We need a comparison: Filco, Das, Deck (Legend and Francium), Ducky, WASD Code

[berserkfan]

OK guys, I've been seeing so much talk about the different brands, I think sooner or later you guys are gonna meet up for a keyboard event.

When that happens, please bring your Filco, Das, Deck, Ducky and WASD Codes for a type-off.

I really want to know what is the best mechanical keyboard. Aficionados swear by their favorite brand, but until you have tried different brands side by side (way too expensive for normal people to do), you won't know how they really are different.

[phetto]

Filco and made in taiwan duckys rule! The difference is cherry and costar stabilisers and the taste is what really matters.

[tp4tissue]

aaaachhheeeuuumm...... 

post comparison results....

Winnar:  Egdx....



but out of those antiquated design boards..... probably the wasd code... since it has a slight edge in features...

THOUGH.. if you consider that you can modchip the filco for programmability... that tips it towards the filco greatly.. assuming the user is not too pu$$y to do this mod.

[dante]

Filco and made in taiwan duckys rule! The difference is cherry and costar stabilisers and the taste is what really matters.

Why do you say Chinese Ducky's are poor?

[kektr0city]

Filco boards are pretty sweet!  Leopold are great as well if not slightly lower quality (imho) than Filco.  I liked the Leopold I had, I just really wanted red switches.

[Linkbane]

Filco boards are pretty sweet!  Leopold are great as well if not slightly lower quality (imho) than Filco.  I liked the Leopold I had, I just really wanted red switches.

Just some food for thought, is the minute difference in weight (not an accurate description of quality IMO, given that board size/number of PCBs vary) really important? Has anyone actually just dropped and broken their keyboard? Because a lot of times I really think that this whole quality thing, unless it's about materials (like aluminum cases or plate-mount) is really rather not important on the longevity or function, and if that is true, what does quality really mean?

[davkol]

I don't think it matters nowadays... we're not talking about xarmor or the old blackwidow anymore. Any manufacturer might have a bad batch every now and then, but we don't have enough data to know about it (probably except something huge, such as bad soldering on QFRs).

What does matter are features and keycaps, but that's pretty subjective.

[BlackWidowMan777]

OK guys, I've been seeing so much talk about the different brands, I think sooner or later you guys are gonna meet up for a keyboard event.

When that happens, please bring your Filco, Das, Deck, Ducky and WASD Codes for a type-off.

I really want to know what is the best mechanical keyboard. Aficionados swear by their favorite brand, but until you have tried different brands side by side (way too expensive for normal people to do), you won't know how they really are different.

Yes! This MUST be done at least to keep the ever burgeoning keyboard startup companies honest and so that honest buyers will know what is bang for buck the best keyboard.

So, I propose getting a bunch of typists from the different keyboard communities, even professional typists, and have them each sit down in a musical chairs fashion at different keyboard stations with keyboards masked to show no identifying characteristics such as branding, colour, keycaps yet still enable the tactility required to type at their peak abilities. This can be achieved for example by blindfolding the particpant until they have found the 'f' and 'j' keys and then have someone place a cover/roof over the keyboard so that it cannot be seen! A simple cardboard roof with cutouts for the arms/wrists will suffice.

Then we will have them perform the exact same tests for each keyboard (with blindfolds removed of course). Then we will know quantitatively which keyboard/switches are best for whatever typing/gaming tests that you guys can come up with! All the detailed analysis should be made publicly available. Who knows, a humble rubber dome may rule the roost in flat out speed – it is not out of the realms of possiblity, but we should know. No more smoke and mirrors!

[BlackWidowMan777]

Klavaro is a freely available program for Windows and Linux that measures velocity, accuracy and that elusive thing we all are told to aspire to: 'fluidity'. This is a stock program that can be used. But there are so many experienced programmers on this site that I'm sure more complex metrics can be included for statistical analysis. Look at the car industry - 'Bang For Buck' testing is used to award best car for the year based on performance metrics. Issues such as NVH are also able to be quantitatively measured to give buyers a guide on just how they want to spend their money. When I went to pick up my Das Ultimate and Matias Mini I was talking to the guy at the counter about keyboards when he all of a sudden reached under the table and presented me a NIB cheapo Keypartner rubber dome keyboard free of charge. It has a PS/2 adaptor and I place it atop my mechanical keyboards (roofed of course) when my hands are greasy or whilst eating and surfing geekhack. It feels like my Realforce 55g god-dammit. So prove to me that the realforce was worth the god-damn shipping all the way to Australia!

