Author Topic: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?  (Read 8308 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline abdulmuhsee

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 196
Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« on: Tue, 05 September 2017, 13:53:58 »
The day has finally come where there is a game I want to play that I cannot run on my 32-bit OS.  I need to get a 64-bit, but I'm not sure if I should get Windows 7 or 10.  Here's my system:

AMD FX 6300 6-Core
Radeon HD 6900 2 GB
4 GB RAM (but will soon have 16 GB)

I'm concerned about what I've heard about keyloggers and data collection on Windows 10, but it also has DirectX 12 apparently?  Will I somehow benefit if I have Windows 10, or should I stick with getting Windows 7?

Offline Quardah

  • Posts: 683
  • Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #1 on: Tue, 05 September 2017, 14:17:41 »
Win7 still runs fine but Win10 is deffo faster as of right now. It's much more lightweight.

But i refuse to use it for it's a ****ing malware in itself so stick to Win7 if you are "woke" enough to understand the implications of these privacy breaches.

Otherwise just run Linux. If you're good enough run Arch, if you want to run Arch but the installation process is too tedious for you get ArchLabs (Arch with an installer, basically) and if you want easier hardware support run Manjaro.

But yea Stallman was right on the whole deal so try to avoid Windows.
- Poker II Brown MX

Offline ddot

  • Master of Suspense
  • Posts: 146
  • Location: Canada
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #2 on: Tue, 05 September 2017, 14:22:50 »
Despite Microsoft officially ending their Win7 --> Win10 upgrade program, they still offer it for those who need "assistive technologies"  The loophole is it still works for anyone.  If you get a copy of Windows 7, you still have the opportunity (at least for the moment) to upgrade.

http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/accessibility/windows10upgrade

What's your plan to "acquire" your copy of Windows?  Which flavor?

Personally I'm still running Win 7 on my main box and have Win10 on an old laptop that I just use for experimenting.  I think I've finally decided I can beat Win10 Pro into submission with a combination of GPEdit and Classic Menu, but there's still a lot I like about Win7.

I got a few other tricks for really taming Win10 if you really want to go down the rabbit hole.  But if so, shoot me a PM.

Offline Findecanor

  • Posts: 4587
  • Location: Koriko
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #3 on: Tue, 05 September 2017, 15:06:22 »
Windows 7 also got data collection in later updates, so if you have it configured to always download and install updates then there are really no differences.
You could perhaps be picky about which updates you install ... but that would be difficult.
Man must shape his tools lest they shape him
-- Arthur Miller

Offline Leslieann

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 3033
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #4 on: Tue, 05 September 2017, 17:10:15 »
While I would say Win7, then uninstall the tracking system (it's about a dozen updates), the fact is, if you plan on running Windows, at some point in the very near future you will NEED win10.

Blah, blah, blah, people still use Winxp, yes, and I had a customer still using Win95 5 years ago. Do you know how much anti-malware exists for XP or even Vista these days? I'll give you a hint, very little. Try buying a new wireless card with XP or Vista support. People will tell you how the OS will still run, and it will, but at some point cleaning malware and buying replacement parts becomes an issue. My guess is you have about a year before Win7 support really starts to collapse.


Personally, I would install 8.1 (I hate it, but it's really the best option for compatibility and longevity) or just bite the bullet and install Win10.
Filco MJ2 L.E. w/hand milled Vortex case, custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, sound dampened,  Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs | HMMK TKL | Magicforce 68 | YMDK75 | KBT Race S L.E. | Das Pro (Costar model) | GH60 | IBM Model M (x2)

Offline digi

  • elite af tbh
  • * Exquisite Elder
  • Posts: 2789
  • keyboard game on fleek
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #5 on: Tue, 05 September 2017, 18:01:39 »
LONG LIVE WINDOWS 7!!!

Offline tp4tissue

  • * Destiny Supporter
  • Posts: 12851
  • Location: Official Geekhack Public Defender..
  • OmniExpert of: Rice, Top-Ramen, Ergodox, n Females
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #6 on: Tue, 05 September 2017, 18:22:13 »
While I would say Win7, then uninstall the tracking system (it's about a dozen updates), the fact is, if you plan on running Windows, at some point in the very near future you will NEED win10.

Blah, blah, blah, people still use Winxp, yes, and I had a customer still using Win95 5 years ago. Do you know how much anti-malware exists for XP or even Vista these days? I'll give you a hint, very little. Try buying a new wireless card with XP or Vista support. People will tell you how the OS will still run, and it will, but at some point cleaning malware and buying replacement parts becomes an issue. My guess is you have about a year before Win7 support really starts to collapse.


