Compact Matrix, novel arrow key placement.

[Linkbane]

EDIT: I've made a concept draft, if it's more helpful. 0.5 keys thinner than the HHKB, no wasted space at all. Matrix layout for the ergonomically-minded, theoretically I could shorten it another 0.25 keylengths by trimming the backspace, tab, enter, shift, and spacebar with staggered, but it seems unnecessary and overly cramped.

All in all, I feel like this my perfect board. All the function of a fullsize including dedicated (vital for me) arrow keys, nav keys which are easy to use, matrix numpad, and a variety of arcane functions which are needed but not often used (pause/break, scroll lock) are all there. I even have control keys for volume, brightness, and mute because I love how easy it is to adjust all of these things on my laptop keyboard. In a perfect world I would have DIP switches for changing interface (swapping control/tab, control/delete, etc.), but money! I also have a windows and a menu button, easily accessible via Fn, and even a windows lock for the uber-paranoid.



Here it is. You may see that the way I arrange keys is normal on top, Shift+key in the middle, and Fn+key in the bottom right or side. I made a bit of a flub on the circumflex key, my intention was that given how unused it was, a tilde could be generated via FnLock+Shift or Fn activated via Shift, and a circumflex could be generated just via FnLock; the error was that Shift had to be pressed to activate the normal Fn. My intention was that Fn by itself was easy to press just by using one or two fingers right atop of each other. Also have LoL shortcuts in Qwerty underneath, just for fun.

[erest]

And for my first post I thought it would be funny introducing myself with the comment: patent pending erest corporations 

[yicaoyimu]

It's been going on for a while now.

http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=47133.0

[AKmalamute]

You could try to create in using the layout configurator page

While working on potential 40% boards I've taken to using their new "side print" field for marking layer 1 -- much the way some keyboards do, hey?

here, for example, is my 40% layer 1 ... Layer 0's link needs fiddling and I haven't saved it so anyway ...
Delete keys, move them around (it is a pain but one you get a base layout save that link and you can adjust the letters themselves.

[divito]

Thanks for that editor. This is the keyboard I eventually want to make:

http://www.keyboard-layout-editor.com/#/layouts/aa2fb1e92f781684e41b5a1dcd33cfd3

Not exactly sure on the colors, as I was just messing around with things. But that's definitely the layout and functionality I would want.

[swill]

Here is the 40% layout that I have been working on.  I hope to be able to build this...  I still have some questions about the function layer though.  I am not sure I am able to map the 'Fn + Shift' layer to a different key than the 'Fn' layer.  F1 - F12 keys are an example of this...

Base Layer


Function Layer


You can click the links I have provided to get started with a 40% layout in the online editor...

[jabar]

I guess no one reads Deskthority here...

http://deskthority.net/marketplace-f11/hypermicro-and-hypermini-keyboard-t4185.html

[swill]

I guess no one reads Deskthority here...

http://deskthority.net/marketplace-f11/hypermicro-and-hypermini-keyboard-t4185.html

Same sort of thing is happening here too: http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=47133.0
(as yicaoyimu also pointed out)...

[Linkbane]

Guys, I understand that there is a 40% project, I was just proposing an alternate layout which I thought would be interesting, which is very different from existing ones. Let me make a layout to show what I mean.

[spiceBar]

After reading Matias's thread, I came up with an idea for a very compact, perfectly functional keyboard with dedicated directional keys. I'm in a hurry, so just copy/pasting my original post.

"My 2¢ on 60% boards is that I wouldn't mind sacrificing Ctrl+Alt+Windows keys on the right side. I think that making an ultra-portable keyboard with these features would be interesting, and it would also be completely rectangular, with no bezel space.

Normal TKL layout. No function keys. Grave key/tilde is turned into escc with Fn+Esc becoming '`' with Fn+Shift+Esc becoming '~'. Obviously, a locking Fn key as well, with all F-keys mapped onto Fn + the number keys as well as the '-' and '+' keys. Instead of having a windows key, having a Ctrl/Alt key on the left with the Fn lock key in the middle. Fn+Ctrl becomes right click, with Fn+Alt becoming Windows. On the bottom right, make the right shift slightly smaller, as it's already massive, and use the Alt/Windows/key to the left of Ctrl as the arrow keys. Insert an extra key between the '/' and shift as the up arrow key, so it is symmetrical. Function keys can be used to switch between these and navigation functions, being end/home and Page Up/Page Down. Perhaps have Shift+directional keys act as volume control/mute/windows lock. Use a cluster of keys as the numpad, enabled via Fn, as well as the rest of the random media controls.

Finally, because I'm mostly for typists, I'd really like a Delete key where the backslash is, switchable again via Fn."

How does this sound as an idea, any interest?

Brace yourself for a lot of criticism from people who will not even read your post or who will not understand it.

Here is what happened when I suggested a layout:
  http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=47888.msg1023617#msg1023617

[dorkvader]

I think there are some vintage keyboards with this layout. Let me check.

[tp4tissue]

Do you guys have some sort of degenerative bone disease that brings your shoulders closer and closer together..