[berserkfan]

Let me reiterate what you just said: no more smoke and mirrors!

EXACTLY

We need that. Real blind tests with professionals, in a controlled and scientific setting.

No more 'my x beats your y' macho talk over the internet.

The practical problem is, who will sponsor such an event? I think no keyboard manufacturer dares. Certainly not Topre, if your Keypartner cheapo rubber dome REALLY feels like a Topre.

The best solution is a geekhack one. Cptbadass and Moose and whoever that likes to organize and attend keyboard events, they should get together at least 20 guys with maybe 50 keyboards and 50 cardboard cutouts and do exactly what you said over a couple of days. Play or simulate work (eg programming or typing or whatever) with each keyboard for like 10 minutes.

At the end we will have some real scientific information. I really hope for the best. It would be incredibly funny if someone snuck a rubber dome inside, and everyone thought it was the best Topre they had ever felt.

OK guys, I've been seeing so much talk about the different brands, I think sooner or later you guys are gonna meet up for a keyboard event.

When that happens, please bring your Filco, Das, Deck, Ducky and WASD Codes for a type-off.

I really want to know what is the best mechanical keyboard. Aficionados swear by their favorite brand, but until you have tried different brands side by side (way too expensive for normal people to do), you won't know how they really are different.

Yes! This MUST be done at least to keep the ever burgeoning keyboard startup companies honest and so that honest buyers will know what is bang for buck the best keyboard.

So, I propose getting a bunch of typists from the different keyboard communities, even professional typists, and have them each sit down in a musical chairs fashion at different keyboard stations with keyboards masked to show no identifying characteristics such as branding, colour, keycaps yet still enable the tactility required to type at their peak abilities. This can be achieved for example by blindfolding the particpant until they have found the 'f' and 'j' keys and then have someone place a cover/roof over the keyboard so that it cannot be seen! A simple cardboard roof with cutouts for the arms/wrists will suffice.

Then we will have them perform the exact same tests for each keyboard (with blindfolds removed of course). Then we will know quantitatively which keyboard/switches are best for whatever typing/gaming tests that you guys can come up with! All the detailed analysis should be made publicly available. Who knows, a humble rubber dome may rule the roost in flat out speed – it is not out of the realms of possiblity, but we should know. No more smoke and mirrors!

[FoxWolf1]

Let me reiterate what you just said: no more smoke and mirrors!

EXACTLY

We need that. Real blind tests with professionals, in a controlled and scientific setting.

No more 'my x beats your y' macho talk over the internet.

The practical problem is, who will sponsor such an event? I think no keyboard manufacturer dares. Certainly not Topre, if your Keypartner cheapo rubber dome REALLY feels like a Topre.

The best solution is a geekhack one. Cptbadass and Moose and whoever that likes to organize and attend keyboard events, they should get together at least 20 guys with maybe 50 keyboards and 50 cardboard cutouts and do exactly what you said over a couple of days. Play or simulate work (eg programming or typing or whatever) with each keyboard for like 10 minutes.

At the end we will have some real scientific information. I really hope for the best. It would be incredibly funny if someone snuck a rubber dome inside, and everyone thought it was the best Topre they had ever felt.

I don't think an event like that would really be meaningful, for the simple reason that you'll be getting popularity data for a subject that's a matter of preference. If you give two keyboards to each of 100 people, and 99 prefer the first, with one preferring the second, it doesn't follow that the first is better than the second, only that the first is suited to a much more common preference.

Here's an analogy. Not many people wear US men's size 18 shoes; far more people wear, say, size 12. But it'd be absolutely ridiculous to say that size 12 is therefore a better shoe size than size 18.

Now, there are some tests that, I suppose, you could theoretically build equipment to run. For example, you could measure the delay between a switch activating and the system receiving the input (someone made a testing machine like that for mice, and I don't see why you couldn't do the same for keyboards). Of course, any difference in results would likely be irrelevant to most if not all users.

Got lots of money? You could do objective durability tests. Buy many keyboards of each type and perform the same destructive act to each (dropping a heavy object, dripping liquid on it, etc. Of course, you need multiple repetitions of each test for each keyboard, to try and average out anomalies). See how many die. Repeat it enough and you'll have some information that might be useful.

Of course, no matter how many objective tests you run, in many cases, subjective matters (comfort, appearance, suitability of features to user) will wind up being more important than anything you have tested, often enough that it just doesn't make sense to talk about determining a "best".

