For my next board, should I get...

[macguy80]

I can't decide, so I respectfully ask you:

A. KUL with browns (I love my KUL with clears, but after a while it's just too tiring. I know, ideally, you're not supposed to bottom out clears, but for some (strange?) reason, I just love the CLACK that Cherry MX switches make when they bottom out., so therefore mx browns!?

—OR—

B. Matias Tactile Pro 4 (SO much more tactile and crisp than the QuietPro it would effectively replace)?

Yeah, I know there are so many other and possibly better boards out there, but those are the two I'm debating between. The price difference is only $20 between the two.

[bocahgundul]

HHKB bro   

[Halverson]

Browns are terrible, matias are great!

Hhkb would be top though

[macguy80]

I hear ya on the HHKB -- if I could wrap my head around the layout, I'd go for it, but type-S of course.

For me the dream Topre board would be a RF 87u all 55g type-S, but, barring that, so far Matias 1 browns 0

[fanpeople]

HHKB

[sth]

hhkb

[rowdy]

SSK

[bocahgundul]

HHKB

FTFY rowdy bro 

[rowdy]

HHKB

FTFY rowdy bro 

I just wanted to be different.

Yeah, HHKB really.

[Evo_Spec]

Just to give some insight about wrapping your head around the HHKB layout, I've had the pleasure of using some HHKB's but don't own one and just in a days time or so of using an HHKB I've actually changed my layout because it really did make sense to put backspace on backslash and ctrl on caplocks.

[ileben]

[...] it really did make sense to put backspace on backslash and ctrl on caplocks.

I still don't understand the Ctrl on Capslock hype. I'm a programmer and the combo I use by far the most is Ctrl+XCV. Pressing that with Caps seems to require much more strain, at least for my hand (and my hands a big). The natural position for pinkie keys is offset downwards from other fingers, not upwards, that's also why all the ergo builds shift the last column down. Can someone enlighten me?

[fanpeople]

Just to give some insight about wrapping your head around the HHKB layout, I've had the pleasure of using some HHKB's but don't own one and just in a days time or so of using an HHKB I've actually changed my layout because it really did make sense to put backspace on backslash and ctrl on caplocks.

To add to this, I was comfortable with the traditional layout of keyboards and dont generally stray from the norms when it comes to technology (plus only learnt to touch type about a year prior, although this could have made it easier to adapt). It took me possibly a week to be comfortable with the layout and then maybe another 1-2 weeks for it to be instinct.

[Macsmasher]

[...] it really did make sense to put backspace on backslash and ctrl on caplocks.

I still don't understand the Ctrl on Capslock hype. I'm a programmer and the combo I use by far the most is Ctrl+XCV. Pressing that with Caps seems to require much more strain, at least for my hand (and my hands a big). The natural position for pinkie keys is offset downwards from other fingers, not upwards, that's also why all the ergo builds shift the last column down. Can someone enlighten me?

I'm also a dev, and live on Ctrl+ZXCV. I love having Ctrl on home row. Left hand never leaves home row. And since you copy / paste a lot, Ctrl+L or R Arrow to jump by words instead of characters is much faster. Just my 2 cents. And for non-coding stuff, Ctrl on home row works great for Ctrl+R / S / P / N.

[Altis]

[...] it really did make sense to put backspace on backslash and ctrl on caplocks.

I still don't understand the Ctrl on Capslock hype. I'm a programmer and the combo I use by far the most is Ctrl+XCV. Pressing that with Caps seems to require much more strain, at least for my hand (and my hands a big). The natural position for pinkie keys is offset downwards from other fingers, not upwards, that's also why all the ergo builds shift the last column down. Can someone enlighten me?

I'm also a dev, and live on Ctrl+ZXCV. I love having Ctrl on home row. Left hand never leaves home row. And since you copy / paste a lot, Ctrl+L or R Arrow to jump by words instead of characters is much faster. Just my 2 cents. And for non-coding stuff, Ctrl on home row works great for Ctrl+R / S / P / N.

I'm with ileben on the Control in Caps Lock position... I find the pinky finger does not fall there naturally, and becomes especially awkward for the Ctrl+ZXCV keys.

OP, the KUL ES-87 allows you to have a similar layout to the HHKB. The DIP switches on the bottom let you swap CapsLock/Control and even the Backspace/'\', making it similar to the HHKB. You just don't have the function keys for the navigation keys.

[rowdy]

[...] it really did make sense to put backspace on backslash and ctrl on caplocks.

I still don't understand the Ctrl on Capslock hype. I'm a programmer and the combo I use by far the most is Ctrl+XCV. Pressing that with Caps seems to require much more strain, at least for my hand (and my hands a big). The natural position for pinkie keys is offset downwards from other fingers, not upwards, that's also why all the ergo builds shift the last column down. Can someone enlighten me?

Shouldn't you be refactoring instead of copying code?

I find on HHKB with Ctrl on the home row I just have to move my pinky slightly to the left.

With Ctrl on the bottom row, I tend to use my thumb, and end up with my left hand in a more awkward position.

