Author Topic: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.  (Read 24614 times)

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Offline JaccoW

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #50 on: Tue, 26 November 2013, 18:45:43 »
Even though I own a PC that has been able to play pretty much everything and a laptop I bought last year that even outperforms it I can still see the appeal of the Xbox One.
I would love one of those as a media machine and to play games together with friends in the same room. But mostly the media part.

Will I play certain games on PC? Yes, of course. Will I prefer to own certain games on Console? Probably.


You can use a PC to play media or play games together with friends on a television.
Show Image

My desktop is a 20Kg beast of a case that I do not want to haul down two flights of stairs. And even an excellent piece of DLNA software like Mezzmo doesn't always cut it. For streaming 30GB Full HD content in any file or container type either the TV or the computer sometimes gets choppy.

So thank you for your comment...

But please refrain from doing so in the future.
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Offline YoungMichael88

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #51 on: Tue, 26 November 2013, 19:12:43 »
PC gaming is not the answer for everyone. I think the 1 Million+ PS4 launch day buyers and the 1 Million+ XBone launch day buyers demonstrates that quite nicely. However the PS4s sales were limited to North America only and XBone was sold in 13 different countries at launch so that should put things into perspective a little. Had PS4 launched in Japan and Europe the same day as in North America, it probably would have dwarfed the XBones sales at launch.

But let's just put aside the PS4 vs XBone competition for now and just look at these numbers as a whole. Both consoles set new records for sales compared to previous generations at launch. What does that mean? It's simple really. Console gaming is not on the decline. Quite the contrary.
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Offline JaccoW

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #52 on: Tue, 26 November 2013, 19:18:41 »
PC gaming is not the answer for everyone. I think the 1 Million+ PS4 launch day buyers and the 1 Million+ XBone launch day buyers demonstrates that quite nicely. However the PS4s sales were limited to North America only and XBone was sold in 13 different countries at launch so that should put things into perspective a little. Had PS4 launched in Japan and Europe the same day as in North America, it probably would have dwarfed the XBones sales at launch.

But let's just put aside the PS4 vs XBone competition for now and just look at these numbers as a whole. Both consoles set new records for sales compared to previous generations at launch. What does that mean? It's simple really. Console gaming is not on the decline. Quite the contrary.
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Offline demik

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #53 on: Tue, 26 November 2013, 23:45:56 »
PC MASTER RACE CHECKING IN.

XBOX GLORIFIED NETFLIX STREAMER

Quote
But let's just put aside the PS4 vs XBone competition for now and just look at these numbers as a whole. Both consoles set new records for sales compared to previous generations at launch. What does that mean? It's simple really. Console gaming is not on the decline. Quite the contrary.

lil wayne sells millions of albums. doesn't mean he's good. just means there are a lot of dumb mother****ers out there.
No, he’s not around. How that sound to ya? Jot it down.

Offline regack

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #54 on: Tue, 26 November 2013, 23:54:47 »
Actually this is pretty depressing.  To me, you are describing an Orwellian nightmare-box, all they need to do is add a spycam that peeps into your living room for the NSA and it really is a big brother tube, they already mine your data and read your emails, so why not, I guess.

Kinect.


(I'm not saying I agree with anything going on here, I just wanted to toss this into the mix :D)


Offline YoungMichael88

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #55 on: Tue, 26 November 2013, 23:59:17 »
PC MASTER RACE CHECKING IN.

XBOX GLORIFIED NETFLIX STREAMER

Quote
But let's just put aside the PS4 vs XBone competition for now and just look at these numbers as a whole. Both consoles set new records for sales compared to previous generations at launch. What does that mean? It's simple really. Console gaming is not on the decline. Quite the contrary.

lil wayne sells millions of albums. doesn't mean he's good. just means there are a lot of dumb mother****ers out there.
HWWHHAAAATTTT!!?? OKAY!!!!!
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Offline demik

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #56 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 00:00:17 »
PC MASTER RACE CHECKING IN.