[BlackWidowMan777]

Let me reiterate what you just said: no more smoke and mirrors!

EXACTLY

We need that. Real blind tests with professionals, in a controlled and scientific setting.

No more 'my x beats your y' macho talk over the internet.

The practical problem is, who will sponsor such an event? I think no keyboard manufacturer dares. Certainly not Topre, if your Keypartner cheapo rubber dome REALLY feels like a Topre.

The best solution is a geekhack one. Cptbadass and Moose and whoever that likes to organize and attend keyboard events, they should get together at least 20 guys with maybe 50 keyboards and 50 cardboard cutouts and do exactly what you said over a couple of days. Play or simulate work (eg programming or typing or whatever) with each keyboard for like 10 minutes.

At the end we will have some real scientific information. I really hope for the best. It would be incredibly funny if someone snuck a rubber dome inside, and everyone thought it was the best Topre they had ever felt.

I don't think an event like that would really be meaningful, for the simple reason that you'll be getting popularity data for a subject that's a matter of preference. If you give two keyboards to each of 100 people, and 99 prefer the first, with one preferring the second, it doesn't follow that the first is better than the second, only that the first is suited to a much more common preference.

Here's an analogy. Not many people wear US men's size 18 shoes; far more people wear, say, size 12. But it'd be absolutely ridiculous to say that size 12 is therefore a better shoe size than size 18.

Now, there are some tests that, I suppose, you could theoretically build equipment to run. For example, you could measure the delay between a switch activating and the system receiving the input (someone made a testing machine like that for mice, and I don't see why you couldn't do the same for keyboards). Of course, any difference in results would likely be irrelevant to most if not all users.

Got lots of money? You could do objective durability tests. Buy many keyboards of each type and perform the same destructive act to each (dropping a heavy object, dripping liquid on it, etc. Of course, you need multiple repetitions of each test for each keyboard, to try and average out anomalies). See how many die. Repeat it enough and you'll have some information that might be useful.

Of course, no matter how many objective tests you run, in many cases, subjective matters (comfort, appearance, suitability of features to user) will wind up being more important than anything you have tested, often enough that it just doesn't make sense to talk about determining a "best".

Of course it is not just about preference. We are talking real money. The beauty of Cherry Mx for vendors is that there are so many flavours. But can they really prove that black or red is better for gaming? This is measureable. If they can do it for cars why not for keyboards. Topre may be the Rolls Royce and QFR reds the Nissan GTR whereas Poker browns may be the WRX in keyboard terms. So why not do a bang for buck like for cars: performance cars over +100K eg. Bentley sports vs AMG c63 and also budget sports. Then there is always an overall bang for buck winner when taking all criteria into account.

If 99/100 people unknowingly received the highest average tenfastfingers scores on the Razer Blackwidow shouldn't we know about it. Then people with a certain budget could buy it and not forever wonder if there's something better out there.

[BlackWidowMan777]

Typeracer may be willing to sponsor such an event. Bout time Sean Wrona found a use for his speed. 

@berserkfan Most definitely we should conduct a Pepsi challenge between Topre and Rubber Dome 

[berserkfan]

I agree with Foxwolf1 that keyboards are extremely personal and subjective.

But you're absolutely right, blackwidowman777. A lot of sales are hyped and only blind tests will help dispel some myths. I strongly suspect that once that plastic casing is removed, a Razer won't feel different from a Filco (although the quality difference may mean Razer breaks down before Filco does after a few million keypresses as opposed to Filco lasting the full 50m keypresses), and longtime Filco owners won't be able to tell Filcos from CoolerMasters.

Typeracer may be willing to sponsor such an event. Bout time Sean Wrona found a use for his speed. 

@berserkfan Most definitely we should conduct a Pepsi challenge between Topre and Rubber Dome 

[davkol]

Different batches of Cherry MX feel different, sometimes very different. How would you deal with that?

[FoxWolf1]

But can they really prove that black or red is better for gaming? This is measureable.

Okay, so, let's consider how we'd do this experiment. Suppose you get a bunch of people together and have them game either on an MX Black and then an MX Red, or an MX Red and then an MX Black. Now suppose 60 percent score higher with MX Red, and 40 percent score higher with MX Black. Does this mean that Red is better than Black? At best, only for people in the 60 percent. The same goes for tests of typing speed.

