What do I need to buy to build this?

[rrdein]

Hi guys, I was researching what to buy for my issue with my fingertips killing me from typing (I currently have Redragon K556, can't modify the switches), and I found a lot of great suggestions on this board.  The suggestions varied widely, but ultimately I decided on Red switches with soft o-rings for my particular issue.  I also want to buy https://pimpmykeyboard.com/g20-pbt-blank-keysets/.  I need to order this today and I've pretty much made up my mind on what I'm ordering, though if it doesn't work out I can always try removing the o-rings and try other switches later (possibly with a switch tester/sampler).

I'm not very experienced and I've never assembled a modern keyboard with Cherry switches, so I don't know what is compatible with what.  I want to make sure the keyboard and switches I buy will be compatible with each other and with the G20 keysets linked to above.  Can anyone tell me what kind of "standards", etc. I need to watch for to make sure everything is compatible?  Does anyone have some product links for comparison?

[MIGHTY CHICKEN]

You can buy whatever switches and they will work with whatever board although in some cases you might have to cut the legs of switches with a flush cutter. The keycaps will fit on mx switches although you will need to know if the keycap sizes will work with the layout of the board. Ie, the board needs a long spacebar, but I don't see a long spacebar on the caps you listed, but I'll need to know what board you are planning to get.

[gh_pp]

The keycaps you linked is for ortholinear split ergo keyboard

Are you sure that is what you want? And what keyboard do you plan on putting the keycaps on?

The switches are the easiest part (assuming you get hotswap pcb), and if you have issues with typing with heavy springs, red or yellow are great for that.

the 35g topre are even nicer imo if you want a softer typing experience.
epomaker has 60%, 75% 80% topre keyboard with mx-stem so you can use regular cherry keycaps.

usually people add o-rings to reduce the bottom out noise, but it will make the travel distance a lot shorter and a much harsher bottom out feel (unless you can touch type really really light)

If you want silent switches there are tons of modern options instead of adding o-rings.

[rrdein]

You can buy whatever switches and they will work with whatever board although in some cases you might have to cut the legs of switches with a flush cutter. The keycaps will fit on mx switches although you will need to know if the keycap sizes will work with the layout of the board. Ie, the board needs a long spacebar, but I don't see a long spacebar on the caps you listed, but I'll need to know what board you are planning to get.

 Is there a cheap, common board that a lot of people start with to add switches to, to start from the ground up?

The keycaps you linked is for ortholinear split ergo keyboard

Are you sure that is what you want? And what keyboard do you plan on putting the keycaps on?

The switches are the easiest part (assuming you get hotswap pcb), and if you have issues with typing with heavy springs, red or yellow are great for that.

the 35g topre are even nicer imo if you want a softer typing experience.
epomaker has 60%, 75% 80% topre keyboard with mx-stem so you can use regular cherry keycaps.

usually people add o-rings to reduce the bottom out noise, but it will make the travel distance a lot shorter and a much harsher bottom out feel (unless you can touch type really really light)

If you want silent switches there are tons of modern options instead of adding o-rings.

Actually I'm not sure that that (ortholinear split) is what I want.  Really I'm looking for keys that have no edges or corners to them, or as close as possible.  I'm also trying not to go all out right off the bat for something like a Topre, in case I don't like it (though I do have money I can spend; just don't want to waste money or have  lot of extra parts/boards around).

In my case the O-rings aren't for noise, but someone in a thread about my problem heartily recommended (very soft) o-rings to cushion the bottom.  Maybe I don't really need those but I imagined they would be pretty cheap to get to try, as I need to order something asap.

[MIGHTY CHICKEN]

I personally don't like orings real much, if you want a cheap board, there are plenty, keychrons, womiers, gks, china boards etc. budget and layout are something I need to rec something.

If you want rounded keycaps, go on aliexpress and search dsa or sa, those are pretty rounded compared to oem and cherry.

[rrdein]

In the long run I hope to upgrade to all the best stuff, but my goal right now is to produce something minimal that will be easier on my fingertips, that is modular enough to allow me to upgrade later.  Mostly I'm looking for a cheapish solution involving Cherry (red) switches, and the o-rings I guess would be added if I found myself bottoming out.  All of this being sort of a short-term solution to the problem with my fingers.  I'd say my budget is around $60.  I could spend more if needed, but I sort of found the Topre boards to be more than what I was willing to pay without looking for cheaper solutions first.  As the price creeps over $100 it starts making sense to spend $200 for something better, so I'm trying to find something well under $100 if possible.

