Author Topic: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA  (Read 25745 times)

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Offline HybridCore

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #100 on: Mon, 18 February 2013, 16:16:01 »
Eh, I don't really like the layout of these %## boards. They're nice and compact though. May get one to bring around with me since I cringe when using rubber domes...
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Offline kboardvintage

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #101 on: Tue, 19 February 2013, 02:29:24 »
what a weird spacebar

Offline guilleguillaume

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #102 on: Fri, 22 February 2013, 08:36:38 »
The Keyboard Company: Filco MiniLa First Impressions


Offline nullstring

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #103 on: Fri, 22 February 2013, 08:49:28 »
imgur gallery linked to from the article.
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #104 on: Fri, 22 February 2013, 08:58:53 »
That review was worthless.. I know what it looks like already, take it apart fgs... :D

Offline terry8471

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #105 on: Sat, 02 March 2013, 04:32:18 »
For one thing, finally someone out there has designed a layout that the Fn is easy to reach. All the 60% keyboards so far put the Fn in some strange places that is damn difficult to reach or force my fingers into some weird gesture. I think FILCO has done a fantastic job in designing the Minila. The US layout is perfect in my opinion, but I do agree that the ISO and JP layouts are rather messed up... Only if Minila was fully reprogrammable, I would definitely buy this, over the Pure Pro, Poker II, etc.

Offline Grim Fandango

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #106 on: Sat, 02 March 2013, 05:00:47 »
Looks good, but I am afraid the layout would really take some getting used to. Generally , that is something I am unwilling to do. I tend to get peripherals that work for me without having to do anything for it.
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Offline mechanisch

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #107 on: Sat, 02 March 2013, 11:48:00 »
Sooo close... but that Right SHIFT (which I use), don't know if I could ever adjust to that.  And what's the purpose of the Left CTRL being so large?  I don't understand some of the design choices I guess. 

Offline orlando

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #108 on: Sat, 02 March 2013, 12:06:50 »
But that spacebar! Still can't get over it. I naturally hit between the Fn & spacebar, I know you can convert fn to spacebar but eitherway my thumb would be hitting a gap. Not sure about this layout for me, perhaps if there was a spacebar keycap that would connect fn-spacebar.

Offline chel-

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #109 on: Sat, 02 March 2013, 12:35:55 »
Not too impressed. I don't think I could get used to the shift keys or space bar. I'd choose a Poker over this any day.

Offline ComradeSniper

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #110 on: Sat, 02 March 2013, 12:40:26 »
The spacebar looks okay considering you can switch the FN keys to the spacebar, but I don't think I could get used to that 1x shift. Who thought a left shift that small was a good idea?
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Offline Sinzz

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #111 on: Sat, 02 March 2013, 12:46:55 »
The spacebar looks okay considering you can switch the FN keys to the spacebar, but I don't think I could get used to that 1x shift. Who thought a left shift that small was a good idea?

ISO keyboards usually have that size shift iirc
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Offline ValerieV

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #112 on: Sat, 02 March 2013, 13:06:34 »
Yeah i am not going to buy it. I would if the space bar was better but i think i will wait for the Poker to come out. Sucks because i really love Filco.

Offline pochiko

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #113 on: Sat, 02 March 2013, 15:55:24 »
No media key, again?  :(

Offline nullstring

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #114 on: Sat, 02 March 2013, 16:01:22 »
The spacebar looks okay considering you can switch the FN keys to the spacebar, but I don't think I could get used to that 1x shift. Who thought a left shift that small was a good idea?

You get an almost full sized shift in the ANSI version.

Offline shibbyllama889

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #115 on: Sun, 03 March 2013, 11:41:47 »
I use a Pure as a work keyboard at the office, and I can see Filco put a lot of thought into this layout. It seems really bizarre at first glance, but it's actually very logical and makes a lot of sense. Here are some of my favorite features.

Pros:

1) The dip switches are excellent. I use the "HHKB" layout, so I would switch backspace with pipe and switch capslock with L-Ctrl. It's always nice having dip switches for that functionality, and the fact it comes with replacement keycaps is great. Being able to switch the Fn keys to spacebar is a nice touch, but I don't seem myself using them. I can see how a small backspace can be annoying to people, but you all should really swap backspace and pipe!

