Should bottom out avoidance be that important in choosing keyboards?

[DuckNorris]

Hello Geekhackers,

Lately I was having a discussion with a friend who is getting his 3rd mechanical keyboard but it was interesting to me as to why. His main decision to go to clears or blacks from blues/browns is solely because he feels he would not bottom out as much in them. A lot of people take this into account when it comes to mechanical keyboards on some forums but to me it never really mattered. I see A LOT of people bottoming out often in youtube and I do a mixture of touch typing and bottoming out depending on key and finger combo. Heck, many times I bottom out on purpose cause I like the sound/feeling.  I was wondering what others here thought of this when it came to choosing your keyboard like should I be focusing on this? I can if I tried just never considered it as a big deal.

[kinglukas38]

bottoming out isn't a bad thing, can actually be faster to bottom about compared to typing on heavy springs. Source: I type faster on my hhkb than I do on my 100g vint blacks 

[harjoat]

You can't avoid bottoming out sometimes, it just happens. Clears were specifically designed to avoid bottoming out but that doesn't mean you won't. Honestly I don't think it's about if you want to bottom out or not, it's more about how the switch feels when you do or do not bottom out. There's more than just one factor to consider.

[hurst]

Best part of a Topre.

[menuhin]

Best part of a Topre.

+1

[drevyek]

For me, a sharply tactile switch (Rubber Domes, Topre, Alps) make me bottom out a bit more often. The drop in force per mm of travel makes the drop off of the tactile event much easier to clear through. The only real benefit of tactile switches is knowing that you've actuated them by touch alone.

That said, having a switch *require* you to bottom out to register a key press (Rubber domes) is not ideal, as it requires that you use the entire bottom-out force to even get the actuation, as opposed to having at least the option of letting up. Plus, requiring the extra travel of bottoming out can be taxing, to even ensure a keypress

[tp4tissue]

Referencing my typing speed guide (linked below)

I believe    Bottom - out is essential for speed..

[Data]

I hulk smash the keys so bottom-out is unavoidable.  I'm sure it's from decades of gaming.

People use mechs for all sorts of reasons but trying not to bottom out consistently in only 4mm of key travel sounds like an exercise in frustration.

[tp4tissue]

I hulk smash the keys so bottom-out is unavoidable.  I'm sure it's from decades of gaming.

People use mechs for all sorts of reasons but trying not to bottom out consistently in only 4mm of key travel sounds like an exercise in frustration.

well you shouldn't hit it that hard, because it damages your wrist in the long term.

[chyros]

I bottom out on just about everything. I don't type enough (>22 hrs a day) to make ergonomic disadvantages of this a problem, I think xD .

[Tactile]

I built the keyboard I'm typing on now with very specific parts & assembly choices and the end result is a marvelous, mellow sound. With this keyboard the bottoming out sound is half the fun.

[kiwi99]

I hulk smash the keys so bottom-out is unavoidable.  I'm sure it's from decades of gaming.

People use mechs for all sorts of reasons but trying not to bottom out consistently in only 4mm of key travel sounds like an exercise in frustration.

well you shouldn't hit it that hard, because it damages your wrist in the long term.

Wrists smists, who needs em for the future we'll be typing with our minds by then

[DuckNorris]

Thank you guys for your replies! Makes me feel better haha because I do enjoy bottoming out,Idk really like the sound. I will run this by him I think it is somewhat important that the switch is not super light for you but basing a keyboard based off this seems limiting to me.

[kiwi99]

Thank you guys for your replies! Makes me feel better haha because I do enjoy bottoming out,Idk really like the sound. I will run this by him I think it is somewhat important that the switch is not super light for you but basing a keyboard based off this seems limiting to me.

I think most important part of choosing your switches for your keyboard is pick them based off what you like, too much of this hobby seems to people telling others what is the best, but in reality it all comes down to how you want your keyboard to feel, like personally I don't see how people use super heavy/light switches it just confuses me on both sides of the spectrum. Pick what you like and go with it 

Disclaimer: Topre is superior to every other switch

[Data]

Something's setting off my bull**** detector...

Thank you guys for your replies! Makes me feel better haha because I do enjoy bottoming out,Idk really like the sound. I will run this by him I think it is somewhat important that the switch is not super light for you but basing a keyboard based off this seems limiting to me.

