Author Topic: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?  (Read 51354 times)

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Offline StickyBlueJuice

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #150 on: Wed, 16 January 2019, 02:12:30 »
Yes it was installed by default on my laptop, so I didn't decide to put another OS while it on warranty

But tbh, I personally like win7 and run it on my main PC
Live dangerously!
You can image it and restore it later if you need service. Done it before.

Many manufacturers  also will not hassle you over this, but more importantly, in most countries (including the US) it's illegal to deny warranty service for such a thing so long as it did not contribute to the problem.
Currently using Win10 on my work laptop. SOOOO tempted to install something else on it.
I am just worried the programs we use at work won't be available on Linux.

Offline Leslieann

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #151 on: Wed, 16 January 2019, 20:43:48 »
Currently using Win10 on my work laptop. SOOOO tempted to install something else on it.
I am just worried the programs we use at work won't be available on Linux.
What programs, even if not exact, there are often compatible equivalents and you can use Wine or VM for others.
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Offline no, the other guy

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #152 on: Thu, 17 January 2019, 01:13:42 »
If you need WINE, you need Windows.
<armin> i have the impression the only reason the mx red switch was invented was drunk people

       
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #153 on: Thu, 17 January 2019, 05:32:09 »
If you need WINE, you need Windows.
10 years ago you would be almost completely right.
5 years ago, mostly right.
Today, that's almost completely wrong.

Quite a lot of top tier games are now running on it (Far Cry 5, BF5, Fortnite, Falllout76...) and I have Photoshop and Illustrator running just fine on Playonlinux. Some older games even run better in Linux than in Windows. Only time I need Windows is for CAD, but even that has some workarounds.

I'm not saying it's always easy, but it can be done and it's getting faster, easier and more competent all the time.
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Offline no, the other guy

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #154 on: Thu, 17 January 2019, 05:42:42 »
Even today, the only reason to use WINE is to be able to use Windows applications. If your operating system requires a not-quite-emulator to run good applications, your operating system might be the wrong one for you.
<armin> i have the impression the only reason the mx red switch was invented was drunk people

       
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #155 on: Thu, 17 January 2019, 06:43:36 »
Even today, the only reason to use WINE is to be able to use Windows applications. If your operating system requires a not-quite-emulator to run good applications, your operating system might be the wrong one for you.
"good applications"? You're either trolling or ignorant of what's out there.

Also, it's not a "not-quite-emulator", it's not an emulator at all and I see no reason to install Windows just so I can run one or two programs.
I'd rather learn Gimp than have to use Win10 just to run Photoshop, and I haaaaate Gimp (some people prefer it).
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Offline no, the other guy

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #156 on: Thu, 17 January 2019, 06:50:15 »
I dislike Photoshop as well, I usually use Paint.NET. But even that has no good Linux alternative.

If there is good native Linux software, why do you want to run Windows software on it?
<armin> i have the impression the only reason the mx red switch was invented was drunk people

       
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Offline StickyBlueJuice

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #157 on: Thu, 17 January 2019, 06:54:30 »
Currently using Win10 on my work laptop. SOOOO tempted to install something else on it.
I am just worried the programs we use at work won't be available on Linux.
What programs, even if not exact, there are often compatible equivalents and you can use Wine or VM for others.
Well the main one is FirstClass for work.
I don't know if it'll run in wine or playonlinux, but there's only one way of finding out I'm afraid.

Offline csmertx

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #158 on: Thu, 17 January 2019, 08:44:11 »
If I had a choice I'd choose Windows in a VM over Wine--especially for cloud type things like Adobe suite or Autodesk. Proton is a great start, but Wine ain't what the people want.
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #159 on: Thu, 17 January 2019, 19:28:31 »
I dislike Photoshop as well, I usually use Paint.NET. But even that has no good Linux alternative.

If there is good native Linux software, why do you want to run Windows software on it?
Pinta is similar to Paint.net.
Gimp is capable of 99% of what Photoshop can do (which is far more than most people need) I just hate using it. The workflow is entirely different and I would need to relearn too much for something I don't use very often.

