NAS/home server advice

[evolveS]

Gigabyte GA-H97N-WIFI
Pentium G3258 (assume stock or undervolted)
2x4gb DDR3 1333
up to six of the biggest sataIII drives I can afford
Silverstone ST45SF-G
Node 304

Main purpose of this box is to playback music & video (no transcoding ever) to one Windows PC at a time, transmission and crashplan are secondary requirements. Ideally I'd just add it as a network location and access content from there. Will run it 24/7 so the less TDP the better.

Now the questions:
Will the Pentium have enough horsepower for playback? What benefit is there (if any) in stepping up to an i3?
Anywhere I could cut costs (except case & psu)?
Am I just over-complicating things and RAID 10 on Windows 8/Server 2012 is what I need?
Software RAID vs hardware RAID?? 

Please leave me your input and experiences and help me become unconfused!

[jwaz]

I'm pretty stoked with FreeNAS on my ASRock Avoton board but it's pretty intense for home server needs. IPMI, tons of sata, ecc support, etc

[tp4tissue]

Um...... if you're not playing any games on this...   g3258 is overkill..  just buy some used parts on ebay and it'll do fine.

[evolveS]

I'm pretty stoked with FreeNAS on my ASRock Avoton board but it's pretty intense for home server needs. IPMI, tons of sata, ecc support, etc

Wow those boards are insane! The C2550 version looks like a fantastic choice... What's your storage setup like?

[IvanIvanovich]

Those are pretty nice, but I think the ASRock E3C224D4I-14S is a bit nicer and I would just stick a Pentium in that. Or if I were going to get an Atom board I would take the ASUS P9A-I/C2550/SAS/4L instead. For a case, Lian Li PC-Q26 would be my only choice if buying something new for itx.
If you're going to go the freenas route instead of Windows, I would get a lot more ram so I could use zfs raidz1 with an ssd cache. As a general rule you need 1GB of memory per 1TB of drive space. So for example, if you wanted to have a 3x4TB parity array + a 64-128GB SSD you would want to start out with a 16GB 2x8GB kit probably. That would also leave you enough room memory wise to add a smaller 3x2TB array set. Though, also it's recommended to use ECC memory with ZFS it's not a must. So if you went with that first ASRock board, you would later still be able to add a 2nd kit of memory if you need to add additional disk array later on.
Otherwise, if you go with Windows you can get less ram, but then get 2x SSD for each 3 disk hdd set if you want to use the journaling feature with storage spaces parity array. Even though they aren't stellar ssd, you can get for really cheap those Kingston 128GB V300 if they are still on sale at newegg. With using about 50% of over provisioning it should keep them from failing in short order in theory.
Or, you could get a real budget build that would probably be fine as well, with something like a J1900 board and less exotic storage set ups.

[atlas3686]

If you really want to save cash grab a little hp proliant micro server + LP GPU they go on sale often and are perfect for this type of work.

[SpAmRaY]

If you really want to save cash grab a little hp proliant micro server + LP GPU they go on sale often and are perfect for this type of work.

I bought one of these a few years ago and never really did much with it, stuck 4 3tb drives in it I think, but it fit in a plastic storage tote with monitor, keyboard, mouse and a couple extra externals when I packed it for storage.

[atlas3686]

If you really want to save cash grab a little hp proliant micro server + LP GPU they go on sale often and are perfect for this type of work.

I bought one of these a few years ago and never really did much with it, stuck 4 3tb drives in it I think, but it fit in a plastic storage tote with monitor, keyboard, mouse and a couple extra externals when I packed it for storage.

I love mine hey, bought it a couple years ago so it struggles with HD streaming sometimes but I run all my storage off it and use it as a media centre connected to my tv. Was actually thinking of buying a newer one to replace it

[evolveS]

So as long as I'm not interested in transcoding (playing back in native format only), then I should be fine with something much less powerful? My storage setup doesn't have to be that complicated as long as it can withstand one dead disk and deliver seamless playback. Most of my media will be music or HD video.