Personally, I would install 8.1 (I hate it, but it's really the best option for compatibility and longevity) or just bite the bullet and install Win10.

Tp4 can't fordz windows 10..

Too many computers,,  and they don't have that free upgrade for arrrgh matey windows 7 any more.

Offline kmba

  • Formerly tameone
  • * Esteemed Elder
  • Posts: 1173
  • Location: Indiana, USA
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #7 on: Tue, 05 September 2017, 22:36:20 »
Get 10 and uninstall as much bloat and backdoor stuff as you can. It's fairly simple
keyboards.

Offline tp4tissue

  • * Destiny Supporter
  • Posts: 12851
  • Location: Official Geekhack Public Defender..
  • OmniExpert of: Rice, Top-Ramen, Ergodox, n Females
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #8 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 00:01:09 »
Get 10 and uninstall as much bloat and backdoor stuff as you can. It's fairly simple

until they push an update to get the back doors rebuilt.. hahaha

Offline Leslieann

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 3033
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #9 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 05:01:05 »
until they push an update to get the back doors rebuilt.. hahaha
Correct, and if you are beta channel, like those who beta tested are stuck on... They are even worse about rolling back your changes.



Tp4 can't fordz windows 10..

Too many computers,,  and they don't have that free upgrade for arrrgh matey windows 7 any more.
As of early June people were still getting legal upgrades through loopholes.
Filco MJ2 L.E. w/hand milled Vortex case, custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, sound dampened,  Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs | HMMK TKL | Magicforce 68 | YMDK75 | KBT Race S L.E. | Das Pro (Costar model) | GH60 | IBM Model M (x2)

Offline DaBubbs

  • Posts: 125
  • Location: NC, US
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #10 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 10:06:18 »
Get 10 and uninstall as much bloat and backdoor stuff as you can. It's fairly simple
x2
When you are dead, you don't know that you are dead. It is difficult only for the others.
It is the same when you are stupid.

Offline tp4tissue

  • * Destiny Supporter
  • Posts: 12851
  • Location: Official Geekhack Public Defender..
  • OmniExpert of: Rice, Top-Ramen, Ergodox, n Females
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #11 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 10:52:54 »
until they push an update to get the back doors rebuilt.. hahaha
Correct, and if you are beta channel, like those who beta tested are stuck on... They are even worse about rolling back your changes.



Tp4 can't fordz windows 10..

Too many computers,,  and they don't have that free upgrade for arrrgh matey windows 7 any more.
As of early June people were still getting legal upgrades through loopholes.

What is this the dark ages...  so slow.. i got'r'gigabit

Also.. Tp4 blind as a bat with glasses.. and Tp4 uses the magnifier on windoz7  so tp4 totally justified for Freeeeeee upgrade.. !!!

///unconscionable ??

177614-0

Offline tp4tissue

  • * Destiny Supporter
  • Posts: 12851
  • Location: Official Geekhack Public Defender..
  • OmniExpert of: Rice, Top-Ramen, Ergodox, n Females
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #12 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 11:06:54 »
wow, so windoz10 memorizes your pc hardware signature during activation process,  and therefore can always be activated even without key entry.


That is some next level privacy invasion hahahahahaha.


Not sure how i feel about this.. hahahahahaha..


On the one hand ,  they already know, right ?


On the other hand..  if and when  Microsoft = Government,    Do all the Arrgh matey users get retro-punishable jail time.. hahahahahahahaha

Offline tp4tissue

  • * Destiny Supporter
  • Posts: 12851
  • Location: Official Geekhack Public Defender..
  • OmniExpert of: Rice, Top-Ramen, Ergodox, n Females
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #13 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 11:34:51 »
Hrrrrmm.. this is taking a really long time.. 

drive access light is on, so I assssssume it's doing ---stufff---..


But this is a 4770k 4.8jighz with 512gb ssd..   not sure what's takn' so long.

Offline abdulmuhsee

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 196
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #14 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 12:25:39 »
Win7 still runs fine but Win10 is deffo faster as of right now. It's much more lightweight.

But i refuse to use it for it's a ****ing malware in itself so stick to Win7 if you are "woke" enough to understand the implications of these privacy breaches.

Otherwise just run Linux. If you're good enough run Arch, if you want to run Arch but the installation process is too tedious for you get ArchLabs (Arch with an installer, basically) and if you want easier hardware support run Manjaro.

But yea Stallman was right on the whole deal so try to avoid Windows.


The entire reason I need to run a 64 bit OS is for games, and I don't think I can play the games I want or even get Linux to recognize my hardware.  If there is a way to get Linux to recognize my stuff and play games that only have a windows download, please let me know!