2) The Fn key placement looks perfect. If anyone has used a Poker or a Pure, you know that you really have to curl your thumb to reach Fn or you have to move you hand. You definitely have to move your hand for the HHKB Fn button. But the MiniLa looks like it's placed in a way where you never have to move your hands off the home row.

3) The Fn layer looks better than anything I've seen, definitely an improvement over the Pure. Arrow keys under your left hand without moving them from the home layer! That's huge for quick edits where you don't want to move your hands to the dedicated arrow keys. But, if you are doing heavier text editing where you are using a combination of Shift, Ctrl, Arrow Keys, and Home/End, then the dedicated arrow keys will make that much easier than on any usual 60% keyboard.

Insert, Delete, Home, End, PgUp, and PgDn all look pretty easy to access without moving from the home layer as well.


Cons:

1) Odd key sizing.Makes for finding aftermarket keycaps difficult to impossible. R-Shift is definitely a worry, and the spacebar might take some getting used to. You'll probably also have to turn L-Fn into a spacebar in order to use it for gaming. But I see this keyboard as geared towards typing and working in an office environment. I don't think a small spacebar is actually a bad thing, there is a lot of wasted space there in standard layouts. It will just be something to get used to. L-Ctrl is also a bit awkward. It could be manufacturing ease that people have talked about, but it's either have it the way it is or make another key larger (App or Spacebar I suppose.

This keyboard is definitely meant for someone who touch types properly. If you have "proper" technique then you should be hitting that small spacebar fine.

2) I really like using stock keycaps for work keyboards to keep them looking "normal" as well as preserving Fn layer legends. But I don't hear anything good about Filco's keycaps. If their UV coating is as ****ty on the MiniLa as other Filcos, then that's a worry.


In the end, I can see this as a robust 60% workhorse keyboard if you take a little time to get used to the changed layout. But in order to improve the standard keyboard layout, you have to deviate from the standard. This is especially true for 60% boards where real estate is limited. If I didn't want to try topre switches so badly and Filco's keycaps didn't suck so hard, I would seriously consider this keyboard. Might consider it regardless...

Offline sordna

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #116 on: Mon, 04 March 2013, 10:37:43 »
I just noticed the board has no setting for a Control key on the right side. There should be a dip switch to change the App key to a Control.
How do they expect people to hit Ctrl-A or Ctrl-C, single handedly ?
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Offline shibbyllama889

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #117 on: Mon, 04 March 2013, 19:34:09 »
I just noticed the board has no setting for a Control key on the right side. There should be a dip switch to change the App key to a Control.
How do they expect people to hit Ctrl-A or Ctrl-C, single handedly ?

You hit R-Ctrl + A and C? I can't remember the last time I used R-Ctrl. I think most people do in fact hit Ctrl+A and Ctrl+C with one hand.

Offline alaricljs

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #118 on: Mon, 04 March 2013, 20:29:45 »
sordna is one of them there proper typists where chording is considered poor behavior.  He is pointing out that you are required to do it single handedly
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Offline sordna

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #119 on: Mon, 04 March 2013, 21:09:57 »
Yup, if you touch type, you naturally use your left pinky for A. So how are you supposed to hit the left control ? By the way, apart from being easier on the hand, using 2 hands is way faster too than doing single-hand combos which take completely off the typing position.
I'm in bash all day and use Ctrl-A to go to the beginning of the line and Ctrl-E to go to the end, and the right control is by far the fastest and most comfortable way. Try it sometime :-)
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Offline hasu

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #120 on: Mon, 04 March 2013, 22:49:47 »
That convex Fn key! I've never seen that 1.5u key. I want them.
I always press Alt with my thumbs, they might be good for my thumbs :D
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Offline shibbyllama889