This would be great for portability...

[swill]

Guys, I understand that there is a 40% project, I was just proposing an alternate layout which I thought would b interesting, which is very different from existing ones. Let me make a layout to show what I mean.

The 40% project should include a fully programmable board, so you should be able to build any layout you wish.  Within reason anyway...    I think my layout is pushing the realm of reason.  haha...

[Linkbane]

Do you guys have some sort of degenerative bone disease that brings your shoulders closer and closer together..

Show Image

This would be great for portability...

tp, added an image. Critique?

[tp4tissue]

Do you guys have some sort of degenerative bone disease that brings your shoulders closer and closer together..

Show Image

This would be great for portability...

tp, added an image. Critique?

If we're making a chocolate bar board... the staggered layout is more ergonomic, because your hands would point in-wards towards each other.

As far as key layout... I believe the further you can push the main letters to the two sides, the better.. because otherwise, you'd be hunched over trying to get your hands close together..

If you sat straight and laid back.. putting your hands together is very difficult because you'd have to lift your whole shoulder up.. or bend your wrist at an even steeper angle..

^^ this may have to be sacrificed to fit the form however..   but I suppose it's worth it if portability is going to be the key element..

[Linkbane]

If we're making a chocolate bar board... the staggered layout is more ergonomic, because your hands would point in-wards towards each other.

As far as key layout... I believe the further you can push the main letters to the two sides, the better.. because otherwise, you'd be hunched over trying to get your hands close together..

If you sat straight and laid back.. putting your hands together is very difficult because you'd have to lift your whole shoulder up.. or bend your wrist at an even steeper angle..

^^ this may have to be sacrificed to fit the form however..   but I suppose it's worth it if portability is going to be the key element..

I see. In this case, though, I wanted to experiment with a matrix board, but if it is actually detrimental to ergonomics, the design should probably be changed. I imagine it's not too different from the HHKB though, which already has many members pleasuring themselves with, so perhaps it shall be alright.

Thanks tp. Because it is meant to be a tiny keyboard with zero wasted space and easy functionality, I think that it'll do its job well, but it's definitely not for someone who doesn't move their board a lot. However, if I had a board this size, I'd be tempted to take it to school.

Perhaps I shall work on a staggered layout if interest grows.

[Oobly]

Well, I like this idea...

Would like it better if you split the halves and staggered the columns vertically. Then perhaps add some thumb buttons instead of just a space bar. And tented the halves. And angled the thumb clusters. Maybe curve the thumb clusters so you can press them more easily. 

[Start rant]
Matrix layout is only one step on the road to ergo. Why only go one step when you are designing a board so you can go as far as you want to?
[End rant]

That said, if matrix is enough of a step for you then this is a good layout. I like the arrow cluster and compactness. Something just one more step in the right direction would be to do a symmetric outward stagger instead like suka's HyperNano: http://deskthority.net/post98712.html

That way you keep it in a compact, single piece, easy to transport board, but more comfortable to use than a normal staggered or matrix layout.

[Linkbane]

Well, I like this idea...

Would like it better if you split the halves and staggered the columns vertically. Then perhaps add some thumb buttons instead of just a space bar. And tented the halves. And angled the thumb clusters. Maybe curve the thumb clusters so you can press them more easily. 

[Start rant]
Matrix layout is only one step on the road to ergo. Why only go one step when you are designing a board so you can go as far as you want to?
[End rant]

That said, if matrix is enough of a step for you then this is a good layout. I like the arrow cluster and compactness. Something just one more step in the right direction would be to do a symmetric outward stagger instead like suka's HyperNano: http://deskthority.net/post98712.html

That way you keep it in a compact, single piece, easy to transport board, but more comfortable to use than a normal staggered or matrix layout.

Perhaps it could be like a portable ergodox, then. I know that ergonomic improvements in terms of changing the y- and x-orientation of keys could be done, but I don't know too much in particular about it so it'd probably turn out badle anyways.

I think something that would work well is having a PCB for both halves, and having a rail in between which would split the spacebar and other keys.

But as far as just a portable, high-function keyboard, that was mostly my goal.

[SpAmRaY]

Portable ergodox check out Moz's project

http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=48718.0

[Linkbane]

Portable ergodox check out Moz's project

http://geekhack.org/index.php?topic=48718.0

I was thinking of the same idea after I saw the IBM Options.
Maybe I'll have to stick with the matrix ergonomics and not go in there, then. Thanks spam.

[Hellmark]

The one thing that I am not liking about it, is the function keys. F1-3 next to F7-0, with F4-6 then F10-12 seems a bit odd.

[Linkbane]

The one thing that I am not liking about it, is the function keys. F1-3 next to F7-0, with F4-6 then F10-12 seems a bit odd.

What do you mean by that?

[Hellmark]

Y, U, I, O, P and Delete are the F keys, if you press it with function. Y is F1, U is F2, I is F3, O is F7, P is F8, Delete is F9. If you press shift and function, Y=F4, U=F5, I=F6, O=F10, P=F11, Delete is F12.

