Author Topic: Animal Rights  (Read 4188 times)

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Offline tp4tissue

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Animal Rights
« on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 10:47:47 »
Whuddup wit dat..


Do ya'll think animals have rights ?

What about animals we eat ?


Offline digi

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #1 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 10:51:20 »
#DogLivesMatter
#CowLivesDontMatter

Offline nmur

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #2 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 10:55:51 »
yeh probably

if i stop eating animals it's not gonna do anything, and meat is the best **** ever

#DogLivesMatter
#CowLivesDontMatter

some animals are just more equal than others

heaven forbid us eat a cute animal

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #3 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 10:58:40 »
#DogLivesMatter
#CowLivesDontMatter



The issue here is,  We always assume doglivesmatter as correct..    Is it ?



If it turns out,   doglivesmatter is incorrect..

then ..............cowlivesdontmatter   is CORRECT


Offline fohat.digs

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What this shows is that the Republican Party knows, deep down somewhere, that even before Trump they had less than a policy agenda. All they’ve had for the past decade or so is strategy and tactics to suppress the vote, either through extreme gerrymandering or State-level laws. More often than not, as we’re seeing, through both. Without a stated party platform they are left with nothing but the insanity of The Power Grab and The Big Lie. The Party as a whole has, for some twisted logical reason, decided that America no longer needs Democracy. That in the bent and tortured reality Republicans have created for themselves America was never a Democracy, the Founders never intended for the country’s politics or social order to change, that the country’s democratic features would always only extend to wealthy White Christian property owners. They’ve also, collectively, decided that threatening major, multi-billion dollar corporations that employ tens, if not hundreds, of thousands of people worldwide will somehow, for some reason, cower in the corner when State politicians decide to take a few million in subsidies off the table. When faced with hundreds of millions, or even billions, in lost business because The People are voting with their wallet, I know where I’d position my company, and it’s not at the dinner table with Mitch McConnell and his wife.
– **** Scott 2021-04-08

Offline digi

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #5 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 11:11:19 »
#DogLivesMatter
#CowLivesDontMatter



The issue here is,  We always assume doglivesmatter as correct..    Is it ?



If it turns out,   doglivesmatter is incorrect..

then ..............cowlivesdontmatter   is CORRECT



Yes!

Everything can be broken down with complex math algorithms (as you already know). :)

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #6 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 11:12:25 »

Yes!

Everything can be broken down with complex math algorithms (as you already know). :)



Uh oh,  geekhack math xpert  -Digi-  is about unleash some shi7

Offline digi

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #7 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 11:35:44 »

Yes!

Everything can be broken down with complex math algorithms (as you already know). :)



Uh oh,  geekhack math xpert  -Digi-  is about unleash some shi7

I was going to expand on the complex notation of animal equality but relative to animals / conjugate * Reciprocal + the absolute valute of cow manure < the direct relative of dogs *  z=\ln(a^{b})=b\ln(a)

Hopefully this makes sense. :)

Offline fohat.digs

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What this shows is that the Republican Party knows, deep down somewhere, that even before Trump they had less than a policy agenda. All they’ve had for the past decade or so is strategy and tactics to suppress the vote, either through extreme gerrymandering or State-level laws. More often than not, as we’re seeing, through both. Without a stated party platform they are left with nothing but the insanity of The Power Grab and The Big Lie. The Party as a whole has, for some twisted logical reason, decided that America no longer needs Democracy. That in the bent and tortured reality Republicans have created for themselves America was never a Democracy, the Founders never intended for the country’s politics or social order to change, that the country’s democratic features would always only extend to wealthy White Christian property owners. They’ve also, collectively, decided that threatening major, multi-billion dollar corporations that employ tens, if not hundreds, of thousands of people worldwide will somehow, for some reason, cower in the corner when State politicians decide to take a few million in subsidies off the table. When faced with hundreds of millions, or even billions, in lost business because The People are voting with their wallet, I know where I’d position my company, and it’s not at the dinner table with Mitch McConnell and his wife.
– **** Scott 2021-04-08

Offline noisyturtle

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #9 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 15:40:21 »
I think calling them 'rights' is the wrong terminology here. Having a 'right' in the eyes of the law entails you have self-awareness of the freedom you posses, which animals do not understand the concept of since law is a human construct.

So by the definition of what is a 'right' within the confines of law - No animals do not have personal rights.
Any right an animal has is transferred to their state by human influence, animals do not inherently have rights.

Offline xondat

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #10 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 15:49:03 »
Anything that can think for itself, and also feel pain, should be equal with humans.