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #121 on: Tue, 05 March 2013, 06:02:04 »
Yup, if you touch type, you naturally use your left pinky for A. So how are you supposed to hit the left control ? By the way, apart from being easier on the hand, using 2 hands is way faster too than doing single-hand combos which take completely off the typing position.
I'm in bash all day and use Ctrl-A to go to the beginning of the line and Ctrl-E to go to the end, and the right control is by far the fastest and most comfortable way. Try it sometime :-)

Just miming the actions of using R-Ctrl for anything takes me from the typing position much more and feels like a big stretch. It's probably not "technically" proper technique, but using one hand for common shortcuts has always felt easier. I swap L-Ctrl and Caps Lock and that's proved to be the easiest for shortcuts like that. If you're using Ctrl a lot, you should try setting Caps Lock to L-Ctrl.

Offline laffindude

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #122 on: Tue, 05 March 2013, 06:56:45 »
Yup, if you touch type, you naturally use your left pinky for A. So how are you supposed to hit the left control ? By the way, apart from being easier on the hand, using 2 hands is way faster too than doing single-hand combos which take completely off the typing position.
I'm in bash all day and use Ctrl-A to go to the beginning of the line and Ctrl-E to go to the end, and the right control is by far the fastest and most comfortable way. Try it sometime :-)
I prefer to hit control with my palm/base of the pinky. Less hand movement for me that way.

Online metalliqaz

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #123 on: Tue, 05 March 2013, 07:32:09 »
That's crazy talk right there!

Offline nullstring

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #124 on: Tue, 05 March 2013, 08:21:05 »
How often do you really hit control though.. If you're hitting Ctrl+C, Ctrl+V, you're probably already disrupted by the mouse or hitting shift+home keys or something, all which are going to require you to move your hands anyway.

besides, right control is so far away, I think that doing it single handedly for ctrl+C, ctrl+V has to be about the same.

Offline jimmystar

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #125 on: Tue, 05 March 2013, 08:38:42 »
that space is large enought

i have tried that

Offline laffindude

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #126 on: Tue, 05 March 2013, 16:21:59 »
How often do you really hit control though.. If you're hitting Ctrl+C, Ctrl+V, you're probably already disrupted by the mouse or hitting shift+home keys or something, all which are going to require you to move your hands anyway.
That's why I made my function layer to have all those keys on or 1 key away from homerow.

Offline daerid

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #127 on: Tue, 05 March 2013, 16:47:03 »
Yup, if you touch type, you naturally use your left pinky for A. So how are you supposed to hit the left control ? By the way, apart from being easier on the hand, using 2 hands is way faster too than doing single-hand combos which take completely off the typing position.
I'm in bash all day and use Ctrl-A to go to the beginning of the line and Ctrl-E to go to the end, and the right control is by far the fastest and most comfortable way. Try it sometime :-)

I just did, and I think my right hand wanted to strangle me for abusing it so. Hitting right control from the home row is the most uncomfortable stretch on a keyboard I've done in a while.

It's far easier just to remap CapsLock to LControl, and then use your left pinky to hit it. Much more ergonomic, way less strain on your hands.

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Offline Binge

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #128 on: Tue, 05 March 2013, 16:59:53 »
Yup, if you touch type, you naturally use your left pinky for A. So how are you supposed to hit the left control ? By the way, apart from being easier on the hand, using 2 hands is way faster too than doing single-hand combos which take completely off the typing position.
I'm in bash all day and use Ctrl-A to go to the beginning of the line and Ctrl-E to go to the end, and the right control is by far the fastest and most comfortable way. Try it sometime :-)

I just did, and I think my right hand wanted to strangle me for abusing it so. Hitting right control from the home row is the most uncomfortable stretch on a keyboard I've done in a while.

It's far easier just to remap CapsLock to LControl, and then use your left pinky to hit it. Much more ergonomic, way less strain on your hands.

Well yeah it is more ergonomic but seriously... how is that a strain??? play guitar and get your 9" pinky-pointer stretch going.
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Offline sordna

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #129 on: Tue, 05 March 2013, 18:33:43 »
Folks, you are not supposed to hit the right control by stretching your hand open, but by moving your entire arm. This way both your hands remain very relaxed at all times.
But contorting your left hand to hit Control and A single-handedly, not only moves one of you hands away from typing position anyway, but puts a lot of strain on it.
Ctrl-Q and Ctrl-W are even worse than Ctrl-A. Apart from straining your hand, it takes more time to bend your hand rather than move your other hand.