The way it kinda jumps around, to where one key will be right next to one that has a value of several higher.

[Linkbane]

Y, U, I, O, P and Delete are the F keys, if you press it with function. Y is F1, U is F2, I is F3, O is F7, P is F8, Delete is F9. If you press shift and function, Y=F4, U=F5, I=F6, O=F10, P=F11, Delete is F12.

The way it kinda jumps around, to where one key will be right next to one that has a value of several higher.

Are you referencing a different board from mine?

[Oobly]

Y, U, I, O, P and Delete are the F keys, if you press it with function. Y is F1, U is F2, I is F3, O is F7, P is F8, Delete is F9. If you press shift and function, Y=F4, U=F5, I=F6, O=F10, P=F11, Delete is F12.

The way it kinda jumps around, to where one key will be right next to one that has a value of several higher.

Are you referencing a different board from mine?

I think he means swill's layout that he posted earlier.

Linkbane, I like your layout. Forget what I said earlier about all the extra things, I was referring to my ultimate ergonomic board (something I am working on). By ultimate I mean for me, personally. It's a whole lot more different than most would be comfortable with, changing from a "normal" board. Something I've learnt is to do what suits you. So I say, "Go for it!". Make your own board.

I've started experimenting with a different way to prototype keyboards, drilling 3 holes per key (4mm for the central nub, 1.5mm for each pin) and mounting the base of the MX switch directly to the mount plate. This raises the keys up a lot, but you don't have to cut all the squares to mount the keys (drilling is a whole lot easier, at least for me). I glue the bottom switch case to the mount plate. It allows easy access for modding the switches themselves (adding lube / stickers or changing stems / springs, etc).

You can then wire up the matrix with diodes and connect the rows and columns to a Teensy 2.0, flash a suitable firmware modified for your layout and hey presto, functional custom board.

You can always change the character layout by modifying the firmware and flashing it again.

[Hellmark]

Sorry, yeah, got confused. I was commenting on Swills.

[Linkbane]

Linkbane, I like your layout. Forget what I said earlier about all the extra things, I was referring to my ultimate ergonomic board (something I am working on). By ultimate I mean for me, personally. It's a whole lot more different than most would be comfortable with, changing from a "normal" board. Something I've learnt is to do what suits you. So I say, "Go for it!". Make your own board.

I've started experimenting with a different way to prototype keyboards, drilling 3 holes per key (4mm for the central nub, 1.5mm for each pin) and mounting the base of the MX switch directly to the mount plate. This raises the keys up a lot, but you don't have to cut all the squares to mount the keys (drilling is a whole lot easier, at least for me). I glue the bottom switch case to the mount plate. It allows easy access for modding the switches themselves (adding lube / stickers or changing stems / springs, etc).

You can then wire up the matrix with diodes and connect the rows and columns to a Teensy 2.0, flash a suitable firmware modified for your layout and hey presto, functional custom board.

You can always change the character layout by modifying the firmware and flashing it again.

That's actually a great idea about mounting the switches. Considering that cutting steel plates is not easy nor simple to make consistent, accurate cuts, drilling would be much simpler and even a tool-light person like myself has a drill to use. Ease of access, I'm sure, would be well-appreciated by we crazy modders. Even I might do some switch modding if I didn't have to do a lot of reassembly.

I actually didn't know about the Teensy, I'll have to look into it. I don't have a particularly great amount of resources to make my own board or have someone make one for me though, so my idea of creating a prototype will have to wait for a few years at least.

Sorry, yeah, got confused. I was commenting on Swills.

Ah, gotcha. I prefer the linear layout of F-keys myself, but I always found programmer Dvorak with its matching of paired symbols, '()' and '[]' for instance, for the same fingers on opposite hand. Having $ & [ { } ( = * ) + ] ! #, so that you don't miss and hit one bracket or parentheses rather makes sense to me. It's also 7 5 3 1 9 0 2 4 6 8 `, which I'm not too sure about, but the design model is sound.

[davkol]

@OP Halves need to be split by at least one column—then you get a typematrix—or symmetrically staggered (see µTron). I've had this idea before, but it involves way too many compromises.

[dante]

You should make a 10% layout - with it being a long strip so it's used like a piano.  A set of pedals can control space / enter / backspace.

[Linkbane]

You should make a 10% layout - with it being a long strip so it's used like a piano.  A set of pedals can control space / enter / backspace.

If you can't figure things out enough to use a 60% layout, just don't bring a laptop in the first place. Honestly, carrying a keyboard in a box isn't that hard, and I think it's really pointless to have a board so tiny that you can hardly use it.
I understand that it was satire.

[davkol]

You should make a 10% layout - with it being a long strip so it's used like a piano.  A set of pedals can control space / enter / backspace.

If you can't figure things out enough to use a 60% layout, just don't bring a laptop in the first place. Honestly, carrying a keyboard in a box isn't that hard, and I think it's really pointless to have a board so tiny that you can hardly use it.
I understand that it was satire.

chording