But why use Windows programs on Linux? I don't need or want Windows and all that it brings with it.
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #160 on: Thu, 17 January 2019, 19:30:53 »
Well the main one is FirstClass for work.
I don't know if it'll run in wine or playonlinux, but there's only one way of finding out I'm afraid.
If you mean the educational program, they have native Mac, Linux, Ios and Android clients.

As for testing, you can run Virtualbox, install Linux, then install the client into that.


If I had a choice I'd choose Windows in a VM over Wine--especially for cloud type things like Adobe suite or Autodesk. Proton is a great start, but Wine ain't what the people want.
I start with Wine, then work my way down through the options with a VM being the last choice, simply because it's a more native and less intrusive approach.

Proton/Lutris and PlayonLinux are all using Wine as a base, as is Crossover.
« Last Edit: Thu, 17 January 2019, 19:32:49 by Leslieann »
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Offline no, the other guy

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #161 on: Thu, 17 January 2019, 19:36:14 »
Pinta looks not un-interesting. I might try it one day, thank you.
<armin> i have the impression the only reason the mx red switch was invented was drunk people

       
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #162 on: Thu, 17 January 2019, 20:06:45 »
Pinta looks not un-interesting. I might try it one day, thank you.
You're welcome.
Seriously, Linux has lots more to offer than you think.

I ran dual boot for years and never knew how much was there because any time I got stuck I ran back to Windows. Linux is every bit as capable as Mac, but you don't hear Mac users complain, why? It's not because Mac has much better software (it's about the same it just costs more!), it's because Mac users were unable to just dip their toes in, they had to dive into the deep end and learn to swim. Windows users trying Linux are just testing the water so you never find places to help you find what you need, you just boot back into Windows and do it. I know, I did it for years.

It wasn't until my Windows drive failed and I realized I hadn't really used it much that I decided not to bother. Suddenly I was finding all sorts of programs and sites I was unaware of and Linux opened up completely.  The same happened to me when I tried Mac on my PC, I dipped my toes and never invested in it, then I ran it exclusively and forced myself to figure it out and suddenly I was finding the software I never new existed. I've heard from others they experienced the same thing.

For anyone curious, I documented a lot of my OS experiences in this thread. If anyone is considering alternatives, it's not a bad place to start.
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Offline csmertx

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #163 on: Thu, 17 January 2019, 20:33:17 »
Well the main one is FirstClass for work.
I don't know if it'll run in wine or playonlinux, but there's only one way of finding out I'm afraid.
If you mean the educational program, they have native Mac, Linux, Ios and Android clients.

As for testing, you can run Virtualbox, install Linux, then install the client into that.


If I had a choice I'd choose Windows in a VM over Wine--especially for cloud type things like Adobe suite or Autodesk. Proton is a great start, but Wine ain't what the people want.
I start with Wine, then work my way down through the options with a VM being the last choice, simply because it's a more native and less intrusive approach.

Proton/Lutris and PlayonLinux are all using Wine as a base, as is Crossover.

If I had a decent GPU/MOBO laying around QEMU would be my first choice. Anything to avoid using vanilla Wine.

Sure winetricks is fantastic for one game or program--more than one and my wine bottles (prefixes) become a tangled spaghetti mess.

protontricks (w/Steam) > winetricks (w/PoL).. I know the tangles are still there but they're easier to manage lol
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Offline Altis

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #164 on: Thu, 17 January 2019, 21:41:32 »
10 years ago you would be almost completely right.
5 years ago, mostly right.
Today, that's almost completely wrong.

Quite a lot of top tier games are now running on it (Far Cry 5, BF5, Fortnite, Falllout76...) and I have Photoshop and Illustrator running just fine on Playonlinux. Some older games even run better in Linux than in Windows. Only time I need Windows is for CAD, but even that has some workarounds.

I'm not saying it's always easy, but it can be done and it's getting faster, easier and more competent all the time.

It's a bit unfortunate, in engineering (at least in my disciplines), there's actually quite a bit of software that's both Windows and Linux, but there's enough that's one or the other to be a bit of a pain trying to just use one. It ends up being easier to run Windows as base and Linux as VM/remote client, though that's not how I'd like it ideally.

