thu, 10 November 2022, 07:46:29 »
ugh... now this one dude is dissn' tp4's choice of cheepo amplifier,  now tp4 = super mad....

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #56 on: Thu, 10 November 2022, 08:42:16 »

dissn' tp4's choice

now tp4 = super mad


You must spend a lot of time mad.
America is becoming a country that can no longer question itself, invest in the public good or imagine a future beyond the dreamscapes of the rich and ruling elite. Apocalyptic fears, uncertainties and anxieties feed a rising tsunami of violence that has become the organizing principle of governance, everyday life and society itself. American society is caught in the daily routines of lies, corruption and manufactured ignorance; one consequence is the withering of individual and social agency along with civic culture and the public imagination. American optimism has turned bleak. In the age of gangster capitalism, people lose their interconnections, community and sense of security. Isolation and anxiety gives way to mass depression and is ripe for expressions of rage and hatred. The guard rails of justice, compassion, the welfare state, politics, democratic values and the institutions that nourish them are under threat of disappearing. Apocalyptic terrors have moved from the realm of fiction into the social fabric of everyday life. - Henry Giroux 2023-03-05

Offline suicidal_orange

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #57 on: Thu, 10 November 2022, 18:38:41 »
What is the point of having super linearity if the transducer can't deliver it in any real listening scenario.
One more reason that headphones are just better (in addition to being cheaper, not being affected by the room and not annoying other people in the house)
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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #58 on: Wed, 23 November 2022, 17:43:33 »
Are Tube pre-amps worth getting or is it only "tubular" with full tube.

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #59 on: Wed, 23 November 2022, 19:28:17 »
I don't see the point in tubes unless you are playing analog source material and want to keep the entire stream analog.
America is becoming a country that can no longer question itself, invest in the public good or imagine a future beyond the dreamscapes of the rich and ruling elite. Apocalyptic fears, uncertainties and anxieties feed a rising tsunami of violence that has become the organizing principle of governance, everyday life and society itself. American society is caught in the daily routines of lies, corruption and manufactured ignorance; one consequence is the withering of individual and social agency along with civic culture and the public imagination. American optimism has turned bleak. In the age of gangster capitalism, people lose their interconnections, community and sense of security. Isolation and anxiety gives way to mass depression and is ripe for expressions of rage and hatred. The guard rails of justice, compassion, the welfare state, politics, democratic values and the institutions that nourish them are under threat of disappearing. Apocalyptic terrors have moved from the realm of fiction into the social fabric of everyday life. - Henry Giroux 2023-03-05

Offline ergonaut

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #60 on: Thu, 24 November 2022, 07:56:18 »
What is your opinion on omnidirectional speakers, like Duevel?

https://www.duevel.com/en-gb

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #61 on: Thu, 24 November 2022, 08:36:44 »
You have to have a special room designed for omni-directional speakers. Directivity matters because it creates room cancelations. It's generally easier to optimize a beam of sound in a room, vs omni.

Offline ergonaut

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #62 on: Thu, 24 November 2022, 08:44:09 »
You have to have a special room designed for omni-directional speakers.

How should the room be designed?

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #63 on: Thu, 24 November 2022, 09:46:37 »
My vote goes to an ellipse with the 2 speakers at the foci.
America is becoming a country that can no longer question itself, invest in the public good or imagine a future beyond the dreamscapes of the rich and ruling elite. Apocalyptic fears, uncertainties and anxieties feed a rising tsunami of violence that has become the organizing principle of governance, everyday life and society itself. American society is caught in the daily routines of lies, corruption and manufactured ignorance; one consequence is the withering of individual and social agency along with civic culture and the public imagination. American optimism has turned bleak. In the age of gangster capitalism, people lose their interconnections, community and sense of security. Isolation and anxiety gives way to mass depression and is ripe for expressions of rage and hatred. The guard rails of justice, compassion, the welfare state, politics, democratic values and the institutions that nourish them are under threat of disappearing. Apocalyptic terrors have moved from the realm of fiction into the social fabric of everyday life. - Henry Giroux 2023-03-05

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #64 on: Thu, 24 November 2022, 12:13:00 »
I don't know how a room should be for omni, but oval rooms in general are bad due to creating discontinuities which distorting the stereo image. So you'll hear sounds coming from the wrong direction relative to its intended placement.

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #65 on: Thu, 24 November 2022, 18:38:28 »
LOL, this speaker company is named Geyguy. hahahahahha..

293549-0

Offline suicidal_orange

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #66 on: Fri, 25 November 2022, 07:08:45 »
^ And the name is proudly displayed on the front!  Plus, are those eyebrows?  Somehow with just two half arrows that speaker looks pissed off :confused:

How should the room be designed?
I thought the only way to design a room for speakers was to cover everything in foam that looks like egg boxes - doesn't matter what shape it is if there are no sound waves bouncing around?