Of course, you could have a robot, with "perfect" ability, push the keys, much as you could do (in theory) with cars, to see which is faster independent of driver skill. But, while you might get decent results for the car, I expect that, in the keyboard case, the results for the robot will bear little relation to what you'd see with a human. Of course, you could make the robot have imperfections in its typing skill, and responsiveness to feedback (which only becomes meaningful once skill is made imperfect), but then you'll see different results with different robot designs, as you do with different humans.

If they can do it for cars why not for keyboards.

Last time I checked, car reviewers had no way of objectively determining the "best" car; in fact, most car reviews tend to focus very heavily on subjective impressions. Of course, magazines will often run comparisons to determine which one they like the best, but if you look at five different magazines, you'll typically get five different results. And even when there is agreement, it's hardly rare for cases to arise where a person would be happier with a car that didn't rank first.

If 99/100 people unknowingly received the highest average tenfastfingers scores on the Razer Blackwidow shouldn't we know about it. Then people with a certain budget could buy it and not forever wonder if there's something better out there.

That doesn't work, either. Suppose that 99 percent of the highest scorers on 10FF used rubber dome, for the simple reasons that there are 1293489902384902384908239048239 dome keyboards out there for every mechanical. Does this mean that rubber domes make you type faster? No. Imagine it this way: suppose that having a mechanical makes you type 50 places better on the 10FF high score list versus rubber dome (probably an exaggeration), but, of the top, say, 200 10FF players, only the 125th fastest guy has a mechanical. So you look at the top 100, and see there's only one mechanical keyboard user, in spot #75 (because he's 125th in skill, and gets +50 from the keyboard). Are you gonna say that we can conclude, looking at that list, that rubber domes make you type faster, even though we've stipulated that that's not the case?

[dorkvader]

I would say that keyboarding metrics are a mixture of objective standards and subjective responses. As with many other things it's not always the objective data that matters: it's the interpretation that counts.

For example: something that can be measured somewhat objectively:  switch cycle lifetime rating. Cherry is rated for 50 million, rubberdomes between 2 million and 20 million (or so). Other high reliability keyboards are rated for 100 million or more (hall effect switches are rated for 30 billion actuations). They are measureably and objectively better in this respect.

But how do we interpret that number? I will say that used worn hall effect switches are prone to binding on off axis hits. This can be alleviated with some DIY and lube, but is hard to reverse once significant wear has occurred. So they don't feel as nice after a few years of heavy use. A cherry keyboard might be better in this respect, as off axis hits are usually fine for them.

Sure we can qualify this data, and even come up with a new measure and quantify some of it, but the issue with that is unless you have significant experience, or have performed experiments yourself, it's not very relatable. (If I were to invent an angle / distance function for force graphs to show you the off axis binding friction, you wouldn't be able to relate that data very easily.)

The world is necessarily a very subjective place. Some philosophers say there is nothing objective (there are no uninterpreted facts, Socrates/Plato would likely make a similar claim).

That said, making some third-party (so, tested in the same way) numbers for major keyboards is very important and useful. However, just as in any experiment, your error value is nonzero.

I encourage this to be done, and done with a proper experimental design (and ANOVA table or similar analysis of levels/factors) let's get some real data we can trust! Data we can use!

That doesn't work, either. Suppose that 99 percent of the highest scorers on 10FF used rubber dome, for the simple reasons that there are 1293489902384902384908239048239 dome keyboards out there for every mechanical. Does this mean that rubber domes make you type faster? No. Imagine it this way: suppose that having a mechanical makes you type 50 places better on the 10FF high score list versus rubber dome (probably an exaggeration), but, of the top, say, 200 10FF players, only the 125th fastest guy has a mechanical. So you look at the top 100, and see there's only one mechanical keyboard user, in spot #75 (because he's 125th in skill, and gets +50 from the keyboard). Are you gonna say that we can conclude, looking at that list, that rubber domes make you type faster, even though we've stipulated that that's not the case?

Right, or even if a mech doesn't make you type any faster, but it prevents RSI in a long term study (assuming such things are meaningful) or maybe not bottoming out the keys all the time is somehow (subjectively) more comfortable or (objectively) less vibration amplitude on finger bones. maybe you can type for longer on a mech before getting weary, or for more years without getting RSI. Such things are hard to determine, as everyone is different. I'd still like to see such a study done, and the results.