Can I ask, do you know of any reliable remote desktop client for Linux to access Windows RDP server? I know MS makes a RDP for Mac but I haven't been able to find one for Linux that works for these Windows servers (which I don't have any control or say over).
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #165 on: Thu, 17 January 2019, 22:54:00 »
Sure winetricks is fantastic for one game or program--more than one and my wine bottles (prefixes) become a tangled spaghetti mess.
I try to limit how much I need any of them for that very reason.
On the other hand, at least it's easy to backup, move and restore.


It's a bit unfortunate, in engineering (at least in my disciplines), there's actually quite a bit of software that's both Windows and Linux, but there's enough that's one or the other to be a bit of a pain trying to just use one. It ends up being easier to run Windows as base and Linux as VM/remote client, though that's not how I'd like it ideally.

Can I ask, do you know of any reliable remote desktop client for Linux to access Windows RDP server? I know MS makes a RDP for Mac but I haven't been able to find one for Linux that works for these Windows servers (which I don't have any control or say over).
Engineering, at least for cad/cam has been a mess for a long time from a software and hardware standpoint. Too many old machines/people/software trying to work with newer standards.

I switched everything I had over to Team Viewer a while back, it's the most reliable thing I've seen. Well, except when they up and changed all the remote access numbers breaking every connection. Gives you an idea of how low of a bar there is. Remote access, cloud sharing, file syncing and backup... I don't understand how it can all be so damn bad, and when you do finally find one that works well that's about the time they will shut it down (Crash Plan!). There are some good ones for all of this that exist, but cost a small fortune, and frankly, even they often have a pretty low bar for reliability.
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Offline quadcube

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #166 on: Mon, 07 October 2019, 10:09:43 »
using win10 because support for 7 is ending next year

Offline mizzoperator

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #167 on: Mon, 07 October 2019, 13:05:24 »
I use Windows 10 primarily for three reasons:
1) I'm absurdly lazy and don't want to have to fiddle with a command-line constantly just to install things.
2) It runs all of the applications I could ever need and/or want; usually without a fuss, too.
3) It's supported by basically everything ever, so I need not worry all that much.

I have no use for any Linux distros outside of using them on incredibly low-power machines, like old laptops.
Please don't take this as a jab towards anybody personally, but people who use Linux solely to feel superior to people who use Windows are not good people.
Thankfully, people who are like that are restricted to youtube comment sections and /g/.
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Offline Sintpinty

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #168 on: Tue, 08 October 2019, 05:38:45 »
I have to use windows 10 because most video games are supported

Offline Surefoot

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #169 on: Tue, 08 October 2019, 08:08:09 »
As far as Linux native games, I wouldn't hold your breath, however if rumors are to be believed it may not matter. In the meantime, Lutris is doing quite well.
Using Ubuntu on my main default boot disk here. Steam means i have most of my AAA games library available directly. Yeah there are still windows exclusives but i can do without them as the linux offer has been plenty enough for some time now.

Offline romevi

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #170 on: Tue, 08 October 2019, 08:17:18 »
It's installed in my work computer.

Offline mizzoperator

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #171 on: Tue, 08 October 2019, 08:22:14 »
I have to use windows 10 because most video games are supported

I hope that one day, somebody ports Lose/Lose over to Windows.
That would be an absolutely radical way to destroy a Windows install.
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Offline gingerjack

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #172 on: Thu, 10 October 2019, 22:52:25 »
Personally, I prefer Win7 but as support is ending, I had to switch to Win10. Like, I had no choice!

Offline Altis

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #173 on: Sat, 12 October 2019, 18:31:08 »
I have a dilemma.

Windows 10 wants to update but fails/refuses to because my VMWare Workstation is old. However, I don't much feel like buying a new version just so I can boot my Linux partition from Windows.

Seems like I either must give up VMWare Workstation 9 or give up Windows 10.  :(
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Offline kwerdenker

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #174 on: Fri, 01 November 2019, 15:59:42 »
I used to dual-boot Linux/Windows but since W10 I just skip the Linux install. The Linux sublayer gives me everything I need with a reasonable speed and since most software these days is webbased anyways (hello Electron) it doesn't matter too much on which OS you run.