Unfortunately that isn't the case, and societies pick which beings they treat well, and which are just objects.

In the future I'm sure more people will become aware of what they're actually doing when not treating animals equally - it was the same when humans didn't (and still don't) treat races equally.

Racism will fade away first, and then speciesism afterwards as it's a much bigger issue.

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #11 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 16:23:28 »

No animals do not have personal rights.


In the first link that I listed, a couple of years ago the parliament of India actually granted rights to cetaceans as "non-human persons"

That is a hell of a lot better, in my mind, than the US Supreme Court, which granted "personhood" to corporations.

What this shows is that the Republican Party knows, deep down somewhere, that even before Trump they had less than a policy agenda. All they’ve had for the past decade or so is strategy and tactics to suppress the vote, either through extreme gerrymandering or State-level laws. More often than not, as we’re seeing, through both. Without a stated party platform they are left with nothing but the insanity of The Power Grab and The Big Lie. The Party as a whole has, for some twisted logical reason, decided that America no longer needs Democracy. That in the bent and tortured reality Republicans have created for themselves America was never a Democracy, the Founders never intended for the country’s politics or social order to change, that the country’s democratic features would always only extend to wealthy White Christian property owners. They’ve also, collectively, decided that threatening major, multi-billion dollar corporations that employ tens, if not hundreds, of thousands of people worldwide will somehow, for some reason, cower in the corner when State politicians decide to take a few million in subsidies off the table. When faced with hundreds of millions, or even billions, in lost business because The People are voting with their wallet, I know where I’d position my company, and it’s not at the dinner table with Mitch McConnell and his wife.
– **** Scott 2021-04-08

Offline noisyturtle

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #12 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 16:28:03 »
Anything that can think for itself, and also feel pain, should be equal with humans.

See, this is where I disagree. I think it comes down to the creature's potential for intelligence.
For example, fish can think and feel pain but I would never place the value of their life and potential over that of a human being. Or even a chimpanzee for that matter.

One the other hand, let us ponder the whole Harambe situation from last year. A gorilla's life vs a child's.
See, there are loads of human children in the world, but just a handful of mountain gorillas.

So I suppose in the end we must weigh both intellectual value as well as the significance of the being in question.

Offline fanpeople

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #13 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 17:34:48 »
dis thread has the potential to ****storm out of control.

so far, civilised.......  lets watch.

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #14 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 18:00:17 »
dis thread has the potential to ****storm out of control.

so far, civilised.......  lets watch.

I doubt it,  unless the vegans show up.. !!

hahahahaha..  I'd think computer programmers are baconized..  but I could be wrong.

Offline xondat

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #15 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 18:55:23 »
Anything that can think for itself, and also feel pain, should be equal with humans.

See, this is where I disagree. I think it comes down to the creature's potential for intelligence.
For example, fish can think and feel pain but I would never place the value of their life and potential over that of a human being. Or even a chimpanzee for that matter.

One the other hand, let us ponder the whole Harambe situation from last year. A gorilla's life vs a child's.
See, there are loads of human children in the world, but just a handful of mountain gorillas.

So I suppose in the end we must weigh both intellectual value as well as the significance of the being in question.

Well I would never put any being over others. I've never seen that argument before, mostly because others aren't that thoughtful about it and usually go "well they're not humans so get over it".

But you have to question the difference between humans, pigs, and dogs (for example). To me, they're difference physically, but still experience all the emotions possible. Humans (in a Western society) just chose to abuse one beings existence.

Killing an animal because they did, or didn't, harm a human is completely wrong no matter the outcome. When a human kills another human, they generally get imprisoned for life (in the past probably killed). You can see how that's progressed. But if, for example, a chimp killed a human, they'd be killed without another thought. They wouldn't be imprisoned - but imprisonment is a whole different discussion.

Offline fohat.digs

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #16 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 19:27:07 »
Which of these creatures was/is more worthy?
What this shows is that the Republican Party knows, deep down somewhere, that even before Trump they had less than a policy agenda. All they’ve had for the past decade or so is strategy and tactics to suppress the vote, either through extreme gerrymandering or State-level laws. More often than not, as we’re seeing, through both. Without a stated party platform they are left with nothing but the insanity of The Power Grab and The Big Lie. The Party as a whole has, for some twisted logical reason, decided that America no longer needs Democracy. That in the bent and tortured reality Republicans have created for themselves America was never a Democracy, the Founders never intended for the country’s politics or social order to change, that the country’s democratic features would always only extend to wealthy White Christian property owners. They’ve also, collectively, decided that threatening major, multi-billion dollar corporations that employ tens, if not hundreds, of thousands of people worldwide will somehow, for some reason, cower in the corner when State politicians decide to take a few million in subsidies off the table. When faced with hundreds of millions, or even billions, in lost business because The People are voting with their wallet, I know where I’d position my company, and it’s not at the dinner table with Mitch McConnell and his wife.
– **** Scott 2021-04-08

Offline fanpeople

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #17 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 19:30:51 »
Anything that can think for itself, and also feel pain, should be equal with humans.

