How do you avoid getting screwed on group buys and classifieds as a buyer and seller

[NorrisB]

Buying:  The majority of people selling on group buys and classifieds have little to no feed, how do you protect yourself from being screwed by these individuals?  

Selling:  What stops a buyer from doing a charge back after they've already received the goods, how do you protect yourself from scum bag buyers.

[mbc]

luck, trust

[thegunner100]

Most of the groupbuy runners have a good rep here on GH. And yes... luck + trust.

[emptythecache]

I've yet to have a sour experience buying or selling on geekhack. With the exception of a trade where the other person was surprised by the color of the keycaps (a product of weird lighting), and that was no big deal, we just traded back with no hard feelings. I trust you guys.

[keyboardlover]

Like anything else that involves exchange of money via the internet, be super careful.

[seferphier]

damn, i don't have enough feedback on this forum.

[Reptile]

I have never bought anything from anyone without feedback; But I have done trades which I required them to send the item first.

I also had multiple buyer feedbacks before I even thought of selling something :smile:

[fohat.digs]

Although I have a love-hate relationship with ebay (basically love them as a buyer and hate them as a seller) the feedback system is a pretty good idea.

Not that it cannot be scammed or gamed, but it generally works well when strangers are trying to do business with each other.

The big problem is starting up fresh with "0" everything. Somebody has to trust you the first couple of times, and reward you with feedback when you do good.

Ebay/Paypal is really horrible when it allows buyers to suck money back from sellers on their word alone. I have gotten screwed more as a seller than a buyer.

Presumably, there is an "honor system" around here, although the ugliest vitriol seems to be reserved for people with personality conflicts, rather than business disputes!

[Daniel Beaver]

Most people aren't trying to screw you.

But those who are trying to screw you often use poor grammar and come off as sleazy.

[alaricljs]

Most of the screwing I've seen in group buys has been by the shipping co.  Some managers are being super nice and setting aside extra stock for those situations and finding ways to suck it up or at least soften the blow.  There have been some botched GBs, however I can't think of one that got to the collections stage and lost anyone money.  There was the 1 GB where PP tried to make it really hard, but even that got smoothed over by other member(s) stepping up.

I don't know of anything going terrible in classifieds, but I don't read the threads in there unless the item is of interest.

[Gawkbasher]

And aside from the groupbuys (because many of them take longer than 45 days after you send money), adding the extra 2.9% + $0.30 to paypal not sending as gift offers you some amount of protection in case anything happens.

Hasn't been an issue yet though...I buy a lot of stuff on here. :>

[alaricljs]

How come no one is using Amazon Payments?

[Djuzuh]

Isn't it hard to set up ?

[daerid]

I don't approach things from the viewpoint that I'm going to get screwed. Yeah, there's some people out there who are out to f**k people over, but in my experience they're the minority. So I usually just trust people until they give me a reason not to.

It's worked out for me fairly well.

[Omerta]

Yeah i've been pretty afraid from my listing and i figured nobody would be doing many hits on my keyboard.

When i first placed my listing i had over 5 people with like less then 5 posts PM me wanting $70-100 for each CC key then calling me names when i said 'No thanks'

I'm having a hard time selling/trading my board. Sometimes telling apart scammers and people who are trustworthy is pretty simple & plausible just by gauging their enthusiasm with their product and keyboards in general.

I guess a little twist to the Dr. Suess quote in my signature could be:

"Be who you are and say what you feel, Those who don't, steal - and those who do, don't"

Not the best but w/e lol. I'd rather someone be true to them selves instead of trying to be someone they are not. As someone who is acting like someone else, is not someone worth trusting.

[tp4tissue]

The internet has it's moments of "Pull and Pray"

Groupbuy is one of them....

[Nunez]

You can trust me

But seriously, I get the vibe most people here are out to help the community. What goes around comes around sort of thing.

[alaricljs]

I sold my Leopold Black 87 w/ clears to a 1 post user with no issues.  He has since disappeared from GH after a whopping 5 days active.

[thegunner100]

Some honest people just lurk around the forums and buy stuff.