Offline Sintpinty

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #175 on: Thu, 14 November 2019, 11:59:24 »
I use windows 10 because its the only way to play my games

Offline JP

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #176 on: Thu, 14 November 2019, 12:49:44 »
Windows 10 because at work because we are sun-setting Windows 7. No 21 gun salute, just an unceremonious whimper.
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #177 on: Thu, 14 November 2019, 14:26:00 »
I use windows 10 because its the only way to play ALL my games
Fixed that for you.

A lot now runs on Steam/Proton, just not everything.
Running Borderlands 2 and World of Warships through this was as easy to install as it was on Windows.
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Offline Sintpinty

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #178 on: Sun, 17 November 2019, 12:25:55 »
I use windows 10 because its the only way to play ALL my games
Fixed that for you.

A lot now runs on Steam/Proton, just not everything.
Running Borderlands 2 and World of Warships through this was as easy to install as it was on Windows.

Occasionally i use Linux, i used CentOS for my project last time. It wasn't easy doe.

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #179 on: Sun, 17 November 2019, 18:56:10 »
Because that is what we use at work and what most people (ie muggles) in the real world (ie common US business) use for most tasks.

For a decade or so I have been dipping (first) my toes and (then) my legs into Linux - Ubuntu, then Mint, and currently finding a nice place with Mint/Cinnamon. When and if I leave the common general workforce and/or retire, I will ditch Micro$oft altogether for FOSS. I am more comfortable now with LibreOffice than Office, and Gimp than Photoshop Elements, since I am a low-power user in general anyway. Audacity has been my go-to music editor for nearly 2 decades, and Google Docs and Dropbox work great for things to share. I am still not settled on a good video editor.

And, fortunately, I am not a gamer.
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #180 on: Sun, 17 November 2019, 19:25:16 »

And, fortunately, I am not a gamer.

Fohat should game,  gotta stave off that dementia somehow..

Recommend RTX 2070 Super


Offline Sintpinty

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #181 on: Fri, 22 November 2019, 07:40:39 »

"Recommend RTX 2070 Super"
Broke Sintpinty obviously cannot afford it

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #182 on: Fri, 22 November 2019, 10:46:56 »

"Recommend RTX 2070 Super"
Broke Sintpinty obviously cannot afford it

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Offline Prelim

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #183 on: Fri, 22 November 2019, 10:58:49 »
used Win7 64bit until last week, is way better than Win10. 
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Offline Bruek

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #184 on: Fri, 22 November 2019, 18:56:32 »
Just because I was forced to. I would absolutely love to still be using win7
cronch

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #185 on: Fri, 22 November 2019, 20:41:35 »
I held onto both 98 and XP for a long time after the new versions came out, and still haven't decided whether Windows peaked with XP or 7.
"I never understood wind. I know windmills very much, I have studied it better than anybody. I know it is very expensive. They are made in China and Germany mostly, very few made here, almost none, but they are manufactured, tremendous — if you are into this — tremendous fumes and gases are spewing into the atmosphere. You know we have a world, right? So the world is tiny compared to the universe. So tremendous, tremendous amount of fumes and everything. You talk about the carbon footprint, fumes are spewing into the air, right spewing, whether it is China or Germany, is going into the air. A windmill will kill many bald eagles. After a certain number, they make you turn the windmill off, that is true. By the way, they make you turn it off. And yet, if you killed one, they put you in jail. That is OK. But why is it OK for windmills to destroy the bird population?" - Donald Trump - Turning Point USA speech - 2019-12-22

Offline Altis

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #186 on: Fri, 22 November 2019, 22:13:44 »
I held onto both 98 and XP for a long time after the new versions came out, and still haven't decided whether Windows peaked with XP or 7.

IMO XP was awesome for its time, but 7 seems to be the one people would use into the future, if given the choice.

I tethered my phone the other day to browse on my Win 10 desktop (didn't have wifi on it yet), and Windows downloaded an 8.5 GB "update" in the background. rip data plan. Oh, then the update failed because it wants me to delete VMware Workstation 9.
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #187 on: Sat, 23 November 2019, 03:15:52 »
7 was peak, though one could argue 8.1 was better from technical standpoint.