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Offline yui

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #67 on: Fri, 25 November 2022, 08:31:45 »
btw if you really want the most custom amp possible, building a class A or B transistor or tube amp is actually rather easy, and optimizing it for your taste will take weeks of reading and experimenting :)
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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #68 on: Sat, 26 November 2022, 08:15:10 »
Why are crossover parts so expensive, this stuff should cost a few bucks, but even a simple layout is $100.

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #69 on: Sat, 26 November 2022, 09:29:29 »

Why are crossover parts so expensive


I always figured that even though the raw loose pieces, like the capacitors and resistors, cost only pennies each (well, maybe nickels or dimes) for general hobby use, "audiophiles" are often times insanely demanding so that ordinary parts aren't good enough, and they only feel comfortable with what they perceive to be high-end premium gear (heaven forbid that distortion should be introduced somewhere along the line).

Why do people pay many dollars per foot for "wire" ? ....
America is becoming a country that can no longer question itself, invest in the public good or imagine a future beyond the dreamscapes of the rich and ruling elite. Apocalyptic fears, uncertainties and anxieties feed a rising tsunami of violence that has become the organizing principle of governance, everyday life and society itself. American society is caught in the daily routines of lies, corruption and manufactured ignorance; one consequence is the withering of individual and social agency along with civic culture and the public imagination. American optimism has turned bleak. In the age of gangster capitalism, people lose their interconnections, community and sense of security. Isolation and anxiety gives way to mass depression and is ripe for expressions of rage and hatred. The guard rails of justice, compassion, the welfare state, politics, democratic values and the institutions that nourish them are under threat of disappearing. Apocalyptic terrors have moved from the realm of fiction into the social fabric of everyday life. - Henry Giroux 2023-03-05

Offline suicidal_orange

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #70 on: Sat, 26 November 2022, 10:00:25 »
I always figured that even though the raw loose pieces, like the capacitors and resistors, cost only pennies each (well, maybe nickels or dimes) for general hobby use, "audiophiles" are often times insanely demanding so that ordinary parts aren't good enough, and they only feel comfortable with what they perceive to be high-end premium gear (heaven forbid that distortion should be introduced somewhere along the line).

Why do people pay many dollars per foot for "wire" ? ....
Capacitors and resistors are usually rated +/- 10% so if you get one that's on the high end and one on the low end that's a big difference and could be audible, assuming you're actually using them to the limit, hand matching pairs (for left/right channel) takes time and will significantly add to the price.  Do you also need to pay more than double for copper foil over tin in your capacitor, or 12.5x tin for silver?  Probably not :p

Similarly for wire I can see paying a premium for a really nice insulator (especially important when making earphone cables which need to be flexible so as not to make excess noise rubbing on clothes and to not tie themselves in knots) but I question the need to go past 99.9% pure copper (I've seen 99.9999% advertised!) or to deep freeze and polish each strand when you do.
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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #71 on: Sat, 26 November 2022, 18:02:07 »
have a feeling most audiophiles are just stupid.  someone has to be willing to pay this, otherwise they'd be cheaper.

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #72 on: Sat, 26 November 2022, 18:40:39 »

audiophiles are just willing to pay


A free market allows buyers and sellers to set prices interactively.
America is becoming a country that can no longer question itself, invest in the public good or imagine a future beyond the dreamscapes of the rich and ruling elite. Apocalyptic fears, uncertainties and anxieties feed a rising tsunami of violence that has become the organizing principle of governance, everyday life and society itself. American society is caught in the daily routines of lies, corruption and manufactured ignorance; one consequence is the withering of individual and social agency along with civic culture and the public imagination. American optimism has turned bleak. In the age of gangster capitalism, people lose their interconnections, community and sense of security. Isolation and anxiety gives way to mass depression and is ripe for expressions of rage and hatred. The guard rails of justice, compassion, the welfare state, politics, democratic values and the institutions that nourish them are under threat of disappearing. Apocalyptic terrors have moved from the realm of fiction into the social fabric of everyday life. - Henry Giroux 2023-03-05

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #73 on: Sat, 26 November 2022, 21:34:59 »
speaker stands are NOT affordable. wthhh... why... it's just a  tube.

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #74 on: Fri, 09 December 2022, 10:38:08 »
This video really bothers Tp4, this is what AMERICA has been reduced to, shame on you Polk. dat crossover,  sigh...... capitalism... /heart hurts


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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #75 on: Fri, 09 December 2022, 11:09:55 »

dat crossover


It ain't purty, that's for sure, but does it actually matter?

I have the Monitor 30s in my guest bedroom and they are pretty good. I haven't opened them up, but I suppose they look about the same inside.
America is becoming a country that can no longer question itself, invest in the public good or imagine a future beyond the dreamscapes of the rich and ruling elite. Apocalyptic fears, uncertainties and anxieties feed a rising tsunami of violence that has become the organizing principle of governance, everyday life and society itself. American society is caught in the daily routines of lies, corruption and manufactured ignorance; one consequence is the withering of individual and social agency along with civic culture and the public imagination. American optimism has turned bleak. In the age of gangster capitalism, people lose their interconnections, community and sense of security. Isolation and anxiety gives way to mass depression and is ripe for expressions of rage and hatred. The guard rails of justice, compassion, the welfare state, politics, democratic values and the institutions that nourish them are under threat of disappearing. Apocalyptic terrors have moved from the realm of fiction into the social fabric of everyday life. - Henry Giroux 2023-03-05

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #76 on: Fri, 09 December 2022, 11:13:30 »

dat crossover


It ain't purty, that's for sure, but does it actually matter?