I also find that the hard corners on the keys of my current keyboard are aggravating the problem, so finding keys with less-pronounced edges is also a priority for me.

I only use my keyboard for typing and programming.  Typing speed is not a factor for me (I only care about logevity of my fingers at this point).

[MIGHTY CHICKEN]

You aren't really gonna be able to get cherry reds, they are expensive and not the best linear. With your low budget, nothing is really gonna be good, my best suggestion is a prebuilt sk61 or sk64 with reds and you buy orings yourself. The SK has kinda rounded caps and its the only real option in that budget range aside from something like the womier k66 which is a great option with gat yellows, but it has oem caps.

[rrdein]

Are there other keycaps like the ones I linked to out there that could be used on a fairly standard (like what I get at Best Buy) keyboard layout, and how much would it probably cost me to get a setup involving those (if they exist) and red switches, that I could modify as needed if I didn't like the red switches?

[rrdein]

Also when I say red switches, knockoffs would be okay if they were similar in quality.

[MIGHTY CHICKEN]

Are there other keycaps like the ones I linked to out there that could be used on a fairly standard (like what I get at Best Buy) keyboard layout, and how much would it probably cost me to get a setup involving those (if they exist) and red switches, that I could modify as needed if I didn't like the red switches?

Well, a standard dsa 104 set from aliexpress should fit most boards at bestbuy assuming it isn't a razer or corsair, but like the only thing you are going to manage to get if you want cheaper than what I sent its going to a red dragon plus a 30 buck keycap set like this https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32842605589.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.0.0.7e2e32cd9cKPoJ&algo_pvid=bc59c97e-d4b9-4de4-a36b-fa6303e91ea0&algo_expid=bc59c97e-d4b9-4de4-a36b-fa6303e91ea0-43&btsid=0b0a556116215430743251585ede14&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_,searchweb201603_

[rrdein]

The board I have right now is https://www.amazon.com/Redragon-K556-Mechanical-Keyboard-Aluminum/dp/B01NAI2TXC, but the answer to the first question on the QA section says you would have to modify the pins to upgrade the switches, which sounds tricker than what I'm going for (or maybe you know more about this).  Otherwise, though, I would choose to upgrade my existing board.  Is there a Redragon board that would be easier to upgrade?

Also, is there something similar to the board you recommended that has the 104 key layout?

Do you think Aliexpress switches function roughly the same as the cherry switches?

[rrdein]

Sorry I'm dumb, I'm reading around and I guess a lot of boards require soldering to change the switches (maybe I have that wrong)?  If so, then I guess the board being hotswappable would be pretty important to me.  I guess I could pay more, I guess I probably just need to research more.

[MIGHTY CHICKEN]

Assuming you bought a board with red switches, you can change keycaps and add orings without having to solder

[Maledicted]

Sorry, I must have accidentally made two posts trying to modify my original one a few times.

[Maledicted]

In the long run I hope to upgrade to all the best stuff, but my goal right now is to produce something minimal that will be easier on my fingertips, that is modular enough to allow me to upgrade later.  Mostly I'm looking for a cheapish solution involving Cherry (red) switches, and the o-rings I guess would be added if I found myself bottoming out.  All of this being sort of a short-term solution to the problem with my fingers.  I'd say my budget is around $60.

You will bottom out with MX reds, and a lot of people don't like them because they find typing with them to be jarring because of how hard they do bottom out with them.

Also when I say red switches, knockoffs would be okay if they were similar in quality.

Almost all MX clones are much better than actual Cherry switches, and most are cheaper. A notable exception is Outemu, as you've undoutably already discovered to be scratchy in your board (although their blues are great).

The board I have right now is https://www.amazon.com/Redragon-K556-Mechanical-Keyboard-Aluminum/dp/B01NAI2TXC, but the answer to the first question on the QA section says you would have to modify the pins to upgrade the switches, which sounds tricker than what I'm going for (or maybe you know more about this).  Otherwise, though, I would choose to upgrade my existing board.  Is there a Redragon board that would be easier to upgrade?

