Author Topic: Different Switches for Space and Mods  (Read 801 times)

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Offline Codylicious

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Different Switches for Space and Mods
« on: Tue, 11 February 2020, 13:59:54 »
Hey everyone. I've been following the Mech Keyboard scene on and off for years now. I've finally decided to build my own and I have settled on Kailh Box Jades as my alpha switches. I think I would like to have a different switch however for my space bar and maybe even the mods like shift, backspace, enter etc. Since the Jades are such a nice crisp click I think I would like a heavy, dull THOCK sound for my space bar. Does anyone have any suggestions for the best switch to achieve that sound and feel? Any thoughts about that pairing with the Jades? Thanks for your time!

Offline Maledicted

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Re: Different Switches for Space and Mods
« Reply #1 on: Tue, 11 February 2020, 14:59:03 »
Hello fellow Cody, and welcome to Geekhack. Great choice in box jades (are you me from another dimension?). From what I can gather, the pinks and the jades are the bassiest switches of the box family, which already seem to have amongst the bassiest switches of the modern switches. Navies would definitely not give you the thock you desire, although they're a pleasure to type on. I don't know of any, personally, that are bassier that would be compatible, much less as heavy as you would like, but maybe somebody might.

You could try swapping some sprit springs of an intermediate weighting into regular old jades and see how those work out for you. Personally, I've decided just to use all jades or all navies in all of my boards. I put a navy into the spacebar for my cop keyboard, but I realized even that was unnecessary once I tried filling an old Unitek K-151L with jades. No return issues whatsoever, even with the big ass enter key and giant AT space bar.

I imagine this is more specifically focused on varied weightings though moreso than the past concerns with sluggish return.

Offline DALExSNAIL

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Re: Different Switches for Space and Mods
« Reply #2 on: Tue, 11 February 2020, 15:26:19 »
Hello fellow Cody, and welcome to Geekhack. Great choice in box jades (are you me from another dimension?). From what I can gather, the pinks and the jades are the bassiest switches of the box family, which already seem to have amongst the bassiest switches of the modern switches. Navies would definitely not give you the thock you desire, although they're a pleasure to type on. I don't know of any, personally, that are bassier that would be compatible, much less as heavy as you would like, but maybe somebody might.

You could try swapping some sprit springs of an intermediate weighting into regular old jades and see how those work out for you. Personally, I've decided just to use all jades or all navies in all of my boards. I put a navy into the spacebar for my cop keyboard, but I realized even that was unnecessary once I tried filling an old Unitek K-151L with jades. No return issues whatsoever, even with the big ass enter key and giant AT space bar.

I imagine this is more specifically focused on varied weightings though moreso than the past concerns with sluggish return.

Any of the box switches with that heavy click bar aren't going to "thock", the click is too overpowering for that.
Bassier or not, click and thock are too distinctly different sounds, and any clicky switch by design won't give him what he's describing here. I know you love de click my man, but cmon  :p

Thock is hard to achieve in MX tbqh. I'd say linears with an SA or other high profile keyset will achieve this somewhat, but also silent options would most likely do this better. A note on silent though, it might not be the best option feel wise, as it's a soft bottom out short throw directly contrasted by a full throw harsh bottom out.

I personally think that something similar to an MX clear is the best option, only so that you dont have a huge contrast in feel from alpha to spacebar. Won't really be the same, but will be about as close as you can get imo.

Closest MX sound I've heard that actually almost "Thocks" btw
Forward video to 1:07 for them ASMR sounds
« Last Edit: Tue, 11 February 2020, 15:30:05 by DALExSNAIL »

Offline Maledicted

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Re: Different Switches for Space and Mods
« Reply #3 on: Tue, 11 February 2020, 15:40:10 »
Any of the box switches with that heavy click bar aren't going to "thock", the click is too overpowering for that.
Bassier or not, click and thock are too distinctly different sounds, and any clicky switch by design won't give him what he's describing here. I know you love de click my man, but cmon  :p

Thock is hard to achieve in MX tbqh. I'd say linears with an SA or other high profile keyset will achieve this somewhat, but also silent options would most likely do this better. A note on silent though, it might not be the best option feel wise, as it's a soft bottom out short throw directly contrasted by a full throw harsh bottom out.

I personally think that something similar to an MX clear is the best option, only so that you dont have a huge contrast in feel from alpha to spacebar. Won't really be the same, but will be about as close as you can get imo.