XP was good, but one of the reasons it was so "good" was because it stuck around longer than it should have giving MS time/forcing them to fix the problems. It had 3(!) service packs whereas most got one maybe two, the OS also grew 3x larger than it was on release. Then we got Vista which was bad and really only got good shortly before Win7 came out (and still demanded a VERY expensive high end system). So was it really good, or just victim of circumstance and rose tinted glasses? I'm not saying XP was bad, just not as good as 7 and was a victim of circumstances. On the other hand, Win7 was good pretty much right from the start. 7 could actually last longer than XP were it not for MS being so scared of it that they know they have to forcibly kill it to be rid of it.


Windows 8.1 though? Yes.
Okay, look, I get it, the interface stiiiiiiiinks, but the underpinnings, which were the underpinnings of Win10 and based on 7 are damned good and it was made before telemetry and other games MS is playing. I would say use Win8 with a different U.I. and it's perfect but 8 is dead.
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Offline Coreda

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #188 on: Sat, 23 November 2019, 04:55:46 »
I use 8.1 just fine. Not planning to upgrade to 10 until 8.1 updates are EOL'd. Have avoided various retrofitted W10 updates I've researched by only installing manually after checking online for any relevant critical discussions (though some probably sneak in via later roll-up patches, I nevertheless check for unnecessary scheduled tasks and such added).

There's nothing wrong with the UI if one simply uses StartIsBack which restores a native start menu and allows disabling seeing the alternate modern app UI (unless you deliberately launch such an app of course). I also have retained a local rather than MS account since install (which they tried to swap out on users who logged into the Windows Store and/or at install time if you were connected to the net).

They've increasingly found ways to be sneaky with Windows over time no doubt but I'm just glad to not have to deal with the gamut of 10 concerns ranging from privacy issues to periodic, major OS system updates that have caused commonly reported hardware/software-affecting bugs or intentional, regressive feature changes. 8.1 OTOH has settled to just security updates while still being compatible with current third-party software and hardware I use (apart from native HDR support which is a minor complaint), kind of a sweet spot for me.

Edit: I should add on the last point that current gen Intel/AMD CPUs are only compatible with W10 (officially anyway), however I use a prior gen from a few years ago so for my uses it's fine for the time being.
« Last Edit: Sat, 23 November 2019, 05:00:14 by Coreda »

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #189 on: Sat, 23 November 2019, 08:43:12 »
Mostly off-topic, I have a collection of MicroSoft OS packages going back to about DOS 3 (not a complete collection, but probably about a third of them) that realistically I will probably never find a use for, although I keep wondering. These are legit discs with proper product keys, etc.

My rudimentary understanding is that from about XP on the OS had to be "activated" by MS and so I couldn't just install one on an old computer and have it work (at least not without some sort of gray hack).

What is the last release that did not have to be activated? And I think I have Office 97, 2000, 2003, and 2010. Is it the same story with them?

Last, would a crude old OS work if I fed it to a modern motherboard?

Thanks!
"I never understood wind. I know windmills very much, I have studied it better than anybody. I know it is very expensive. They are made in China and Germany mostly, very few made here, almost none, but they are manufactured, tremendous — if you are into this — tremendous fumes and gases are spewing into the atmosphere. You know we have a world, right? So the world is tiny compared to the universe. So tremendous, tremendous amount of fumes and everything. You talk about the carbon footprint, fumes are spewing into the air, right spewing, whether it is China or Germany, is going into the air. A windmill will kill many bald eagles. After a certain number, they make you turn the windmill off, that is true. By the way, they make you turn it off. And yet, if you killed one, they put you in jail. That is OK. But why is it OK for windmills to destroy the bird population?" - Donald Trump - Turning Point USA speech - 2019-12-22

Offline suicidal_orange

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #190 on: Sat, 23 November 2019, 09:53:29 »
Old OSes wont work properly/at all on new hardware as you wont have drivers.