[BlackWidowMan777]

I respect your esteemed opinions FoxWolf1 and dorkvader and I have not contributed to this community anywhere near to the extent that you have and I have merely been a lurker for most of the time since joining some six months ago. In those six months, I have been touched by this community's affection for one another and for Smallfry...and your common love of keyboards, in particular mechanical keyboards. As I write this , I ponder at what berserkfan's OP awoke in me. He struck a chord and I want to support him. Here I am composing my 14th post yet I am surrounded by close to 20 mechanical keyboards with a total cost I am ashamed to even contemplate! No one save you guys even know of this costly fetish and yet I am now lusting after the Deck Francium. I am slightly disgusted with myself - yet to see the care and love I give to my acquisitions...you would think they are my long lost children. I really don't think you need to be married to more than one wife let alone mechanical keyboards that should last a lifetime each. I am not a collector of anything even of wives but I do get satisfaction from typing as it calms me down when I am stressed. I listen to it for ASMR purposes. I love trying to type fast.

I used the analogy of cars and not say tennis racquets as with a car you can be fatally injured. Likewise with a keyboard you can wind up with RSI and carpel tunnel syndrome. So it is important that various claims be backed up and not perpetuated. Likewise on typeracer, Amazon ads purvey the latest mechanical keyboards and in the forums the fastest typists uphold the benefits of mechanical keyboards for increased speed. Tennis racquets can cause damage to the opposing player's nuts through a well directed swing but otherwise a disproportionately large right or left arm is what you will end up with. Plus tennis racquets do vary in physical dimensions and shape. Keyboards don't, at least not the alphanumeric portion. Am I paying big bucks to get RSI or am I paying big bucks so that I need keyboard storage? Would I have been better off just buying a new rubber dome? I have a 1990 Model M (not Lexmark) but is the Model F so much better and will I be the one forking out $5000 for the last remaining NIB SSK in five years time? Yes, yes, and yes until I saw berserkfan's post and I recognized someone not willing to accept the status quo at least without a fight. While more and more keyboards are being released on a monthly basis are we merely to be suckers waiting to gobble up every new keyboard before they have even been mass released. Like the code, the first batch of franciums will be gone in the blink of an eye. Will the foremost expert on planet earth tell us what he truly thinks of it even as he is presented a brand new one so that he can take a slide show of pretty pics with toy figures? Do we really have to buy it to find out if it is the same old same old only with pretty lights but in a tenkeyless form-factor? I say we are aficionados, not suckers, and any new keyboard should not be held in awe but put to the acid test. But what acid test? Where are the benchmarks? Keyboard preference is smoke and mirrors to a degree. How many of us own 20, 60, even 100+ cars and sportscars? Even if I had that kind of money I wouldn't. I looked at NRMA's best car of 2000 and got the Passat V6 and I still have it. My neighbour's AMG c63 is a mere annoyance every morning as he starts it up and then returns inside to finish his cup of coffee and croissants.


Keyboard Preference: When typewriters were in fashion, typing speed contests were common. Performance wise it was up to the guy selling it to make sure it was in good order and prove that given the same article his typist could type it out faster than on the next typewriter. Cherry MX batches vary. So keyboards vary. Even in the same keyboard you may have one dud switch. QC anyone? Well in our proposed test the typers would discern any apparent discrepancies between key feel. This can be documented, coins be stacked on the offending keys, and that make of keyboard marked as suffering poor quality control. If it came down to a dead heat between the Filco Majestouch blues versus the daskeyboard with blues then someone could get one batch of mx blues and replace them with the stock ones in these boards, eliminating skewed results.

Keyboard preferences that may affect typing performance and that can be measured are:
1. so-called blackwidow keys being somehow closer together. A tape measure plus the performance results should suffice.
2. ummm, what other keyboard preferences would affect performance when your hands are under a cardboard box and hence render this whole proposition invalid? Ummm....stock keyboards with the stock keys they came with, with their stock backlighting colours, and their inherent key feel? Would the two best wine-tasting experts in the world smell two totally different aromas from the exact same wine in the exact same glass? What would it matter if two professional typists felt the exact same keyboard in two different ways. If we're talking the same passage to type out with a stopwatch then let's see the result. Then tell people that of course each keyboard will feel different and blah blah blah and it takes time to acclimatize etc. but at the end of the day there will be a winner. If it is the Filco then let them continue to be placed on a pedestal. If they are on average 1 microsecond faster than the g80-3800 then is their superior quality and durability worth the premium price tag?
 