XBOX GLORIFIED NETFLIX STREAMER

Quote
But let's just put aside the PS4 vs XBone competition for now and just look at these numbers as a whole. Both consoles set new records for sales compared to previous generations at launch. What does that mean? It's simple really. Console gaming is not on the decline. Quite the contrary.

lil wayne sells millions of albums. doesn't mean he's good. just means there are a lot of dumb mother****ers out there.
HWWHHAAAATTTT!!?? OKAY!!!!!

wrong black guy!
No, he’s not around. How that sound to ya? Jot it down.

Offline YoungMichael88

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #57 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 00:01:59 »
^ really? Damn.. I thought I nailed that one!!

EDIT: But I already gave myself high fives!!!
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Offline PointyFox

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #58 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 00:05:08 »
Is it just me, or does anyone else see "XBONE" as "X bone"?

Or maybe it is supposed to be "cross bone" as in pirates?

I thought they were saying "X BONE" until I read your post twice.

Offline demik

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #59 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 00:06:16 »
^ really? Damn.. I thought I nailed that one!!

EDIT: But I already gave myself high fives!!!

you must be a part time cop then
No, he’s not around. How that sound to ya? Jot it down.

Offline YoungMichael88

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #60 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 00:09:37 »
^ really? Damn.. I thought I nailed that one!!

EDIT: But I already gave myself high fives!!!

you must be a part time cop then
Ohh he's the "Lil" who sounds like he's singing through a tracheostomy speaking device all the time. My bad. Wrong "Lil"
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Offline demik

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #61 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 00:11:34 »
^ really? Damn.. I thought I nailed that one!!

EDIT: But I already gave myself high fives!!!

you must be a part time cop then
Ohh he's the "Lil" who sounds like he's singing through a tracheostomy speaking device all the time. My bad. Wrong "Lil"

he's the lil that is actually lil.

like 5'2 or something.
No, he’s not around. How that sound to ya? Jot it down.

Offline YoungMichael88

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #62 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 00:20:55 »
^ really? Damn.. I thought I nailed that one!!

EDIT: But I already gave myself high fives!!!

you must be a part time cop then
Ohh he's the "Lil" who sounds like he's singing through a tracheostomy speaking device all the time. My bad. Wrong "Lil"

he's the lil that is actually lil.

like 5'2 or something.
Awwww. Lil fella. He thinks he's people.
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Offline vun

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #63 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 01:08:56 »
Is it just me, or does anyone else see "XBONE" as "X bone"?


That's the whole point, it's not really meant as an endearing term, but I'm glad it stuck.

Offline SUPER432

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #64 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 01:50:23 »
The new Xbox 1 turns out to be a crappy PC under the hood.  Which tells me that PC gaming is not dead.  Eventually Xbox people must realize that they are using a really low-grade PC, and that everything would be better with a real PC, with an SSD, a real video card, and a real keyboard, which all can be had for ~ $750 (USD), which is cheaper than Xbox 1.  But then again, sheep will be sheep, and they always get sheared.

Did you prefer console launches with more exotic hardware, like PS3 Cell or Sega's strange architectures?

Offline YoungMichael88

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #65 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 02:03:43 »
I just have one question I would like to ask in regards to the OP.
How is ~$750 cheaper than the Xbox 1 which is $499?

Serious question. Not trying to stir the pot.
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Offline SUPER432

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #66 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 02:16:30 »
I just have one question I would like to ask in regards to the OP.
How is ~$750 cheaper than the Xbox 1 which is $499?

Serious question. Not trying to stir the pot.

To play devil's advocate, I'm assuming the answer is that at $750 it can do X more things for only Y more dollars.

I'm sure you could build a machine that can outpace the Xbox1 dollar for dollar at $499, but even then not everyone wants to tinker.

Offline YoungMichael88

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #67 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 02:18:23 »
I just have one question I would like to ask in regards to the OP.
How is ~$750 cheaper than the Xbox 1 which is $499?

Serious question. Not trying to stir the pot.

To play devil's advocate, I'm assuming the answer is that at $750 it can do X more things for only Y more dollars.