See, this is where I disagree. I think it comes down to the creature's potential for intelligence.
For example, fish can think and feel pain but I would never place the value of their life and potential over that of a human being. Or even a chimpanzee for that matter.

One the other hand, let us ponder the whole Harambe situation from last year. A gorilla's life vs a child's.
See, there are loads of human children in the world, but just a handful of mountain gorillas.

So I suppose in the end we must weigh both intellectual value as well as the significance of the being in question.

Well I would never put any being over others. I've never seen that argument before, mostly because others aren't that thoughtful about it and usually go "well they're not humans so get over it".

But you have to question the difference between humans, pigs, and dogs (for example). To me, they're difference physically, but still experience all the emotions possible. Humans (in a Western society) just chose to abuse one beings existence.

Killing an animal because they did, or didn't, harm a human is completely wrong no matter the outcome. When a human kills another human, they generally get imprisoned for life (in the past probably killed). You can see how that's progressed. But if, for example, a chimp killed a human, they'd be killed without another thought. They wouldn't be imprisoned - but imprisonment is a whole different discussion.

People don't generally go to prison for life for killing another person, murder maybe but not killling. Even murderes can get out sometimes. But i can see your point is not really related to the length but the alternative nature of prison v death.

Either way, down the rabbit hole. tp rekons this thread wont ****storm so LETS MAKE IT A ****STORM...... VEGANS ASSEMBLE


Offline fanpeople

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #18 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 19:32:14 »
Which of these creatures was/is more worthy?

... of my penis? the human.

Offline fanpeople

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #19 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 19:36:24 »
yeh probably

if i stop eating animals it's not gonna do anything, and meat is the best **** ever

#DogLivesMatter
#CowLivesDontMatter

some animals are just more equal than others

heaven forbid us eat a cute animal



Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #20 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 19:46:20 »

People don't generally go to prison for life for killing another person, murder maybe but not killling. Even murderes can get out sometimes. But i can see your point is not really related to the length but the alternative nature of prison v death.

Either way, down the rabbit hole. tp rekons this thread wont ****storm so LETS MAKE IT A ****STORM...... VEGANS ASSEMBLE




/For the record..   dis ' is all fanpeople's fault.. hahahahahahahaaha

Offline fanpeople

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #21 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 19:56:49 »

People don't generally go to prison for life for killing another person, murder maybe but not killling. Even murderes can get out sometimes. But i can see your point is not really related to the length but the alternative nature of prison v death.

Either way, down the rabbit hole. tp rekons this thread wont ****storm so LETS MAKE IT A ****STORM...... VEGANS ASSEMBLE




/For the record..   dis ' is all fanpeople's fault.. hahahahahahahaaha

FUR IS MURDER

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #22 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 20:07:26 »

People don't generally go to prison for life for killing another person, murder maybe but not killling. Even murderes can get out sometimes. But i can see your point is not really related to the length but the alternative nature of prison v death.

Either way, down the rabbit hole. tp rekons this thread wont ****storm so LETS MAKE IT A ****STORM...... VEGANS ASSEMBLE




/For the record..   dis ' is all fanpeople's fault.. hahahahahahahaaha

FUR IS MURDER

Yea. but then you could say the same about anything that costs anything..

An entire person's lifetime productivity in the west is quantified by approximately $1,000,000


So, if you spent $1,000,000 to build a house..   You've fundamentally Killed 1 person.




Offline fanpeople

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #23 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 20:13:08 »

People don't generally go to prison for life for killing another person, murder maybe but not killling. Even murderes can get out sometimes. But i can see your point is not really related to the length but the alternative nature of prison v death.

Either way, down the rabbit hole. tp rekons this thread wont ****storm so LETS MAKE IT A ****STORM...... VEGANS ASSEMBLE




/For the record..   dis ' is all fanpeople's fault.. hahahahahahahaaha

FUR IS MURDER

Yea. but then you could say the same about anything that costs anything..