I think most important part of choosing your switches for your keyboard is pick them based off what you like, too much of this hobby seems to people telling others what is the best, but in reality it all comes down to how you want your keyboard to feel, like personally I don't see how people use super heavy/light switches it just confuses me on both sides of the spectrum. Pick what you like and go with it 

Disclaimer: Topre is superior to every other switch

Wait, what is that?

ZOOM AND ENHANCE!

Disclaimer: Topre is superior to every other switch

ENHANCE!

Disclaimer: Topre is superior to every other switch

ENHANCE!!!

Disclaimer: Topre is superior to every other switch

HO HOOOOOOO!  There it is.  You sneaky bastage. 

[tp4tissue]

Thank you guys for your replies! Makes me feel better haha because I do enjoy bottoming out,Idk really like the sound. I will run this by him I think it is somewhat important that the switch is not super light for you but basing a keyboard based off this seems limiting to me.

I think most important part of choosing your switches for your keyboard is pick them based off what you like, too much of this hobby seems to people telling others what is the best, but in reality it all comes down to how you want your keyboard to feel, like personally I don't see how people use super heavy/light switches it just confuses me on both sides of the spectrum. Pick what you like and go with it 

Disclaimer: Ergodox is superior to every other keyboard

I completely Agree

[kiwi99]

Something's setting off my bull**** detector...

Thank you guys for your replies! Makes me feel better haha because I do enjoy bottoming out,Idk really like the sound. I will run this by him I think it is somewhat important that the switch is not super light for you but basing a keyboard based off this seems limiting to me.

I think most important part of choosing your switches for your keyboard is pick them based off what you like, too much of this hobby seems to people telling others what is the best, but in reality it all comes down to how you want your keyboard to feel, like personally I don't see how people use super heavy/light switches it just confuses me on both sides of the spectrum. Pick what you like and go with it 

Disclaimer: Topre is superior to every other switch

Wait, what is that?

ZOOM AND ENHANCE!

Disclaimer: Topre is superior to every other switch

ENHANCE!

Disclaimer: Topre is superior to every other switch

ENHANCE!!!

Disclaimer: Topre is superior to every other switch

HO HOOOOOOO!  There it is.  You sneaky bastage. 

You're performing a redundant step in your detective process. You can skip the enhance step because you cannot enhance something as perfect as topre 

[kiwi99]

Thank you guys for your replies! Makes me feel better haha because I do enjoy bottoming out,Idk really like the sound. I will run this by him I think it is somewhat important that the switch is not super light for you but basing a keyboard based off this seems limiting to me.

I think most important part of choosing your switches for your keyboard is pick them based off what you like, too much of this hobby seems to people telling others what is the best, but in reality it all comes down to how you want your keyboard to feel, like personally I don't see how people use super heavy/light switches it just confuses me on both sides of the spectrum. Pick what you like and go with it 

Disclaimer: Ergodox is superior to every other keyboard

I completely Disagree, Ergodox is meh at best without Topre

editing quotes are we now

[tp4tissue]

Thank you guys for your replies! Makes me feel better haha because I do enjoy bottoming out,Idk really like the sound. I will run this by him I think it is somewhat important that the switch is not super light for you but basing a keyboard based off this seems limiting to me.

I think most important part of choosing your switches for your keyboard is pick them based off what you like, too much of this hobby seems to people telling others what is the best, but in reality it all comes down to how you want your keyboard to feel, like personally I don't see how people use super heavy/light switches it just confuses me on both sides of the spectrum. Pick what you like and go with it 

Disclaimer: Ergodox is superior to every other keyboard

I completely agree, Ergodox is the best keyboard

Tp4 tells the truthiest Truths.. .. 

It's ok Kiwi99..  Not all of us are flawless truth tellers.

[davkol]

Bottoming out is an impact. An impact, that fingers (joints) have to absorb.

[jcoffin1981]

Nothing wrong with bottoming out, but I enjoy having the feeling of your fingertips floating on the keys.  Most switches, at least the cherries, the resistance slightly increases after actuation.  If you type hard you may enjoy Clears because there is more resistance at the bottom to absorb and decelerate the keystroke, but I find these fatiguing.  But avoiding bottoming out will save your joints.  More importantly is proper typing position.