I'm sure you could build a machine that can outpace the Xbox1 dollar for dollar at $499, but even then not everyone wants to tinker.
Yea, that's what I was wondering.
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Offline SUPER432

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #68 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 02:26:01 »
PC MASTER RACE CHECKING IN.

XBOX GLORIFIED NETFLIX STREAMER

Quote
But let's just put aside the PS4 vs XBone competition for now and just look at these numbers as a whole. Both consoles set new records for sales compared to previous generations at launch. What does that mean? It's simple really. Console gaming is not on the decline. Quite the contrary.

lil wayne sells millions of albums. doesn't mean he's good. just means there are a lot of dumb mother****ers out there.

Growing up I had a PC but always wanted Nintendo consoles for Mario games. IMO there wasn't a PC platformer that could compare, at the time. Of course, there weren't games like Day of the Tentacle for consoles, so it wasn't one-sided in the least. Different strengths, different strokes, whatever. This may be less and less so, especially this generation with consoles and PCs sharing the same architecture, but the exclusives to certain consoles still exist.

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #69 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 05:21:50 »
Computers aren't connected to TVs in every home. It would be a pain in the ass to have to move your desktop every time you want to play a game in the living room.

here's the thing.. Why do people still go to their living rooms?..

Offline YoungMichael88

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #70 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 05:23:00 »
Computers aren't connected to TVs in every home. It would be a pain in the ass to have to move your desktop every time you want to play a game in the living room.

here's the thing.. Why do people still go to their living rooms?..
To live.....isn't it obvious?
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #71 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 05:27:24 »
Computers aren't connected to TVs in every home. It would be a pain in the ass to have to move your desktop every time you want to play a game in the living room.

here's the thing.. Why do people still go to their living rooms?..
To live.....isn't it obvious?

Hmm.. if that's the case, I've existed as an undead ever since getting broadband in 8th grade.


Offline Malphas

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #72 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 15:03:20 »
I imagined you precisely as one of those guys, tp. Constantly solitary, hunched over PC screen in a darkened room, subsisting off noodles and other things you can eat at your desk.

Offline Michael

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #73 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 15:15:48 »
I imagined you precisely as one of those guys, tp. Constantly solitary, hunched over PC screen in a darkened room, subsisting off noodles and other things you can eat at your desk.


You forgot to add 'who also doesn't have an ergo-dox'.


:P

Offline 127001

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #74 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 16:33:57 »
Consoles are standardized hardware that run a pre-selected, approved set of software.

Any Apple product?

Offline rowdy

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #75 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 17:23:33 »
Consoles are standardized hardware that run a pre-selected, approved set of software.

Any Apple product?

Apple used to have a gaming console, but that was many years ago.
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

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Offline 127001

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #76 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 17:51:33 »
No I know that, but what I mean is that Apple fits that description exactly. Uniform hardware and controlled software

Offline rowdy

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #77 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 18:11:21 »
No I know that, but what I mean is that Apple fits that description exactly. Uniform hardware and controlled software

Are you referring to the Mac, or to Apple tv?

Both would fit, I guess.

All they need to do is enable iOS games on the Apple tv and bingo!
"Because keyboards are accessories to PC makers, they focus on minimizing the manufacturing costs. But that’s incorrect. It’s in HHKB’s slogan, but when America’s cowboys were in the middle of a trip and their horse died, they would leave the horse there. But even if they were in the middle of a desert, they would take their saddle with them. The horse was a consumable good, but the saddle was an interface that their bodies had gotten used to. In the same vein, PCs are consumable goods, while keyboards are important interfaces." - Eiiti Wada

NEC APC-H4100E | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED red | Ducky DK9008 Shine MX blue LED green | Link 900243-08 | CM QFR MX black | KeyCool 87 white MX reds | HHKB 2 Pro | Model M 02-Mar-1993 | Model M 29-Nov-1995 | CM Trigger (broken) | CM QFS MX green | Ducky DK9087 Shine 3 TKL Yellow Edition MX black | Lexmark SSK 21-Apr-1994 | IBM SSK 13-Oct-1987 | CODE TKL MX clear | Model M 122 01-Jun-1988