If all that can be done on the J1900 platform, I'm sold.

If you really want to save cash grab a little hp proliant micro server + LP GPU

As in keep a watchful eye on ebay? New ones run a little over my budget.

[atlas3686]

Just keep an eye out for promos on the previous gen models, they going for $190 here at the moment

[IvanIvanovich]

Some of the off the shelf NAS can be good deals, especially HP ones if they are doing their crazy 50% rebates. But, most of them do have trade off of not being terribly flexible or upgradable much either. You can pick up some of the older ones for next to nothing used at times, but need to make sure to stay away from any older single core Atom or any that come with AMD Turions as they are really stinkers.

[evolveS]

Thanks for the replies everyone, it's been very helpful. I've also done some poking around on the FreeNAS hardware subforum for their recommendations.

I still need clarification on this, can anyone help?

So as long as I'm not interested in transcoding, then I should be fine with something much less powerful? (most of the usage will be playing of 1080p mkv video or music in native formats only)

[tp4tissue]

I really really do not like off the shelf NAS..

They cram drives into these very tight cages with very little air flow over the electronics at the bottom..

We know for a fact that the mechanical portion of the drive is actually very sturdy..

The electronics failure is usually the culprit, the controller / processor on the drive pcb.


Now,  the ONLY thing we can do about that is  keep the drives spaced well apart and/or in addition to good ventilation..

The Off the shelf NAS are usually designed for aesthetic SIZE, so they are terrible for cooling..


My recommendation.. buy a BIG tower.. and make sure the drives time out and turn off..

[jwaz]

I'm pretty stoked with FreeNAS on my ASRock Avoton board but it's pretty intense for home server needs. IPMI, tons of sata, ecc support, etc

Wow those boards are insane! The C2550 version looks like a fantastic choice... What's your storage setup like?

FreeNAS running on:
C2550d4i w/ 8GB of Kingston ECC RAM
U-NAS 4 drive hot-swap mini-itx case
WD 3TB RE drives
It's quite an awesome little setup.

Solid advice from Ivan, though how necessary ECC RAM is a hotly debated topic on the FreeNAS forums.

I just dug up a post I had made on TekSyndicate's forum re: building a NAS:

I built my NAS with the an ASrock board featuring the new Avoton Atom quad-core (you can get an octa-core as well, I believe Wendell used one in a build video). It's pretty sweet but will run you about $250 (actually, looks like it's on sale currently). It's mini-ITX so it makes for a great home NAS form factor and even has crazy features like IPMI and tons of SATA ports.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157419

Intel Avoton C2550 Quad-Core Processor
DDR3 1600/1333 Dual-channel Max. 64GB
2 x SATA3 6.0Gbps, 4 x SATA2 3.0Gbps by C2550
4 x SATA3 6.0Gbps by Marvell SE9230, 2 x SATA3 6.0Gbps by Marvell SE9172
Dual Intel i210 Gigabit LAN ports (with Teaming function)
3 x USB 2.0 ports (2 rear ports + 1 via headers or 1 rear ports + 2 via headers controlled by USB_SEL1 and USB_SEL2 jumper)
1 x PCI-E x8 slot
Many people use Fractal or Lian LI cases. I opted for hot swap functionality and went for a U-NAS. The website looks kinda sketchy but I received the case and it's not half bad. Still need to upgrade the cheapo PSU it came with. If I was going to build it again I would probably just go with one of the former since I don't really need to use the hot swap functionality like I do with servers at work and WD RE drives are generally pretty rock-solid, though a bit more expensive.

Generally you want 1GB of RAM per TB of HDD storage IIRC though I think you might need more for deduplication functionality. Make sure it's ECC!