Anyway, our bodies are symmetric and there's a reason we have 2 shifts, 2 alts and 2 controls.
BTW, while my usage of the 2 shifts is pretty even, I use the right control far more frequently than the left. I guess I will have to map the App/Menu key to be a right Control, no big deal. On my Poker I sacrifice the same key anyway (for the tilde).
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Online metalliqaz

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #130 on: Tue, 05 March 2013, 19:59:50 »
I use the left control almost exclusively, like 99.99%.  I like to make Ctrl-[AZXCFS] with one hand.  I can "touch type" but there are a few motions that I usually don't perform correctly.  For example, there are several capital letters that I tend to make with one hand and I tend to make '?' with my right index and pointer finger.

Offline davkol

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #131 on: Tue, 05 March 2013, 22:58:14 »
Yup, if you touch type, you naturally use your left pinky for A. So how are you supposed to hit the left control ?
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Offline orlando

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #132 on: Wed, 06 March 2013, 19:17:04 »
Keyboardco.com has listed the Minila. April 19th appears to be the ship date, not sure on how accurate that projected date is.

Offline aggiejy

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #133 on: Wed, 06 March 2013, 23:54:58 »
I wasn't sure about this at first, but I'm pretty certain I'll be getting one after giving it some thought. 

I only press the spacebar with my right thumb, pretty much just right in the center of that short space.  And the main thing is that I've been thinking of doing a custom layout with a function key for my left thumb.  That makes the esdf arrows perfect for coding/etc. 

My only big complaints are that it'll be hard to get custom keys for those non-standard bottom row sizes, and I'd prefer a normal shift key on the right and lose the arrows.  With the big FN key, they're not as useful.  But, overall, I'll give it a try I think.

Edit: Oh... I didn't notice the small backspace key.  Screw that, I make a lot of mistakes.  That singlehandedly ruins it for me... I hit right in the middle of those two keys, and I'm too stubborn to change for one dinky keyboard. ;-)
« Last Edit: Thu, 07 March 2013, 00:04:44 by aggiejy »

Offline audioave10

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #134 on: Thu, 07 March 2013, 00:00:41 »
That's just too small for me but I can see the minimalists loving it.  :(
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Offline sordna

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #135 on: Thu, 07 March 2013, 00:16:57 »
Edit: Oh... I didn't notice the small backspace key.  Screw that, I make a lot of mistakes.  That singlehandedly ruins it for me... I hit right in the middle of those two keys, and I'm too stubborn to change for one dinky keyboard. ;-)

The dipswitches allow setting the key right above the enter to backspace, see the OP. It's a bigger key and closer to the typing position.
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Offline aggiejy

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #136 on: Thu, 07 March 2013, 00:23:38 »
Thanks, but yeah, I noticed that.  Probably a good alternative.  However, I got used to that with the HHKB and it threw off all my experiences on my other boards. :)  Can't be having that!

Offline Solanin

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #137 on: Tue, 02 April 2013, 22:52:50 »
Doesn't matter. .  bought one as soon as it hit the shop. . . Love it!

Offline Sinzz

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #138 on: Wed, 03 April 2013, 02:51:04 »
Is it up for sale in any US stores yet?
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Offline berserkfan

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #139 on: Wed, 03 April 2013, 06:05:22 »

that is one ridiculously tiny space bar!

Space bars, by definition, are for thumbs and intended for BOTH thumbs. If your hands are ok with that (maybe longer thumbs) I can understand. But for most people?


I warn you that the Left Shift has a different size compared to a standard LShift so replacement keycaps would be a headache.

The JIS layout one is a copy of the HHKB PRO JP with different key sizes in the last row:

Show Image


The spacebar is the best one they could fit in the keyboard.  It is just perfect for me.
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Offline Solanin

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #140 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 01:30:35 »
Is it up for sale in any US stores yet?
Nah . .  it's in Vietnam.