Ị̸͚̯̲́ͤ̃͑̇̑ͯ̊̂͟ͅs̞͚̩͉̝̪̲͗͊ͪ̽̚̚ ̭̦͖͕̑́͌ͬͩ͟t̷̻͔̙̑͟h̹̠̼͋ͤ͋i̤̜̣̦̱̫͈͔̞ͭ͑ͥ̌̔s̬͔͎̍̈ͥͫ̐̾ͣ̔̇͘ͅ ̩̘̼͆̐̕e̞̰͓̲̺̎͐̏ͬ̓̅̾͠͝ͅv̶̰͕̱̞̥̍ͣ̄̕e͕͙͖̬̜͓͎̤̊ͭ͐͝ṇ̰͎̱̤̟̭ͫ͌̌͢͠ͅ ̳̥̦ͮ̐ͤ̎̊ͣ͡͡n̤̜̙̺̪̒͜e̶̻̦̿ͮ̂̀c̝̘̝͖̠̖͐ͨͪ̈̐͌ͩ̀e̷̥͇̋ͦs̢̡̤ͤͤͯ͜s͈̠̉̑͘a̱͕̗͖̳̥̺ͬͦͧ͆̌̑͡r̶̟̖̈͘ỷ̮̦̩͙͔ͫ̾ͬ̔ͬͮ̌?̵̘͇͔͙ͥͪ͞ͅ

Offline Wildcard

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #78 on: Wed, 27 November 2013, 18:58:18 »
PC MASTER RACE CHECKING IN.

XBOX GLORIFIED NETFLIX STREAMER

Quote
But let's just put aside the PS4 vs XBone competition for now and just look at these numbers as a whole. Both consoles set new records for sales compared to previous generations at launch. What does that mean? It's simple really. Console gaming is not on the decline. Quite the contrary.

lil wayne sells millions of albums. doesn't mean he's good. just means there are a lot of dumb mother****ers out there.

Growing up I had a PC but always wanted Nintendo consoles for Mario games. IMO there wasn't a PC platformer that could compare, at the time. Of course, there weren't games like Day of the Tentacle for consoles, so it wasn't one-sided in the least. Different strengths, different strokes, whatever. This may be less and less so, especially this generation with consoles and PCs sharing the same architecture, but the exclusives to certain consoles still exist.

I just bought a wii u for my son for x-mas. But truthfully, I probably bought it for myself :)

Offline paicrai

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #79 on: Thu, 28 November 2013, 04:44:35 »
I imagined you precisely as one of those guys, tp. Constantly solitary, hunched over PC screen in a darkened room, subsisting off noodles and other things you can eat at your desk.


You forgot to add 'who also doesn't have an ergo-dox'.


:P

That shivered his timbers for sure.
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I will literally **** you raw paicrai, I hope you're legal by the time I meet you.
👌👀👌👀👌👀👌👀👌👀 good **** go౦ԁ ****👌 thats ✔ some good👌👌**** right👌👌th 👌 ere👌👌👌 right✔there ✔✔if i do ƽaү so my self 💯  i say so 💯  thats what im talking about right there right there (chorus: ʳᶦᵍʰᵗ ᵗʰᵉʳᵉ) mMMMMᎷМ💯 👌👌 👌НO0ОଠOOOOOОଠଠOoooᵒᵒᵒᵒᵒᵒᵒᵒᵒ👌 👌👌 👌 💯 👌 👀 👀 👀 👌👌Good ****

Offline davkol

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #80 on: Fri, 29 November 2013, 05:15:06 »

Offline quickcrx702

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #81 on: Fri, 29 November 2013, 05:29:24 »
Consoles are better for kids who you don't want touching your PC, or a group of people drinking beer sharing one device using multiple controllers.  PCs are better for pretty much everything else.