Gaming: Razer supports professional gamers. Do they use blues? Is double tapping an issue? Let's see. I don't game but if blues, reds, browns and blacks were tested and were found to be similar for a certain type of game then that would be interesting to someone interested in a keyboard  he/she intends to use equally for typing and gaming. If for a particular game, blacks and reds were 60 to 40 in favour of blacks then extrapolated to the entire population of gamers it wouldn't really matter would it. But if it was 90 to 10 it would matter. Then only 10 percent would need to try black on a whim not 100% as the keyboard companies would want.

Car companies: if 3 different magazines chose as no. 1 three different cars they have narrowed my choices down for me and I won't be concerned with choosing the bottom 3 of each list lest the guy at the traffic lights thinks me a fool.

Shoe size and one size does not fit all: the tallest woman in China had to have her shoes custom made for her. Her shoe was huge. And so were her hands. Keyboards unlike shoes come in one size in term of the keys our typists will be using. If there are left hand macros getting in the way this may or may not be to the detriment of that keyboard. But that Chinese woman's custom keyboard will not be used in this test as her hands would be too statistically large to cater for.

Tenfastfingers: we will not be looking at that site's historical results as I doubt they recorded who was using what keyboard at the time. In our test, typist one will type passage 1 on keyboard 1 with the time duly recorded. Typist 2 will then type passage 1 on keyboard 1 and so forth until all the keyboards have been tested. A rubber dome will be used in the test, cherry mx, alps and topre. So each typist no matter his wallet size or the overall population's distribution of keyboard types will be able to test his/her speed on the same type and quantity of keyboards as the other participants. For those interested things such as accuracy, fluidity, decibel readings, no. of stacked coins to actuation are easily measured. I would be interested to know which keyboard was conducive to the highest fluidity of typing without being a slow-coach so that I could be the best typist I can be and enjoy all the sensory and holistic benefits of typing on it.

I defer to beserkfan and other knowledgeable members of geekhack to consider the possibilities of such a geekhack benchmark.

[davkol]

tl;dr

Get an ergodox.

Actually, I read that. Still, get an ergodox.

^_^

[BlackWidowMan777]

tl;dr

Get an ergodox.

Actually, I read that. Still, get an ergodox.

^_^

Lol, I'll try out the multi-quote feature next time.

I'm surprised you didn't suggest the IBM 3270 terminal keyboard (triple shot keycaps)....

Might just have to try an Ergodox then, davkol...or Ergodome 

[Elias Camber]

hi,

I'd have to say I agree with what dorkvader said... the world IS a very subjective place. Even more so we are all very different. I recently typed a book with 500k letters... or actuations (don't know how you say that in english). I felt fine on my keyboard. Now, would I have been faster or more comfortable on another board with other switches or a better built quality... maybe. But even though it's kind of my job to write stuff, I feel like my typing is way too poor to even get close to reaching whatever limitations my board and it's built quality might have. I can't even type 10 fingers properly. But even if one can... how close are you to those expert-testers some here suggested? and how different are you to them? In my opinion: very different. Your whole physics... arm lenght, fingers, how you rest your wrists while typing, whether you lean back or sit straight, the height of your table... all aspects contributing to how comfortable you feel while typing. I would even say it matters if it's your custom keyboard or an equaly nice keyboard with the exact same quality... just because you know it's yours and you like it influences you subconsciously.
But setting aside all that, chances are that you're just not as good a typist as those Pros who would test those boards. So in the end what do you get from such a test? You might know afterwards that the Pros consider a specific board to be the best... but how do you or me profit from this? I'd say we don't, because we're not them... we're different and therefore what matters to those test subjects might not influence us at all. I think it's kind of an Ego-thing... we like to hear this board is rated best by Pros in order to get it and feel that we have that board, even though we might type better on another board just because all the aspects that are irelevant to those Pros affect us much more.

Now don't get me wrong... it's always nice to see a test of any kind concerning keyboards, I just think that the outcome for me as an individual wouldn't mean much in regard of what board I should get. Hell, I think I wouldn't get it just because I don't like the looks .

[Tony]

Who cares? We will get all of them if our wallet permits.

[terran5992]

Who cares? We will get all of them if our wallet permits.

A permanent member of wallethack.com

[Oobly]

IMHO, when you get to this league of boards, they're all good. The PCB layout, quality, soldering, etc are all very good on those boards. That's the one area the QFR still doesn't quite match up to these on, IMO.

I wish more of them would have cutouts on the switch holes, however, so we can do mods without desoldering. But then you're getting to the next level.... Customs.