Closest MX sound I've heard that actually almost "Thocks" btw
Forward video to 1:07 for them ASMR sounds

I'll, respectfully, disagree with you there. Have you tried any of them? The click is basically at the very beginning of travel, so it is pretty much over by the time the switch bottoms out, but navies (like I'm typing on right now) have a much higher-pitched click than jades do, so there would be a contrast in sound there, between highs and lows, possibly grating to some. I find the nice bassy click of the jades to complement the following thock nicely. I suppose I could have worded my first post better.

Offline Codylicious

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Re: Different Switches for Space and Mods
« Reply #4 on: Tue, 11 February 2020, 15:43:59 »
Hello fellow Cody, and welcome to Geekhack. Great choice in box jades (are you me from another dimension?). From what I can gather, the pinks and the jades are the bassiest switches of the box family, which already seem to have amongst the bassiest switches of the modern switches. Navies would definitely not give you the thock you desire, although they're a pleasure to type on. I don't know of any, personally, that are bassier that would be compatible, much less as heavy as you would like, but maybe somebody might.

You could try swapping some sprit springs of an intermediate weighting into regular old jades and see how those work out for you. Personally, I've decided just to use all jades or all navies in all of my boards. I put a navy into the spacebar for my cop keyboard, but I realized even that was unnecessary once I tried filling an old Unitek K-151L with jades. No return issues whatsoever, even with the big ass enter key and giant AT space bar.

I imagine this is more specifically focused on varied weightings though moreso than the past concerns with sluggish return.

Any of the box switches with that heavy click bar aren't going to "thock", the click is too overpowering for that.
Bassier or not, click and thock are too distinctly different sounds, and any clicky switch by design won't give him what he's describing here. I know you love de click my man, but cmon  :p

Thock is hard to achieve in MX tbqh. I'd say linears with an SA or other high profile keyset will achieve this somewhat, but also silent options would most likely do this better. A note on silent though, it might not be the best option feel wise, as it's a soft bottom out short throw directly contrasted by a full throw harsh bottom out.

I personally think that something similar to an MX clear is the best option, only so that you dont have a huge contrast in feel from alpha to spacebar. Won't really be the same, but will be about as close as you can get imo.

Closest MX sound I've heard that actually almost "Thocks" btw
Forward video to 1:07 for them ASMR sounds

Thanks for the feedback! I have a set of SA profile Pulse keycaps so I do in fact have SA's as you suggested (I want SA Olivia's, but cant seem to acquire those anywhere). I plan to clip the stabilizers for the mods and space and lube them up to remove any rattle. Just been debating to go with the Jade's for the space bar or use a different switch. I will definitely take your suggestions into consideration :)

Offline DALExSNAIL

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Re: Different Switches for Space and Mods
« Reply #5 on: Tue, 11 February 2020, 15:44:41 »
Any of the box switches with that heavy click bar aren't going to "thock", the click is too overpowering for that.
Bassier or not, click and thock are too distinctly different sounds, and any clicky switch by design won't give him what he's describing here. I know you love de click my man, but cmon  :p

Thock is hard to achieve in MX tbqh. I'd say linears with an SA or other high profile keyset will achieve this somewhat, but also silent options would most likely do this better. A note on silent though, it might not be the best option feel wise, as it's a soft bottom out short throw directly contrasted by a full throw harsh bottom out.

I personally think that something similar to an MX clear is the best option, only so that you dont have a huge contrast in feel from alpha to spacebar. Won't really be the same, but will be about as close as you can get imo.

Closest MX sound I've heard that actually almost "Thocks" btw
Forward video to 1:07 for them ASMR sounds

I'll, respectfully, disagree with you there. Have you tried any of them? The click is basically at the very beginning of travel, so it is pretty much over by the time the switch bottoms out, but navies (like I'm typing on right now) have a much higher-pitched click than jades do, so there would be a contrast in sound there, between highs and lows, possibly grating to some. I find the nice bassy click of the jades to complement the following thock nicely. I suppose I could have worded my first post better.

Would you describe any of those keys as dull? Pitch changes don't make a click a thock. Switch pressing doesn't last long enough to even take into consideration the difference in the stem bottoming out vs the click bar making a sound.