Reddragon almost invariably uses Outemu switches. If the board is hot swap, that means that they'll be using Outemu's hot swap sockets, which are too narrow to fit the legs of most switches without the modification you mentioned. It would probably be easier, ironically, to buy a Reddragon board with soldered switches ... and desolder them, than to modify non-Outemu switches to fit their hot swap sockets.

Do you think Aliexpress switches function roughly the same as the cherry switches?

Aliexpress is kind of like Asian Amazon, I don't think they really make anything. You can buy most things made overseas there, so it depends on the switches you're looking at. Gateron switches, as a rule, are usually much better than Cherry ... they're just one of many these days though.

Sorry I'm dumb, I'm reading around and I guess a lot of boards require soldering to change the switches (maybe I have that wrong)?  If so, then I guess the board being hotswappable would be pretty important to me.  I guess I could pay more, I guess I probably just need to research more.

Most boards outside of the enthusiast market are not hot-swappable. Boards that are not can be modified to be so, but the best hot swap sockets (Kailh) need the PCB to be designed from the ground up with them in mind. If you want a full size keyboard, your options are cut to almost nothing when it comes to hot swap boards, but the GMMK is a contender ... though more than you want to spend. You can get it on Amazon for $80 without switches or caps (barebones) at the moment.

The only o-rings (Rosewill brand from Newegg, years ago) I ever tried made my MX reds feel too much like cheap rubber domes to me, so I took them off and never touched them again. If you want a cushioned bottom with light MX switches, as others have mentioned, you want something like silent reds. The cheapest boards I know of at the moment that have them are the Fnatic Mini Streaks at Best Buy (an outlet you've mentioned).

They're on clearance for $75 and you may be able to just walk in and out of your local store with one to try and return if you don't like it (I think this is likely with how hastily we're deciding on things here). I don't think the full size version is on clearance, for some reason.

[rrdein]

Would it be possible to swap out the caps on the Fnatic board, and if so is there a particular standard or type that I would look for when shopping for keycaps (to match the board)?

[Maledicted]

Would it be possible to swap out the caps on the Fnatic board, and if so is there a particular standard or type that I would look for when shopping for keycaps (to match the board)?

It looks like the caps are standard to me, but I could double check when I'm home since I have one. I bought it just to try out silent reds. As long as the layout and cap sizes aren't weird (like most big name gaming keboards) just about any standard cap set will fit on just about any board with switches that have MX-style stems ... which are most that are produced today.

If I remember right the caps that come on that board are a cheap lasered ABS, so that's definitely a detriment if one cares about such things. I ran similar stock caps on my K70s for years and years without issue or any care to change until I did a recent cleaning of my dedicated gaming board and swapped to some thick double shots since I had them around anyway.

The Fnatic board is not hot swap, to my knowledge. Hot swap boards, however, are really primarily a good tool for trying out various switches without committing and/or learning to solder. The sockets do fail, eventually. I only bought a hot swap board myself recently just in case I find more switches I want to test in a board quickly.

[rrdein]

If you could check I would appreciate it.  What's the disadvantage with the cheap lasered ABS?

[MIGHTY CHICKEN]

If you could check I would appreciate it.  What's the disadvantage with the cheap lasered ABS?

Legends can wear out over time

[rrdein]

Legends can wear out over time

At first I read your statement and thought it was part of your sig, a poetic reminder that whatever glory or heights we achieve in life must eventually fade away to nothing. 

Then I scrolled up to read your reply and realized my error.

[Leslieann]

How o-rings work and feel varies greatly depending on the key caps, specifically what's underneath the keycap.
Some caps you can put two rings and still barely do anything, other times even a single one makes a big difference. And if they they do hit at the wrong time they can make a switch feel super mushy. They have their place but they're just really inconsistent.

If you want a softer bottom, some swear by stiffer springs since you're less likely to bottom out, I tend to prefer the opposite, a softer spring means you have less pressure on the switch so when you do hit bottom you aren't pressing as hard. I also highly recommend dampened switches if you're bottoming hard, though dampers do work better with stiffer springs, on light springs they feel quite hard by comparison to the spring.

Unfortunately at your price range getting dampened switches will be a pretty difficult thing to do.
Ducky, Varmilo, Vortex and Glorious offer silent/dampened switches but you're looking at about $100 at minimum for any of them. If you want easy, go with any of them, if you want a really nice board go with Glorious GMMK since it's hot swap, that way when you get a bit more cash spend it on lube and go at it.