I was experiencing tingling in fingertips in both hand and wrist inflammation and pain.  Ultimately I made seating adjustments (higher chair), raised the monitor, lowered they keyboard, and moved it very close to me instead of way off to the left (at work).  After a month of this most of my symptoms are gone.  If you can have your arms neutral at mid-ribcage with your wrists straight and keyboard very close to you (10 to 12 in. from abdomen) your wrists will thank you.  I used to type in an awkward position with the board very far away from me to the left and would lean my wrists on the desk and be haunched over.  This wrecked my wrists and my back.  I forced my boss to change it.  Also, 60 percent board is much more ergonomic with placement of mouse.

If you like to bottom out O-rings will  help absorb impact and train you to shorten your keystroke.

[DuckNorris]

Something's setting off my bull**** detector...

Thank you guys for your replies! Makes me feel better haha because I do enjoy bottoming out,Idk really like the sound. I will run this by him I think it is somewhat important that the switch is not super light for you but basing a keyboard based off this seems limiting to me.

I think most important part of choosing your switches for your keyboard is pick them based off what you like, too much of this hobby seems to people telling others what is the best, but in reality it all comes down to how you want your keyboard to feel, like personally I don't see how people use super heavy/light switches it just confuses me on both sides of the spectrum. Pick what you like and go with it 

Disclaimer: Topre is superior to every other switch

Wait, what is that?

ZOOM AND ENHANCE!

Disclaimer: Topre is superior to every other switch

ENHANCE!

Disclaimer: Topre is superior to every other switch

ENHANCE!!!

Disclaimer: Topre is superior to every other switch

HO HOOOOOOO!  There it is.  You sneaky bastage. 

Oh he got me good. I was wondering why there was a Topre keyboard in my amazon wishlist like when did I add that in there. That subliminal tactic you sneaky sneaky kiwi.

[DuckNorris]

Nothing wrong with bottoming out, but I enjoy having the feeling of your fingertips floating on the keys.  Most switches, at least the cherries, the resistance slightly increases after actuation.  If you type hard you may enjoy Clears because there is more resistance at the bottom to absorb and decelerate the keystroke, but I find these fatiguing.  But avoiding bottoming out will save your joints.  More importantly is proper typing position.

I was experiencing tingling in fingertips in both hand and wrist inflammation and pain.  Ultimately I made seating adjustments (higher chair), raised the monitor, lowered they keyboard, and moved it very close to me instead of way off to the left (at work).  After a month of this most of my symptoms are gone.  If you can have your arms neutral at mid-ribcage with your wrists straight and keyboard very close to you (10 to 12 in. from abdomen) your wrists will thank you.  I used to type in an awkward position with the board very far away from me to the left and would lean my wrists on the desk and be haunched over.  This wrecked my wrists and my back.  I forced my boss to change it.  Also, 60 percent board is much more ergonomic with placement of mouse.

If you like to bottom out O-rings will  help absorb impact and train you to shorten your keystroke.

@Davkol and you thank you for showing me this. I am taking these tips in because it is something I rarely take into account. As a software engineer I spend a lot of time on my keyboard sitting down so I need to really consider this before issues start becoming worse. Thank you very much!

[Erikdayo]

Well. I've been using mostly Topre lately along with my laptop keyboard so I find bottoming out mostly unavoidable. When I use my MX Reds more I still mostly bottomed out even though they were lighter and linear. I also find that sometimes if I try to use a lighter touch I miss some presses because maybe I only pressed the key down 1 mm instead of whatever is required for actuation.

[Tangtawan]

I really love the sound of bottoming out, and I always bottoms out every switches including stiff Cherry MX Whites.

[1391406]

In my experience, attempting to not bottom out is a waste of time. For those who aren't arthritic or suffering from some other affliction, don't bother.

[jaffers]

I love me a good bottom

[keykaiser]

Relax and it will just happen.

[Hypersphere]

I've never understood why some people consider bottoming out one's keystrokes on a keyboard to be taboo.

My own typing style is to bottom out every keystroke, no matter which keyboard or switch I am using. This habit might be due in part to the fact that I learned to type on a manual typewriter.

This style of typing does make a few switches difficult for me to use. For example, I do not like to type on Cherry mx clear switches, because the steeply rising slope of the force-displacement curve discourages bottoming out and makes long typing sessions fatiguing for those who do like to bottom out.

Switches I particularly enjoy include Topre (45g and 55g), IBM Capacitive Buckling Spring (Model F), IBM Membrane Buckling Spring (Model M), and SKCM Alps (Blue or White).