I have the Monitor 30s in my guest bedroom and they are pretty good. I haven't opened them up, but I suppose they look about the same inside.



it's not like it's poison, but it just makes one furrow the brow and head scratch.

tp4 thought of getting the monitor 30/40 and maybe adding cross over cuz they were on sale, but cross over parts together cost more than the speakers themselves.



Offline ergonaut

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #77 on: Wed, 21 December 2022, 06:25:32 »
What do you think about subwoofers?

I have the opportunity to buy a nice second-hand Canton active subwoofer locally. Apparently it was 550 ten years ago and I could have it for 180. It's supposed to go down to 25 Hz at -3db, while my current speakers reach 50 Hz at -3db.

On the one hand, I would love to have more powerful deep bass, but on the other hand it also seems to be a bit of a PITA to find a correct spot in the room for it and the correct settings and everything. Having just a pair of stereo speakers is nice and simple.

WDYT?

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #78 on: Wed, 21 December 2022, 07:20:21 »
don't buy used subs,  especially one that old.

with active dsp, the board is complicated, it's not fixable on your end if something goes wrong.

you might pick it up if it were a much cheaper thrift store find, but,   for the asking price it's risky.

tp4 recommends getting a pb1000 from svs during their holiday sales.  these are dsp driven subs as well.

Offline ergonaut

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #79 on: Wed, 21 December 2022, 07:42:30 »
Thanks tp4.

The issue for me is that I have an older (early 1990s) Denon amplifier, which doesn't have a pre-out or subwoofer out. Thus, I would need a subwoofer which has high level inputs to connect the speaker cables from the amplifier, and high level outputs to connect the main speakers. Many/most of the newer subwoofers dont have those AFAIK.

This approach also allows to cut off the frequencies below the cutoff frequency so they arent transmitted to the main speakers (which could cause phase erasure issues)

Just to clarify what Im talking about, have a look at this: http://bilder.hifi-forum.de/max/770565/img-6160_478110.jpg

Im talking about the outputs in the lower left corner.

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #80 on: Wed, 21 December 2022, 08:05:31 »
the pb1000 has high level in.  it doesn't have out,  but you can use a second set of wires directly from the same port on your receiver/amp to the LR speakers.

that's exactly how the binding posts work internally, it's just a y adapter.

to be clear, you want 2 sets of wires coming out of your receiver. 

the cross over is always handled by the sub (if it's a powered sub).

Offline ergonaut

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #81 on: Wed, 21 December 2022, 08:26:27 »
Ah nice, didn't know I could connect it that way. But then the main speakers would still get the whole frequency spectrum, right?

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #82 on: Wed, 21 December 2022, 08:36:03 »
yes full range is sent, but the main speaker has internal crossovers that prevent it from reproducing the full range of the signal sent.  <at least proper> main speakers are built this way.

some of the latest crop of ultra budget speakrs are iffy on that.

Offline iLLucionist

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #83 on: Wed, 21 December 2022, 08:59:26 »
everything is BS... if you are a nihilist like me heh..

im not an audiophile but i need some reasonably good gear
got myself some yamaha HS8's and the scarlett clarett+ pre8 interface.

i would go as far to say that dacs matter, and analog vs digital (but thats anoter debate)
but not things like gold plated plugs or "cleansed power"

some peeps spend an inordinate amount on cables.
ok cheapest suck... but beyond normal why so much money on cables

gotta buy more keyboards or synths instead...
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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #84 on: Wed, 21 December 2022, 09:20:32 »
dacs do matter, but the problem is more so how much distortion and noise they generate, not how linear they are, they're all pretty linear.

Offline ergonaut

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #85 on: Thu, 12 January 2023, 08:16:57 »
https://www.klippel.de/listeningtest/?v=3

I'm just gonna leave that here. It's a nice way to figure out how much money you can save while shopping for hifi products.

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #86 on: Thu, 26 January 2023, 12:57:14 »
https://www.klippel.de/listeningtest/?v=3

I'm just gonna leave that here. It's a nice way to figure out how much money you can save while shopping for hifi products.

got -12 on the test, don't really understand the meaning though, does that mean we only need only -12db distortion on the chain ?

Offline ergonaut

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Re: is aud1ophi1e stuff BS ?
« Reply #87 on: Wed, 08 February 2023, 07:40:44 »

got -12 on the test, don't really understand the meaning though, does that mean we only need only -12db distortion on the chain ?


I have no clue, to be honest. I guess there's some way to calculate what level of distortion would be inaudible to you based on the results of this test, but I don't know how to do that.