[Maledicted]

If you could check I would appreciate it.  What's the disadvantage with the cheap lasered ABS?

I just double-checked. They're standard and they are definitely cheap lasered ABS. They're basically white translucent plastic that is painted and then the paint is ablated by a laser to create the legends. They're an economical way of creating legends that can be illuminated with backlighting. Some of them can hold up perfectly for years and some of them can start flaking in months. The popular obsession with enthusiasts is double shots because it is two different colors of plastic that are injection molded in separate steps, one for the legend and one for the rest of the cap. This makes the legends impossible to wear off. ABS also shines with use, which a lot of people seem to hate for one reason or another. There are preferences in thickness and material as well, depending on what sort of acoustics and feel someone prefers.

I'm not a huge fan of silent red so I really haven't even daily driven mine enough to get an idea of how well the legends might hold up. There might be some accounts on that elsewhere though if you Google it.

If you want a softer bottom, some swear by stiffer springs since you're less likely to bottom out, I tend to prefer the opposite, a softer spring means you have less pressure on the switch so when you do hit bottom you aren't pressing as hard. I also highly recommend dampened switches if you're bottoming hard, though dampers do work better with stiffer springs, on light springs they feel quite hard by comparison to the spring.

I don't understand how some people don't seem to be able to, or don't take the half an hour or so necessary, to acclimate to lighter switches. I wonder how much of that is just the people obsessed with trying not to bottom out at all that swear by stiff linears and tactiles.

[suicidal_orange]

I don't understand how some people don't seem to be able to, or don't take the half an hour or so necessary, to acclimate to lighter switches. I wonder how much of that is just the people obsessed with trying not to bottom out at all that swear by stiff linears and tactiles.

My first mech (the Ducky in my sig) came with MX reds, the weight of my fingers resting on the home row activated them and if I've paused typing to think I don't want to concentrate on keeping my fingers up.  I also had typos where I had caught the corner of an adjacent key which is poor technique so could have improved given time, but much as I tried to love my fancy new keyboard after weeks it didn't improve so I bought some clears.  Half an hour seems very optimistic!

[Maledicted]

I don't understand how some people don't seem to be able to, or don't take the half an hour or so necessary, to acclimate to lighter switches. I wonder how much of that is just the people obsessed with trying not to bottom out at all that swear by stiff linears and tactiles.

My first mech (the Ducky in my sig) came with MX reds, the weight of my fingers resting on the home row activated them and if I've paused typing to think I don't want to concentrate on keeping my fingers up.  I also had typos where I had caught the corner of an adjacent key which is poor technique so could have improved given time, but much as I tried to love my fancy new keyboard after weeks it didn't improve so I bought some clears.  Half an hour seems very optimistic!

I have had the same problems, and I don't like MX red even for gaming for the same reason. I just haven't been bothered enough to swap them for something a little stiffer. I meant mostly acclimatizing to the weighting so that it isn't jarring/painful to bottom out on something like an MX red. I don't know that there's really any adjusting to MX red being so ridiculously light that you accidentally cause presses to register sometimes. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Leslieann]

A half our is not going to adapt you to a much different spring.

In my experience...
5-10g is not a huge deal to change.
Going up 20g or more can take 2 weeks to adapt and it can physically hurt.
Going down 20g doesn't hurt but it can take weeks/ months before you stop miss-typing.

If you constantly switch between them all, it's not as much of an issue but if you just use one or the other it can take a while.

[tp4tissue]

10g is quite perceptible above 50g.

60g70g switches can tire you out if you're playing a typing game.

Tp4 uses 50g.

[Maledicted]

A half our is not going to adapt you to a much different spring.

In my experience...
5-10g is not a huge deal to change.
Going up 20g or more can take 2 weeks to adapt and it can physically hurt.
Going down 20g doesn't hurt but it can take weeks/ months before you stop miss-typing.

If you constantly switch between them all, it's not as much of an issue but if you just use one or the other it can take a while.

I guess that may be it for me then. I switch between vastly different clicky and tactile switches one heck of a lot, although I typically don't do a lot of typing on particularly light switches. Mostly medium to stiff, it still doesn't take me long to get used to typing on MX reds, and bottoming out on them is pretty jarring/painful until I put half an hour or so in with them. Going from light to heavy never seemed painful to me, just tiring. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