Off the top of my head problems include XP RAM cap at 3.25(?)gb, there was a change to 16 then 32bit LBA addressing to access bigger hard drives, SSD wear management stuff, Win98 didn't like hyperthreading and probably can't use multiple cores either...  To play with an old OS you need old hardware :(
                               
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #191 on: Sat, 23 November 2019, 15:24:21 »

Suicidal_orange Is correct and there is actually a whole host of other issues that only get worse and worse as you go back.

Then there is the security aspect.
Hackers know these systems will not be patched by MS, making them prime targets. And once again the further you go back, the worse it gets. Find a modern malware protection for Win2k or Win98. Heck, find a modern browser. Chrome no longer even supports XP.



I use 8.1 just fine. Not planning to upgrade to 10 until 8.1 updates are EOL'd.
It's already being EOL'd by companies, AMD no longer offers new Radeon drivers for Win8. You can get Win7 or Win10, but not Win8 and no, you cannot use the 7 or 10 drivers, I tried. There are however driver tools that can locate newer ones that still work, but the ones from AMD will not.  This is because the Windows 8 user count is actually less than Linux users.

And why wait for EOL? You are fighting a losing battle.
You can get a free upgrade now and if you stick with Windows you will be forced onto 10 sooner or later whether you like it or not, the only difference is when and if you will have to pay for it. I recommend doing it now and set it up while disconnected from the net (so it creates an offline account), then use a tool to extract the product code. To do this you need to make a full backup, then use the Microsoft media creation tool to perform the update then as it boots up and asks for login info, disconnect from the net (you can also just keep saying no at the prompts eventually it will relent and offer an offline account). Then download a tool like Findkey or Productool to get the product code so you can re-install later.
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Offline fohat.digs

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #192 on: Sat, 23 November 2019, 16:13:19 »

And once again the further you go back, the worse it gets.


I am generally keeping the old software against the possibility that I one day get some compatible old hardware and want to set it up entirely off-grid.

Does Windows 98 run with a product key without being activated? How about XP? As I recall, DOS just runs.

What is the last Office version that does not require activation?

Thanks!

"I never understood wind. I know windmills very much, I have studied it better than anybody. I know it is very expensive. They are made in China and Germany mostly, very few made here, almost none, but they are manufactured, tremendous — if you are into this — tremendous fumes and gases are spewing into the atmosphere. You know we have a world, right? So the world is tiny compared to the universe. So tremendous, tremendous amount of fumes and everything. You talk about the carbon footprint, fumes are spewing into the air, right spewing, whether it is China or Germany, is going into the air. A windmill will kill many bald eagles. After a certain number, they make you turn the windmill off, that is true. By the way, they make you turn it off. And yet, if you killed one, they put you in jail. That is OK. But why is it OK for windmills to destroy the bird population?" - Donald Trump - Turning Point USA speech - 2019-12-22

Offline Leslieann

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #193 on: Sun, 24 November 2019, 03:44:29 »
Anything xp or later needs it, so you need pre Winxp and pre Office Xp (also called 2003).
95-2k needs a key but no activation.

Getting around activation is pretty easy though.
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Offline Coreda

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #194 on: Sun, 24 November 2019, 05:19:04 »
It's already being EOL'd by companies, AMD no longer offers new Radeon drivers for Win8.

Certainly unfortunate for AMD users wanting current gen GPUs. The Nvidia RTX (EVGA at least) still supports 8.1 from what I've seen from users on 8.1 using them (sans raytracing support due to the lack of DirectX 12). As I previously mentioned current gen CPUs aren't officially compatible on anything except W10 however, which is obviously something to consider.

And why wait for EOL? You are fighting a losing battle. The only difference is when and if you will have to pay for it.

Already outlined some of the reasons why I'm not using it, I have an entire text file and directory of W10 issues I keep track of. There's no battle to be had. Meanwhile on a weekly to monthly basis I come across new ways W10 has affected users negatively, from both devs and regular users. I was on the same forums and discussion groups for the period throughout 8.1's existence until now and there was nothing on the same level or volume of issues as W10. The worst I saw about 8.1 was the dislike about the alternate modern UI and other annoyances that could be properly disabled (which I was aware of when deciding to use it).