Offline ferociousfingerings

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #82 on: Sat, 30 November 2013, 13:54:27 »
Well, PC gaming isn't "dead," but it's certainly been seriously wounded several times in the last several years, with signs of continuing that trend. Look at all the previously potential-packed IP that got ruined by whatever corporate gaming conglomerate (coughEAcough). Look at all the "smash'n'grab," half-assed, heavily monetized (read: fragmented and compartmentalized; you buy a vanilla base game and then each chunk costs more...) crap out there. Look at all the over-hyped, glorified benchmarks-masquerading-as-games (crysis, bf4, etc.).

PC gaming as a thing that lots of people still do and enjoy, and intend to continue, isn't dead at all; the companies releasing most of the games are killing it, making it more and more difficult for anyone to buy a GOOD game, and get real, long-term fun out of it. "Back in the day," it used to be easy to get fun out of a game. Now it's a lot of work! (and costs ridiculous amounts of money just to have hardware that can even take advantage of all the wonderful new eye-candy without hitching or stuttering)

Moving on...

Consoles are "good," for one primary reason: they are standardized and optimized, and everything made for them is made *specifically* for them and their unchanging hardware, and is done without the resource overhead of an operating system like Windows (too bad no directX anywhere but windows and consoles!), or the problems that come with a wide spectrum of different hardware in each machine.

Also, i think (think!) the reason they still use removable disc media, is more about control, DRM, and... well i forgot the other factor i was going to mention, but it's mostly this. It might be partially due to convention as well (people are used to it), but it's mostly those other things; you can't have people easily toting around 100s of GB worth of games on several USB 3.0 portable SSD-sticks, and a cloud service with user accounts so you can take your games anywhere there's a console to play them. That would make too much sense, and would probably be crackable somehow. You can't download a physical disc, so the console's parent company can more easily and cheaply control who is allowed to access what, and ensure they're not getting screwed out of any profits by people (who likely feel they are the ones getting screwed!) sharing stuff without worrying about damaging it. Plus, having a physical item on a shelf in a physical store, allows them to exploit the art of consumer psychological manipulation through packaging, and the "oh! look! i must buy this now, since it's sitting right here and i can just take it home and play it immediately!" People are indeed suckers (especially those with heads full of fantasy who chase shiny things). But sometimes i wonder how much of a sucker we PC gaming enthusiasts are, since we spend thousands of dollars on hardware for which almost no game is ever properly optimized.

I like mods, and dislike lock-ins. Even with all the annoyances, PC gaming is still superior IMO. Doesn't mean i hate anyone who opts for consoles. I can certainly see some valid reasons to do so, but those reasons aren't enough for me.

Xbone and PS4 might be "just a crappy PC inside," but at least they don't require tens of gigs worth of bloatware that tries to consume all available ram, just to enable directX gaming (coughWINDOWScough). PC gaming would be far better if directX didn't require windows, and/or if there was a competitive non-windows alternative (afaik, OpenGL isn't good enough, for various reasons... but i'm no expert in that regard; i would like to be wrong!).
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Offline Malphas

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #83 on: Sat, 30 November 2013, 14:11:23 »
The overhead used by Windows in regard to games is absolutely minimal to the point where has zero impact how on games perform (which are primarily limited by your GPU, not background CPU cycles and memory allocation). Also, using all available memory is a good thing and makes your PC perform faster.

Offline ferociousfingerings

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #84 on: Sat, 30 November 2013, 14:22:06 »
The overhead used by Windows in regard to games is absolutely minimal to the point where has zero impact how on games perform (which are primarily limited by your GPU, not background CPU cycles and memory allocation). Also, using all available memory is a good thing and makes your PC perform faster.

1. not exactly, but it's not really worth debating.
2. only if the thing i actually want to do next is cached in ram; when it's full of something else, then it has to free the ram first, then do what i wanted it to do.

Also: windows is expensive; i don't want to pay $200 just for trim support. I don't need anything else that isn't in Vista. (perhaps your "overhead" comment does not apply to vista? in which case i would see more value in an upgrade... but would still not be happy about having to buy windows again, just to make it work right)

Start adding up the hundreds required to maintain a snappy system, or upgrade hardware every year or two... the cost surpasses consoles easily, but with questionable gains.