Check out the FreeNAS hardware forums and irc for more info, good luck!

https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?forums/hardware.18/
http://irc.lc/ircnet/freenas/

[Bencze]

If I understand correctly you won't actually be playing videos with it you'll just use it as file server (play videos from it using a different machine as video player).
For same purpose (and more) I use oldest N36L hp microserver. It has 2 hard disks in software raid 1, running CentOS (basically redhat linux). The cpu is fine for 100 MB/sec writing or reading which is a lot more than any max quality double blu ray bitrate I might play from it.
I use it as file sharing with samba, transmission for torrents, mpd for audio server (usb connection to dac+hifi), a squid proxy, dns server, web server etc., of course I am the only client for it it's just stuff I play with. The only upgrade I did was switch the 1gb ram to 8 but 1 would be enough for what I use it for.
So for mainly Nas and torrent purposes if I was to look now, I'd try to find a used microserver, any model even oldest. As other possibility I'd check mini-itx.com, I have no business with them or anything but I look at that site when I am playing around with ideas, they have nice case options like small cases, cases with several hard disk slots etc. and obviously mini itx mobos cpus pico psu etc. with all the necessary stuff.

To the question if it wasn't clear, my cpu is AMD Athlon II Neo N36L Dual-Core, it's piss weak but it's good enough for the purpose.

edit: clarifications

[JDorfler]

At work I have a headless POS (Piece of ......, not Point of Sales) not only running media services, but file sharing, proxy (cache/filtering), printing, scanning, and I'm thinking of adding email, IRC, and IM services as well.  I think it has, maybe, 1Gig of RAM?

I'm running Ubuntu server 14.04.1 64Bit on it.  Then again I'm a bit of a control freak when it comes to internal networks.

[evolveS]

Thanks very much for the reply Bencze, you've helped confirm that I don't need anything too exotic. And to everyone else for their recommendations!

If my current NAS plans fall through, I'm thinking that one of those Lenovo TS140/440 would work fine.

[IvanIvanovich]

Found a new release...

SuperMicro A1SA7-2750F
maybe only slightly overkill... and for the low low price of only $550. ) Actually if the price was lower I might be all over that one.

[evolveS]

Just a little overkill 17 SATA ports...

Definitely proprietary form factor, could probably mod a full atx case for this...

Wait a minute - all I see are an 8-pin and a 4-pin psu connector. How is that possible?

[IvanIvanovich]

Yeah the mounting points are a little off, but a matx case with a LOT of drive bays would be fine with a bit of light modding to add the right spots on the motherboard tray. 12v only connection for PSU isn't totally uncommon but indeed one more thing that would require special purchase or some modding. It is too bad they didn't make it to actual typical matx standard... it has a great features.

[JWK]

<snip> a LOT of drive bays <snip>

The key factors for a NAS box is drive bays, ports, power supply, and cooling (lots of drives = power).  Computing power requirements are pretty low.  Even when building/repairing a RAID array, I find that the read/write bandwidth of the drives is the limiting factor -- the CPU is loafing at 10%-15%.     

I built my first NAS box from an old tower system, but it didn't have enough drive bays.  I rebuilt it in a 4u chassis I got cheap from Frys.  But a better route would be to find a 2u or 4u rack mount server on Ebay.  Be sure the seller includes the drive caddies, as they frequently do not.    Rack servers are noisy - small fan diameter - so put this in the basement next to the furnace.

[IvanIvanovich]

Sure, 2 or 3 generation old servers can be a good deal on what you can get for cheap costs often times... if you own your own home and can stick it somewhere you don't have to hear it. They aren't great on power efficiency either, but can be managed if you get lightsout and set it up to sleep with wake on magic packet. Some of us, like myself, live in tiny studio apartments. Not the best option to live with.
In my case I would rather pay more for something that sips power comparatively, and can be run passive or with very little active cooling which takes up as little space as possible. While having lot of drive bays is nice, if you're using 2Tb-5TB drives you probably don't 'need' 16 of them.