At this point, it's just shilling.
« Last Edit: Tue, 11 February 2020, 15:46:27 by DALExSNAIL »

Offline Findecanor

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Re: Different Switches for Space and Mods
« Reply #6 on: Tue, 11 February 2020, 15:55:30 »
You could try swapping some sprit springs of an intermediate weighting into regular old jades and see how those work out for you.
Springs made for Cherry MX do not fit in Kailh BOX switches. The BOX switches' springs are narrower.

... or are there Sprit springs especially for Kailh BOX switches?
Man must shape his tools lest they shape him
-- Arthur Miller

Offline Maledicted

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Re: Different Switches for Space and Mods
« Reply #7 on: Tue, 11 February 2020, 16:47:04 »

Would you describe any of those keys as dull? Pitch changes don't make a click a thock. Switch pressing doesn't last long enough to even take into consideration the difference in the stem bottoming out vs the click bar making a sound.

At this point, it's just shilling.

Describe which keys as dull? I hadn't even watched the video until now, I just know that it is very easy for me to tell, with box thick clicks, the click and the sound of bottoming out apart. Even with jades, at least the way that I type, the click is pretty much done by the time the cap bottoms out, since there's plenty of travel left when the tactilile event has long since passed. Now that I try on MX blue clones, I can tell them apart on that too, though it obviously isn't as obvious. I'm also used to listening to music with ... a lot of simultaneous individual instrument tracks going at once, very fast, so maybe that's part of why. To each their own, as always my friend. That's a delicious-sounding board you linked there.

Shilling? Hmmm. If I were doing that, it would be for SKCM blue Alps. Thick clicks are just my modern stand-in.

You could try swapping some sprit springs of an intermediate weighting into regular old jades and see how those work out for you.
Springs made for Cherry MX do not fit in Kailh BOX switches. The BOX switches' springs are narrower.

... or are there Sprit springs especially for Kailh BOX switches?

Yes, they do make springs for box switches. They have for some time now I think.
« Last Edit: Tue, 11 February 2020, 16:49:47 by Maledicted »

Offline DALExSNAIL

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Re: Different Switches for Space and Mods
« Reply #8 on: Tue, 11 February 2020, 17:09:40 »

Would you describe any of those keys as dull? Pitch changes don't make a click a thock. Switch pressing doesn't last long enough to even take into consideration the difference in the stem bottoming out vs the click bar making a sound.

At this point, it's just shilling.

Describe which keys as dull? I hadn't even watched the video until now, I just know that it is very easy for me to tell, with box thick clicks, the click and the sound of bottoming out apart. Even with jades, at least the way that I type, the click is pretty much done by the time the cap bottoms out, since there's plenty of travel left when the tactilile event has long since passed. Now that I try on MX blue clones, I can tell them apart on that too, though it obviously isn't as obvious. I'm also used to listening to music with ... a lot of simultaneous individual instrument tracks going at once, very fast, so maybe that's part of why. To each their own, as always my friend. That's a delicious-sounding board you linked there.

Shilling? Hmmm. If I were doing that, it would be for SKCM blue Alps. Thick clicks are just my modern stand-in.

Im saying would you describe any of the clicky box switches you recommended as dull.

It just seems like a wild response to someone asking for a dull thocky switch, with suggestions for clicky switches, hence the shill comment.


Offline Maledicted

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Re: Different Switches for Space and Mods
« Reply #9 on: Tue, 11 February 2020, 17:26:48 »
Im saying would you describe any of the clicky box switches you recommended as dull.

It just seems like a wild response to someone asking for a dull thocky switch, with suggestions for clicky switches, hence the shill comment.

Yes, I would, just like I would with Alps clickies. The click on a few of them is surprisingly low in pitch. Jades and pinks specifically. I have no doubt that you would get the the lowest of the low of any sound sticking to straight linears/tactiles and beefy caps, on a plastic plate or something, when considering the overall soundtrack. I imagine that that's almost guaranteed considering the volume of air involved in the cap and case vs any possible click mechanism. You've got that down with your preferred switches, you've got the bassiest of the bass. I'm almost certain that that's objective fact.

He was specifically talking about clickies, so unless he intended to mix linears/tactiles with clickies (not anything I would ever do, but again, to each their own), and wanted something heavier than jades, jades with a bit heavier springs were what I thought of. If you go as far as navies, they don't exactly sound bassy anymore.

If he were talking about tactiles or linears, I would have left it entirely to you guys.  ;)