My 1090t@3.6, 2x4GB 1866 ram(@1800), and gtx590 (cpu/gpus on water), should be more than adequate; yet it isn't quite good enough to mirror the smooth performance of a recent console, and to build a new system would easily cost more than a console, unless i buy cheap (and possibly end up buying twice as a result).

The big difference, obviously, is that a PC can do a whole lot of other cool stuff that a console can't (some of which they can be made to do with special provisions).


Perhaps it's time for me to cut the cord and drop windows, opting instead for a modest linux box and a console?

Or maybe i should sell it all and buy a nice tent and some survival gear, and disappear into the wilderness...
« Last Edit: Sat, 30 November 2013, 14:25:42 by ferociousfingerings »
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Offline digi

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #85 on: Sat, 30 November 2013, 14:49:50 »
Well, PC gaming isn't "dead," but it's certainly been seriously wounded.....

I share a similar outlook on the topic of pc gaming, just out of curiosity, what game(s) are you playing now if any?

Offline baldgye

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #86 on: Sat, 30 November 2013, 14:54:57 »
Clearly consoles are better than PC's becasue they have all the best games and run at all the best settings. Don't have to worry about frame-rate and changing my AA or resolution settings becasue my console runs everything at max at 1080p. PC gamers are desperate for there platform not to be dead, but it already is. Valve's new console that's on the horizon is the final play in the console's battle.

In the end Nintendo always win.

Offline IvanIvanovich

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #87 on: Sat, 30 November 2013, 15:32:15 »
I think we will start seeing the end of poorly/un-optimized console ports. Since as far as I understand it xbox os is based on same minwin core/directx api (or at least close enough) as Windows 8, and with hardware target x86-64 CPU with slow clock and a low/mid range GPU. they would have to **** up spectacularly for any Windows versions of upcoming games to not run just as good as or better than the console version. There should be very little that needs to be done in comparison to before. No architecture change from PPC, no need to make different versions for different newer generations of directx... Personally I hope they don't pander to crap 5 generation old PC hardware and keep the minimum specs to PC part equivalents of the console hardware. With XP support ending in 2014, I can only hope all the game devs go along with that too.
I want to see nothing but x64 games from then on, with all the benefits that come with it, like not being locked down to 3GB of memory.

Offline Malphas

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #88 on: Sun, 01 December 2013, 09:10:50 »
Clearly consoles are better than PC's becasue they have all the best games and run at all the best settings. Don't have to worry about frame-rate and changing my AA or resolution settings becasue my console runs everything at max at 1080p. PC gamers are desperate for there platform not to be dead, but it already is. Valve's new console that's on the horizon is the final play in the console's battle.

In the end Nintendo always win.

Can't tell if srs, I hope it's not. Obviously consoles don't play everything at max, they play it at whatever the developers decide is the optimum setting for the hardware, which is usually somewhere between low and medium compared to the PC version. Dropping framerates is still at issue with consoles - which tend to have a lower framerate to begin with, exacerbating the problem. The only thing is, since you can't change the settings you have no control over the tradeoff between graphics/framerate like you do with a PC.

I'm not sure how you can claim that PC gaming is dead when y'know basic facts would indicate otherwise. For instance, comparing sales of multi-format titles (i.e. virtually all of them these days) on the PC, Xbox 360, and PS3 over the last several years, the PC has consistently sold the most copies of the three.

Offline baldgye

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #89 on: Sun, 01 December 2013, 09:43:51 »
Clearly consoles are better than PC's becasue they have all the best games and run at all the best settings. Don't have to worry about frame-rate and changing my AA or resolution settings becasue my console runs everything at max at 1080p. PC gamers are desperate for there platform not to be dead, but it already is. Valve's new console that's on the horizon is the final play in the console's battle.

In the end Nintendo always win.