I'm just more comfortable with something stable and hassle-free. I'm sure some haven't experienced issues with their W10 or don't mind about other problematic aspects but I'm fine with my setup and wanted to mention that I feel 8.1 is viable, with the mentioned caveats.
« Last Edit: Sun, 24 November 2019, 05:31:45 by Coreda »

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #195 on: Sun, 24 November 2019, 08:57:19 »
Anything xp or later needs it, so you need pre Winxp and pre Office Xp (also called 2003).
95-2k needs a key but no activation.

Getting around activation is pretty easy though.

Gotta stock up on OLD-Pirate images.  all the NEW ones come with miners and other virus problems.

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #196 on: Sun, 24 November 2019, 09:31:14 »
using a win10 custom lite version for gaming its 1.26gb ( extreme10-mpb-windows10-rs5 )
you can make more light your normal w10 installation using the utility below
https://github.com/Sycnex/Windows10Debloater

Offline Leslieann

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #197 on: Sun, 24 November 2019, 15:33:07 »
Already outlined some of the reasons why I'm not using it, I have an entire text file and directory of W10 issues I keep track of. There's no battle to be had. Meanwhile on a weekly to monthly basis I come across new ways W10 has affected users negatively, from both devs and regular users.

What makes you think that's going to change in the future?
Win8 will go EOL and then what? You finally switch? Now you are stuck trying to figure out how to deal with a new OS and by then all the documentation on Win10 will be a jumbled mess (which it already is) and you're several years behind the curve. What others think of as common knowledge you're scratching your head trying to figure out.

I get why you do it. It doesn't work, but I get it.


By the way, telemetry was installed through security patches and in rollups. You won't see any new services because it piggybacks existing systems such as the driver update system making it very difficult to see, much less block without blocking systems you want. Not only is it hidden, but it is on a system not intended to be secure so it installs with the defaults and you have zero control over it.
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #198 on: Sun, 24 November 2019, 17:12:41 »
And the ISP always knows what you're doing as well.

If you dare get on Tor,  now they put you on the Naughty list, where even more resources are put into tracking you.

Offline Coreda

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Re: Do you use Win10 and if so, why?
« Reply #199 on: Sun, 24 November 2019, 18:45:53 »
What makes you think that's going to change in the future? Win8 will go EOL and then what? You finally switch? Now you are stuck trying to figure out how to deal with a new OS and you're several years behind the curve. What others think of as common knowledge you're scratching your head trying to figure out.

Likely little will change with W10 continuing to have frequent quality control issues and its other changes I take issue with, though I don't see the usefulness of switching before being necessary while having a stable, hassle-free OS. It also seems a stretch to imply W10 is so fundamentally different from an upgrade PoV from 8.1 that I would be stuck without a clue if I chose to upgrade.

I bought and installed W8.1 Pro only after doing research of various gotchas and tweaks required for the experience I wanted as opposed to blindly installing it as some who had complaints of widely and lesser known issues did at the time. That was far more of a skip both in years and the OS changes. For the software I used virtually nothing changed with that jump and hardware-wise the existing devices I used worked fine.

With W10 I'm already keeping a record of a variety of version-specific and broader OS issues that are reported by users and in the news (partly out of amusement, partly for reference), which is more than can be said of many and particularly more of a problem for W7 users upgrading. Of course if I did happen to run into any unexpected issues following an upgrade in years to come I'd investigate it, as I'd expect most reasonable users would.

By the way, telemetry was installed through security patches and in rollups. You won't see any new services because it piggybacks existing systems such as the driver update system making it very difficult to see. Not only is it hidden, but it is on a system not intended to be secure so it installs with the defaults and you have zero control over it.

Updates including backported telemetry now seem to be bundled in security roll-up patches, yes. Some of their patch notes for the security roll-ups have listed previous standalone telemetry updates however I'd be interested in more details regarding the entirely hidden nature of ones you're referring to piggybacking on driver updates. As so far none of the known telemetry-related tasks and processes I've seen are active on my system but I'd certainly be interested to know more of others.
« Last Edit: Sun, 24 November 2019, 18:55:50 by Coreda »