[Bucake]

on my hhkbp2 (with hasu's controller) i turned LAlt into LCtrl; which is actually a pretty sweet spot!
(although it does feel a little bit weird when LCtrl is 1u)

edit, picture:

More

[Dongulator]

Everyone is saying hhkb... hhkb.. The obvious choice is the Leopold Fc660c.Happy Hacking Professional.... more like Happy Hipster Professional.. amiright

[Bucake]

Everyone is saying hhkb... hhkb.. The obvious choice is the Leopold Fc660c.Happy Hacking Professional.... more like Happy Hipster Professional.. amiright

60% with blank caps and programmable can't really be beaten.
nice try, but sorry mate

[rowdy]

Everyone is saying hhkb... hhkb.. The obvious choice is the Leopold Fc660c.Happy Hacking Professional.... more like Happy Hipster Professional.. amiright

Cheeky

[Dongulator]

Everyone is saying hhkb... hhkb.. The obvious choice is the Leopold Fc660c.Happy Hacking Professional.... more like Happy Hipster Professional.. amiright

60% with blank caps and programmable can't really be beaten.
nice try, but sorry mate

http://deskthority.net/wiki/Leopold_FC_660C

I'll just leave that here and let  macguy80 make the decision.

[bocahgundul]

HHKB fo sho
choose wisely macguy

[macguy80]

If I were going to choose another Topre board, it would definitely be HHKB Type-S. The upstroke sound on a stock RF board makes the experience less enjoyable for me. I don't know if standard HHKB or even the Novatouch is different in that regard.

Youtube videos only help so much, as I never noticed the upstroke sound until I actually typed on it.

I do wish it had dedicated arrow keys though. I do wish it had dedicated arrow keys though. There is the JIS model, but I gotta wonder, could I *ever* get used to such a small spacebar?

[macguy80]

OP, the KUL ES-87 allows you to have a similar layout to the HHKB. The DIP switches on the bottom let you swap CapsLock/Control and even the Backspace/'\', making it similar to the HHKB. You just don't have the function keys for the navigation keys.

Altis, thanks for that! I pretty much switched it to Mac mode, then forgot about them. That will help me "test the waters," to a degree, anyway.

[bocahgundul]

If I were going to choose another Topre board, it would definitely be HHKB Type-S. The upstroke sound on a stock RF board makes the experience less enjoyable for me. I don't know if standard HHKB or even the Novatouch is different in that regard.

Youtube videos only help so much, as I never noticed the upstroke sound until I actually typed on it.

I do wish it had dedicated arrow keys though. I do wish it had dedicated arrow keys though. There is the JIS model, but I gotta wonder, could I *ever* get used to such a small spacebar?

Nothing is impossible JUST BUY IT!!!!!!!!!!

[Bucake]

any (unsilenced) topre switch has a noisy clack on the upstroke. consider getting silencing-rings for your topre switches if it's the upstroke that you dislike. (i believe hypersphere rings are hyped around here.)
a type-s might be a better option, but that would also be a bunch more expensive.

also: HHKB has the option to be fully programmable (with hasu's controller)
also: MX browns are one of the worst switches i've ever typed on. buying a keyboard with them is like joining the dark side.

[tp4tissue]

ERGODOX

[bcredbottle]

ERGODOX

+1

[macguy80]

ERGODOX

That one won't be making my list. With my cerebral palsy, typing on anything that unconventional would be difficult for me.

[bcredbottle]

ERGODOX

That one won't be making my list. With my cerebral palsy, typing on anything that unconventional would be difficult for me.

Interesting. I was under the impression that a split board was better for people with muscular or nerve-based disorders. Is it difficult for your hands to "learn" new patterns or is it just a bad angle for you?

[fanpeople]

ERGODOX

That one won't be making my list. With my cerebral palsy, typing on anything that unconventional would be difficult for me.

Interesting. I was under the impression that a split board was better for people with muscular or nerve-based disorders. Is it difficult for your hands to "learn" new patterns or is it just a bad angle for you?

Tp passed away from child germs this morning. But I am happy to answer any dox related questions


Forget ergodox, aquire HHKB

[clacktalk]

qfr w/ frosty flake

and v blacks/ergoclears/zealios

[macguy80]

Interesting. I was under the impression that a split board was better for people with muscular or nerve-based disorders. Is it difficult for your hands to "learn" new patterns or is it just a bad angle for you?

Cerebral palsy affects each person differently. For me, it would probably be a little of both those problems.

I only type with my middle, index, and thumb on each hand. The other two fingers on each hand don't work well enough to control them precisely enough, with the exception being my left pinky, which I can use to hit left ctrl, shift, or caps lock, but not tab, backtick, or Escape.

[ideus]

If you like clears but you feel them a bit in the strong side you should try ergo clears, I found them to be the best tactile with the right amount of force, not at all tiring for long typing sessions.


Regarding the OP I am not sure if you want to get any recommendation, but Topre are totally different.

[macguy80]

@ideus,

I would get ergo clears in a heartbeat, if they were commercially available. My cerebral palsy prevents doing those sorts of mods myself.

As for Topre, I am well acquainted. I love my uniform 55f Realforce, except for the upstroke sound. 

[ideus]

@ideus,

I would get ergo clears in a heartbeat, if they were commercially available. My cerebral palsy prevents doing those sorts of mods myself.

As for Topre, I am well acquainted. I love my uniform 55f Realforce, except for the upstroke sound. 

There are some fellow at GH that may be happy to make a custom build for you, or to mod some switches if you want to solder them yourself. Otherwise, if you have the patience you can get a keyboard assembled according with your specifications from GON, just be aware that it may take some time, but it worth every peny and every day you wait for it.