[cactux]

buy or sell from well know GH members. check iTraders

[thegunner100]

I miss the WTB CC from this morning... the discussion was starting to get good :behindsofa:

[Hak Foo]

Well, the group buy is insulated by fear.  If someone rips off 50 or 100 of us, odds are there are at least a few of us with enough free time to make it very painful.

[fstop]

Yeah, never had any fear participating in group buys.Even if the person organizing a group buy has few rep, usually their post count or activeness in the community can reassure any doubts. Plus they have a lot to lose if they're collecting payment from so many of us . I don't think you should be worried about these at all - and if you are, just check out the users and see what kind of reputation they have on the forums. I would say most of them have already done a group buy in the past or are trusted members.

As for classified... don't send payment as gift if you don't trust them. Pay the 4% on your end and it will save you from getting burned. If you sell something, you should almost always be getting tracking as it is, but definitely so if you feel like the person on the other end might cheat you.

But so far I've had nothing but pleasant experiences here on Geekhack. Some really great people here who are very considerate when using classifieds. We all share the same addiction (err, love) for keyboards.

[Gawkbasher]

As for classified... don't send payment as gift if you don't trust them. Pay the 4% on your end and it will save you from getting burned. If you sell something, you should almost always be getting tracking as it is, but definitely so if you feel like the person on the other end might cheat you.

I think I've sent payment as gift maybe once ever.  I hope the GB organizers don't take it as a sign of distrust.  I'm just a tremendous tightwad.

[i3oilermaker]

What is the risk of a PayPal gift?

[lROOl]

paypal is pretty safe you can just dispute and get a refund

[alaricljs]

What is the risk of a PayPal gift?

You can't do this:

paypal is pretty safe you can just dispute and get a refund

if you pay as a gift.

[Lanx]

also if you send too many "gifts" paypal has been known to "hold" your account and associated monies for , forever. Cuz well, sending a payment as a gift while getting something in return is not a gift, it's an exchange, gift is really for grandma to give you a digital check on your bday. If you value your paypal don't send or receive gifts unless they really are that.

[fohat.digs]

I have seen the opposite problem. Although I have a Paypal account that is at least 4 years old, and a feedback count well over 100 and also 100% positive, they started putting a 3-week hold on any payments I received as a seller, even continuing after positive feedback on the transaction had been left by both sides.

Naturally, any payment "out" from me was sucked out of my account instantly.

There has been no such holds on a few gifts I received.

[ForestFunK]

I have seen the opposite problem. Although I have a Paypal account that is at least 4 years old, and a feedback count well over 100 and also 100% positive, they started putting a 3-week hold on any payments I received as a seller, even continuing after positive feedback on the transaction had been left by both sides.

Naturally, any payment "out" from me was sucked out of my account instantly.

There has been no such holds on a few gifts I received.

This is just PayPal doing whatever the f*** they want with your money, without getting punished for abusing their monopoly position. But what can you do if there is no alternative for sending payments internationally quickly.

OT:
I'm fairly new to geekhack and was not worried about my first two buys from the classifieds. But that's mainly because it was not much money involved (< $30) and the sellers had lots of positve feedback.

[captain]

Below?
I haven't been screwed...yet.

[mkawa]

i regularly deal in camera equipment for which 3-400$ is considered "cheap". in comparison, keyboard stuff is pretty tame, and we have a very very low loss rate here. in fact, i think last time i checked, we have had something like 2 negative feedbacks over the last year site-wide.

[1391401]

This doesn't answer your question but basically anything I buy I ask myself "if I burned this money would I care?"  

If I lose $25 I'll live.  If I lose $100 I'll live.  As mkawa said stuff on here doesn't typically end up being that expensive.

[WhiteFireDragon]

GH isn't an ideal place where a scammer would spend his time to try and screw you over. There are a couple forums that are a scammer's paradise though, just not this one.

[mkawa]

as of today, 5/15, we have 5 negative feedbacks and 3 neutral feedbacks left on iTrader for the past year out of 3377 transactions. that's a 99.8% positive feedback rate site-wide. caveat emptor, absolutely, but i don't think it's much of a stretch to say that geekhackers are just pretty darn good folks on average.