An entire person's lifetime productivity in the west is quantified by approximately $1,000,000


So, if you spent $1,000,000 to build a house..   You've fundamentally Killed 1 person.

CURRENCY IS MURDER

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #24 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 20:21:12 »

CURRENCY IS MURDER


Cows have cages.

Humans have cubicles..



The farmers own the cow..


Bosses owns the programmers.



Humans are by far the most valuable livestock..


Offline fanpeople

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #25 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 20:22:53 »

CURRENCY IS MURDER


Cows have cages.

Humans have cubicles..



The farmers own the cow..


Bosses owns the programmers.

Programming is murder, bosses are murder....murder is murder.... tp is murderer

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #26 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 20:23:25 »

CURRENCY IS MURDER


Cows have cages.

Humans have cubicles..



The farmers own the cow..


Bosses owns the programmers.

Programming is murder, bosses are murder....murder is murder.... tp is murderer



Achmmm..  Tp4 haz listen to bosses..  Tp4 = Victim

hahahahahahahaha

Offline fanpeople

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #27 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 20:29:18 »

CURRENCY IS MURDER


Cows have cages.

Humans have cubicles..



The farmers own the cow..


Bosses owns the programmers.

Programming is murder, bosses are murder....murder is murder.... tp is murderer



Achmmm..  Tp4 haz listen to bosses..  Tp4 = Victim

hahahahahahahaha

thats what a murderer would say. murderer confirmed

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #28 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 20:32:56 »

thats what a murderer would say. murderer confirmed


/I'm on my way...  mount isa was it?

/manic grin

Offline fanpeople

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #29 on: Sun, 14 May 2017, 20:34:31 »

thats what a murderer would say. murderer confirmed


/I'm on my way...  mount isa was it?

/manic grin

HAHAH NOT THERE AT THE MOMENT.... CATCH ME IF YOU CAN... GAME ON

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #30 on: Mon, 15 May 2017, 10:13:00 »
What the heck would the industry do with the animals and all that equipment, if everyone actually goes vegan..



Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #31 on: Mon, 15 May 2017, 11:54:05 »
It has been proven plants feel pain right?

And also proven they can communicate with each other?

So what is left to eat since we already can't eat animals?

Offline digi

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #32 on: Mon, 15 May 2017, 11:54:32 »
It has been proven plants feel pain right?

And also proven they can communicate with each other?

So what is left to eat since we already can't eat animals?

GOOD POINT!

VEGANS ARE THE WORST!!

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #33 on: Mon, 15 May 2017, 12:00:25 »
It has been proven plants feel pain right?

And also proven they can communicate with each other?

So what is left to eat since we already can't eat animals?


Wellllll.... plants don't have a Nervous system, 

You can Argue, they feel pain in the sense that ,  they will repair damage to their external structure such as small cracks in leaves/branches.

And so,  if pain is in service to life, and its propagation,   then Plants ---sort of--- feel  ---a sort of---- pain.

But it's not pain as animals perceive it.

--Pain to a cow/salmon/pig  is virtually identical to humans.



As for EATING them..  Rights might not play a role here,  because as long as there's a tangible benefit, SOME human will continue to exploit the animal.


But, ---overall-- health side,  the Newest evidence is compelling on the side of animal foods causing the majority of western diseases.. (Not definitive)

Offline noisyturtle

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #34 on: Sun, 28 March 2021, 16:13:35 »
Also cuteness has a huge factor in an animal's potential for survival. The panda is stupid and horribly designed, but people love it because it is cute.
The rhino on the other hand will have had all 3 of its subspecies wiped out completely in out lifetime. A much more unique and precious creature that was solely cut down due to human influence. Literally breaking into actual zoos and killing them. Our kids will never see a living rhino, Black White or Indian. All gone.
« Last Edit: Sun, 28 March 2021, 16:15:31 by noisyturtle »

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: Animal Rights
« Reply #35 on: Sun, 28 March 2021, 16:21:04 »
Also cuteness has a huge factor in an animal's potential for survival. The panda is stupid and horribly designed, but people love it because it is cute.
The rhino on the other hand will have had all 3 of its subspecies wiped out completely in out lifetime. A much more unique and precious creature that was solely cut down due to human influence. Literally breaking into actual zoos and killing them. Our kids will never see a living rhino, Black White or Indian. All gone.

If we keep eating cows, chicken, pigs, fish,  there will be no our kids,  global warming will kill us all. The meat industry is responsible for 87% of net green house emissions.