Offline Capitalistix

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #141 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 11:25:44 »
waaat the faaak. I would totally buy this thing if greenies were an option but everyones so damn racist against mx greens...

Wonder how difficult changing the switches on this would be...

Offline ComradeSniper

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #142 on: Thu, 04 April 2013, 21:51:56 »
waaat the faaak. I would totally buy this thing if greenies were an option but everyones so damn racist against mx greens...

Wonder how difficult changing the switches on this would be...

About the same as any other Filco board I'd imagine.
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Offline Macsmasher

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #143 on: Fri, 05 April 2013, 21:18:17 »
Not gonna lie, actually pretty excited about this. I always hit space right below the B and N keys, always with my right thumb. This layout will allow me to reclaim some of that wasted space. It's got dedicated arrow keys, which means I can use it in Visual Studio without it being all awkward like the HHKB.

And, of course.. it's a Filco.

+1 here. I'm kind of liking the layout for a compact. You can swap BS with Backslash. A Fn 'and' Win key on the left. Dedicated arrow keys.

I like the idea of a shorter Spacebar, even on a full-size board anyway. Since I Alt with my thumbs, it would eliminate reaching so far under my palms. However, this one might be a tad too short. My left thumb typically hits under the right corner of 'V', which is in the 'taint' area left of Spacebar. But that might be such a big deal to adjust for.

All these new compact boards makes me wonder if there are plans to update the HHKB layout. The current layout has been out for years. And with everybody else coming out with improvements to the compact layout, HHKB has to be considering it.

Things I think could be improved on my HHKB...

*  Fn and Win key left of Spacebar.
*  Reconsider the arrow key placement.
*  Possibly reduce size of Spacebar.
*  Utilize the dead space in the lower corners with some much needed keys. I for one would like to have a R Control key.

Offline aggiejy

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #144 on: Wed, 17 April 2013, 11:19:15 »
Got one today. I don't like the backspace options mainly.  I wish I could make the left Fn key a backspace key, but doesn't seem possible.  Also, I noticed that I do in fact sometimes use my left thumb for space... not often, but a couple times so far in testing. Of course, that's not a problem because you can flip a switch to make left fn a space bar too.  Just no good backspace option unless you like HHKB style or are good at hitting that little top-right key.

Great feel though, nice size.

Offline ValerieV

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #145 on: Thu, 18 April 2013, 05:19:42 »
I have one as well and are you surprised that the space key hasn't been an issue for you? I thought it was going to be too small but i have had no problems what so ever. Thoughts about the small space bar...

Offline aggiejy

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NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #146 on: Thu, 18 April 2013, 09:02:44 »
I have one as well and are you surprised that the space key hasn't been an issue for you? I thought it was going to be too small but i have had no problems what so ever. Thoughts about the small space bar...

Agreed. The only time I found myself trying to hit a space on the left function key is if my right hand reached for the mouse or something, but very easy to train for. Literally the only gripe I have is backspace. (And perhaps the inability to find replacement caps for the space/fn keys)

Offline best.eu

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #147 on: Thu, 18 April 2013, 15:38:18 »
Looks awesome, anyone know if this will come with Swedish layout or blank? This would make a great backpack keyboard with blue switches when you have to type something while not on your own PC.

Offline Hour

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #148 on: Thu, 18 April 2013, 19:36:17 »
Dat space bar..

Offline didjamatic

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Re: NEW FILCO keyboard - Majestouch MINILA
« Reply #149 on: Sun, 26 May 2013, 08:52:58 »
I agree the bezel would have been better as a plain rectangle with rounded edges.  But this layout looks very promising.

2 questions:

1 - Can you remap the left Fn key using windows registry hacks?  (ala Sharpkeys)

2 - Is a white model available, hopefully w/PBT caps or is someone offering white PBT replacement caps?  The slightly off sizes including space bar and possible unknown placement of things under caps could make full cap swaps difficult.

IBM F :: IBM M :: Northgate :: Cherry G80 :: Realforce