Game Design

[Vibex]

As some of you already know, I'm a Game Development and Computer Science major at North Eastern University. Just curious if there are any other game scholars here on GH. If so, what games do you think are the best to learn from (both digital and traditional)?

[twiddle]

As a lecturer in game design, I'd say: all of them.
Bad games, as subjective as that is, still represent useful data points.
It really depends on what information you want, though.

[Vibex]

As a lecturer in game design, I'd say: all of them.
Bad games, as subjective as that is, still represent useful data points.
It really depends on what information you want, though.

Haha, If only I could play them all.  I understand what you mean though. I have learned a ton from bad games by figuring out why they were bad instead of just ignoring them.

[Melvang]

As a lecturer in game design, I'd say: all of them.
Bad games, as subjective as that is, still represent useful data points.
It really depends on what information you want, though.

I would have to agree with this from personal experience in my trade.  My very first job in the construction trades was an absolute nightmare.  Nothing fit like it was supposed to, the few parts that fit were actually made wrong according to the blueprints.  And come to fond out the "engineer" on the job didn't even have an engineering degree in any way shape or form.  But I learned more on that job then any other single job since my start in the trades.

[baldgye]

If I was to pick two types of games that have influenced me the most as a person (rather than a developer or student) it would be Starcraft: Brood War and Metal Gear Solid 2.
Like them or hate them both are successful and both are driven to achieve something, but they are very different from one another.

You don't even have to play either game either, there are loads and loads of video's on youtube that you can watch that analyse the mechanics, story, design and the messages those games are trying to express or the environment they are trying to create for you as a player.

[tp4tissue]

The older I get.. The more I feel thus,  "I don't want to play your stupid game, just tell me what happens"

This also accounts for the population with the most money, Adults.

All current marketing strategies advertise to Children who would then convince their parents to pay for the entertainment.


However, the Adult market (for games) itself is completely untapped due to the difficulty of such a production.

[Vibex]

If I was to pick two types of games that have influenced me the most as a person (rather than a developer or student) it would be Starcraft: Brood War and Metal Gear Solid 2.
Like them or hate them both are successful and both are driven to achieve something, but they are very different from one another.

You don't even have to play either game either, there are loads and loads of video's on youtube that you can watch that analyse the mechanics, story, design and the messages those games are trying to express or the environment they are trying to create for you as a player.

I've never played brood war, but I've watched a ton of competitive starcraft (broodwar and 2), I still havn't gotten a chance to play MGS2. I watch a lot of other people play games. It's a great tool to get rid of my own biases.

The older I get.. The more I feel thus,  "I don't want to play your stupid game, just tell me what happens"

This also accounts for the population with the most money, Adults.

All current marketing strategies advertise to Children who would then convince their parents to pay for the entertainment.


However, the Adult market (for games) itself is completely untapped due to the difficulty of such a production.

I think the adult market exists, and it will keep growing as the people who grew up with games become adults.

[greath]

Honestly... World of Warcraft.

I think few games have taught more about the gaming world... especially in how to create strong urges, if not needs, to play. The carrot on a stick, the mass early rewards with rewards slowing down as you progress, the exponential leveling system, the cultural nuances created between players. I think there could be more to learn from WoW than pretty much any other single game ever created, and I don't mean that from a "how to build an mmo" standpoint. I mean that in a very board and general sense.

 

[nathanrosspowell]

I currently work at Ubisoft Montreal (programmer, not a designer) and the biggest thing I can recommend is watching how people play new games for the first time.

We have some play test labs (one way mirrored rooms, with a 2nd monitor hanging above each station duplication what they are doing) where people will come and do pre-alpha testing for a day or so. Seeing people try and use your ingenious mechanic without anything but the in game presentation can be really frustrating, but it teaches you a lot.

A 'triple A' game normally has to cater to the lowest commen denominator when it comes to this 'player feedback' to explain the game. That is why a lengthy tutorial will be included on EVERY game in the franchies, even though 90% of the controls are the same as the last game. People on a console are not going to read a manual or check a wiki, they expect it to just work for them. Maybe your niche/indie game will have dedicated people who will do that, but for something on mobile your game has to click INSTANTLY!

I really love this break down of how to actually teach a player in a respectful manner:

(the presenter is polarizing, but the points stand)

[tp4tissue]

I think the adult market exists, and it will keep growing as the people who grew up with games become adults.

Here's why I think the market doesn't exist..

Adults arn't satisfied with the games.. 

Most of the older guys buying the new games don't even have the time to play them..

They stack up in their steam catalog..


yes the momentum of having played games as a kid has come through some what.. 

But these games are still failing to actually capture an adult's attention.


A fundamental divide between adults and children is that, most adults work in the real world, for money,  and they begin to realize how precious their time actually is. 

This makes a digital excursion seem extremely expensive.   So the payoff relative to other things such as "food,sex,alcohol"  is much smaller per unit of time.


Which is why in truth, games have not truly penetrated the adult market..  Even though more adults have purchased games for themselves than in the past.

[Vibex]

Honestly... World of Warcraft.

I think few games have taught more about the gaming world... especially in how to create strong urges, if not needs, to play. The carrot on a stick, the mass early rewards with rewards slowing down as you progress, the exponential leveling system, the cultural nuances created between players. I think there could be more to learn from WoW than pretty much any other single game ever created, and I don't mean that from a "how to build an mmo" standpoint. I mean that in a very board and general sense.

I have heard quite a few people say this, I just can't justify it on my current budget.

I currently work at Ubisoft Montreal (programmer, not a designer) and the biggest thing I can recommend is watching how people play new games for the first time.

We have some play test labs (one way mirrored rooms, with a 2nd monitor hanging above each station duplication what they are doing) where people will come and do pre-alpha testing for a day or so. Seeing people try and use your ingenious mechanic without anything but the in game presentation can be really frustrating, but it teaches you a lot.

A 'triple A' game normally has to cater to the lowest commen denominator when it comes to this 'player feedback' to explain the game. That is why a lengthy tutorial will be included on EVERY game in the franchies, even though 90% of the controls are the same as the last game. People on a console are not going to read a manual or check a wiki, they expect it to just work for them. Maybe your niche/indie game will have dedicated people who will do that, but for something on mobile your game has to click INSTANTLY!

I really love this break down of how to actually teach a player in a respectful manner:

(the presenter is polarizing, but the points stand)

Awesome place to work. I've been looking for places to intern to do stuff like that.

[Lain1911]

I don't have a degree in it, but I used to make games with RPG Maker. Was a blast.