Can't tell if srs, I hope it's not. Obviously consoles don't play everything at max, they play it at whatever the developers decide is the optimum setting for the hardware, which is usually somewhere between low and medium compared to the PC version. Dropping framerates is still at issue with consoles - which tend to have a lower framerate to begin with, exacerbating the problem. The only thing is, since you can't change the settings you have no control over the tradeoff between graphics/framerate like you do with a PC.

I'm not sure how you can claim that PC gaming is dead when y'know basic facts would indicate otherwise. For instance, comparing sales of multi-format titles (i.e. virtually all of them these days) on the PC, Xbox 360, and PS3 over the last several years, the PC has consistently sold the most copies of the three.

I knew someone would bite, something the OP thought when making this hilariously stupid thread.

Offline Malphas

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #90 on: Sun, 01 December 2013, 11:13:13 »
Well don't I feel foolish.

Offline ynrozturk

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #91 on: Mon, 02 December 2013, 14:54:50 »
I don't think I agree.  Doesn't matter what the hardware is.  A console is not a PC, they serve different roles.

The first Xbox actually WAS a PC inside.  It was a console, not a PC.

Consoles are standardized hardware that run a pre-selected, approved set of software.  They cater to families, casual gamers, and only partially to hardcore gamers.  They don't have keyboards, or mice, or user-facing OS-level features.  They about delivering specific content to everybody the same way.

So these days the hardware isn't unique.  Not surprising.  It's the software and the infrastructure that makes the platform.

Actually this is pretty depressing.  To me, you are describing an Orwellian nightmare-box, all they need to do is add a spycam that peeps into your living room for the NSA and it really is a big brother tube, they already mine your data and read your emails, so why not, I guess.

Also if the new Xbox costs more than a budget gaming PC, why bother with it?

You said in your first post that "everything would be better with a real PC, with an SSD, a real video card, and a real keyboard, which all can be had for ~ $750 (USD), which is cheaper than Xbox 1."

No it isn't. If you want a proper gaming PC that will last you for more than a few years, you're looking at over $1000.

What makes consoles special is the experience and the exclusive titles. I game on both PS and PC, and there are certain games I'll play for each platform. All of my FPS gaming is done on PC, yet my platform games, I don't know, like Assassins Creed are all done on PS.

This whole hating on console or hating on PC thing is getting real old. Real gamers don't give a crap, and they will usually be on two or three different platforms.

On a "budget" gaming PC, yes you'll be able to play Battlefield 4 and Crysis 3, but it will look like crap. Your PC will have whole world of problems with overheating, etc. that it's not even worth it. So to the people who can't afford a high end gaming PC, then get a console. Not to mention the fact that most FPS games are riddled with cheaters on PC. Stuff like that very rarely, if ever, happens on console. Everyone is playing on the same level so I kind of like that a lot.

Yes I like my PC more and do all of my serious gaming on it, but those people who tell others to just get a budget PC are missing the point.  Get a console rather than a budget PC, if all you want to do is play games on it. Because like I said, who wants to play Battlefield 4 on medium/low settings? What's the point?
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Offline Melvang

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #92 on: Mon, 02 December 2013, 16:27:25 »
I don't think I agree.  Doesn't matter what the hardware is.  A console is not a PC, they serve different roles.

The first Xbox actually WAS a PC inside.  It was a console, not a PC.

Consoles are standardized hardware that run a pre-selected, approved set of software.  They cater to families, casual gamers, and only partially to hardcore gamers.  They don't have keyboards, or mice, or user-facing OS-level features.  They about delivering specific content to everybody the same way.

So these days the hardware isn't unique.  Not surprising.  It's the software and the infrastructure that makes the platform.

Actually this is pretty depressing.  To me, you are describing an Orwellian nightmare-box, all they need to do is add a spycam that peeps into your living room for the NSA and it really is a big brother tube, they already mine your data and read your emails, so why not, I guess.

Also if the new Xbox costs more than a budget gaming PC, why bother with it?

You said in your first post that "everything would be better with a real PC, with an SSD, a real video card, and a real keyboard, which all can be had for ~ $750 (USD), which is cheaper than Xbox 1."

No it isn't. If you want a proper gaming PC that will last you for more than a few years, you're looking at over $1000.

What makes consoles special is the experience and the exclusive titles. I game on both PS and PC, and there are certain games I'll play for each platform. All of my FPS gaming is done on PC, yet my platform games, I don't know, like Assassins Creed are all done on PS.

This whole hating on console or hating on PC thing is getting real old. Real gamers don't give a crap, and they will usually be on two or three different platforms.

On a "budget" gaming PC, yes you'll be able to play Battlefield 4 and Crysis 3, but it will look like crap. Your PC will have whole world of problems with overheating, etc. that it's not even worth it. So to the people who can't afford a high end gaming PC, then get a console. Not to mention the fact that most FPS games are riddled with cheaters on PC. Stuff like that very rarely, if ever, happens on console. Everyone is playing on the same level so I kind of like that a lot.

Yes I like my PC more and do all of my serious gaming on it, but those people who tell others to just get a budget PC are missing the point.  Get a console rather than a budget PC, if all you want to do is play games on it. Because like I said, who wants to play Battlefield 4 on medium/low settings? What's the point?

I would have to agree with this post wholeheartedly.
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Offline McWilloughby

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #93 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 12:18:59 »
I think one thing worth noting with regards to price is this:

Assume a console costs ~£400. So consumer X buys the newest console (they already have a TV, sound system, whatever) and on top of that they get a basic (rubbish) laptop for ~£350. After 2 years, they decide the laptop needs replacing and so they buy another £350 laptop (plenty of people do this, most the people I build computers for now are people that have been doing this for years only to realise they're effectively spending more money). Pretend this console has a lifespan of 6 years (pretty fair considering the 360 came out in 2005). Consumer X replaces their laptop twice in the lifetime of the console so in total they've spent £1,450 in 6 years.

Consumer Y looks at the internet and finds out how to build his computer (or he gets a friend to do it at an extra cost of £50 or a custom builder for ~£100). Their parts come to the cost of £882.90 in the first year, the specs are shown here so you can see if you agree with me: I think this is a fairly reasonable mid range build (they already have a monitor, mouse, keyboard and speakers/headpohones). After 3 years, they decide to upgrade the graphics card to a newer model, +£250 and add another 8 GB of RAM lets say for £40 (though I'd say that is a fairly high estimate) and keep the computer for another 3 years. Sure, by the end of the 6 years, it's flagging a little bit but it still cost them £277.10 less than what the console guy spent (not counting the fact that PC games are generally cheaper). If they'd spend that extra £277.10 they could've used the change to start with an i7 and a GTX 780 (or whatever other hardware combinations you want).

I think the "cost" argument is a moot point. It's not unreasonable to own and use a gaming PC for 6 years (I've owned mine for that long with minor upgrades along the way). All it requires is a larger initial investment and a little research which is presumably the reason people buy consoles in the first place: because it's easy.

Offline ynrozturk

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #94 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 12:37:17 »
Because it's easy and has exclusive titles. God of War III alone sold more than 6 million copies. That's a damn lot of people who missed out on PC.

Like I said before, most serious gamers are on multiple platforms. But yes, buying a laptop every 2-3 years is a complete waste.
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #95 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 13:10:14 »
PC gaming will never die.. simply because Piracy...

You can't compete with free...

So you go more/less f2p.. and then leverage the game as an advertising platform..

Offline Melvang

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #96 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 13:17:38 »
PC gaming will never die.. simply because Piracy...

You can't compete with free...

So you go more/less f2p.. and then leverage the game as an advertising platform..

Nothing in this world is free.
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #97 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 13:23:16 »
PC gaming will never die.. simply because Piracy...

You can't compete with free...

So you go more/less f2p.. and then leverage the game as an advertising platform..

Nothing in this world is free.

what about sunlight..

Offline Melvang

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Re: PC Gaming is NOT Dead - the new Xbox is just a crappy PC on the inside.
« Reply #98 on: Tue, 03 December 2013, 13:25:37 »
costs you the risk of skin cancer
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