Despite Microsoft officially ending their Win7 --> Win10 upgrade program, they still offer it for those who need "assistive technologies"  The loophole is it still works for anyone.  If you get a copy of Windows 7, you still have the opportunity (at least for the moment) to upgrade.

http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/accessibility/windows10upgrade

What's your plan to "acquire" your copy of Windows?  Which flavor?

Personally I'm still running Win 7 on my main box and have Win10 on an old laptop that I just use for experimenting.  I think I've finally decided I can beat Win10 Pro into submission with a combination of GPEdit and Classic Menu, but there's still a lot I like about Win7.

I got a few other tricks for really taming Win10 if you really want to go down the rabbit hole.  But if so, shoot me a PM.

I have a copy of windows 7 from a friend who built a new PC and installed 10, so I have that ready to go.  My GPU only supports dx11, so I guess I wouldn't benefit from dx12 on Windows 10, right?  Is there any good reason to go with 10 after that?

Offline Quardah

  • Posts: 683
  • Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #15 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 13:06:28 »
There's a mountain of hate in here against Microsoft but i see nobody speaking of Linux.

When will you finally make the move? It's nothing more than a straight path to freedom.
- Poker II Brown MX

Offline ddot

  • Master of Suspense
  • Posts: 146
  • Location: Canada
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #16 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 13:22:24 »
I have a copy of windows 7 from a friend who built a new PC and installed 10, so I have that ready to go.  My GPU only supports dx11, so I guess I wouldn't benefit from dx12 on Windows 10, right?  Is there any good reason to go with 10 after that?

Win10 potentially has a few advantages with lower overhead.  There's also the upcoming game mode.

https://www.windowscentral.com/windows-10-game-mode


There's a mountain of hate in here against Microsoft but i see nobody speaking of Linux.

When will you finally make the move? It's nothing more than a straight path to freedom.

Yes, Linux does have its advantages.  However one of them isn't as a gaming platform for AAA DRM infested titles.  (With a few Steam titles being the possible exception.)

Offline uzoc2005

  • Posts: 10
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #17 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 15:12:47 »
Windows 7 - 64 bit of course.

No need for Windows 10, unless:
- You need to experiment, or
- Want to be Microsofts' free software QA tester
- You want them to spy more easily on you, or
- You need to be familiar with it (for customers).
« Last Edit: Wed, 06 September 2017, 15:31:03 by uzoc2005 »

Offline Quardah

  • Posts: 683
  • Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #18 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 15:27:33 »
There's a mountain of hate in here against Microsoft but i see nobody speaking of Linux.

When will you finally make the move? It's nothing more than a straight path to freedom.

Yes, Linux does have its advantages.  However one of them isn't as a gaming platform for AAA DRM infested titles.  (With a few Steam titles being the possible exception.)

Well as time passes we have seen drastic improvements throughout the Linux and Gaming relationship.

1 - Every year the ratio of games that are released compatible with Linux increases.
2 - The number of titles in the steam library continues to rise at a regular pace : https://steamdb.info/linux/
3 - The 2474 number reported seems old, on this page you can find out that there is currently 3866 titles compatible with Linux on a total of 17556 titles compatible with Windows. (a little more than 22%!)
4 - Much better driver support than before (better nvidia drivers, good nouveau driver (free drivers for nvidia) and AMD's new open source strategy)
5 - AMD's embrace of open/free technologies (such as freesync and making the drivers free software) is changing the whole game.
6 - FREEDOM
7 - New SteamOS can predict better hardware and software support with Linux.

Think about it, there's nothing other than games on windows that makes it a must for you bro. If you can embrace the Linux gaming you can finally ditch windows and be a free man.
- Poker II Brown MX

Offline MajorKoos

  • Posts: 796
  • Location: Bay Area
  • 1 life please. Extra large.
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #19 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 15:49:03 »
Would you give me any heed if you asked which phone to buy and I suggest a 10 year old Nokia 6110?
Why are you even heeding someone pushing a 10 year old product as the solution to today's problems?

Offline ddot

  • Master of Suspense
  • Posts: 146
  • Location: Canada
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #20 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 16:19:55 »
Would you give me any heed if you asked which phone to buy and I suggest a 10 year old Nokia 6110?
Why are you even heeding someone pushing a 10 year old product as the solution to today's problems?

It's a little tougher to recommend an old phone when telecommunication companies phase out legacy communication standards and long term support for smartphone OSs is basically nonexistent.

Android support window: ~3 years (best case scenario)
iPhone: ~5 years
Windows 7: ~10 years
Windows 8(.1): ~9 years
Windows XP: ~13 years

Offline Quardah

  • Posts: 683
  • Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #21 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 16:23:55 »
Would you give me any heed if you asked which phone to buy and I suggest a 10 year old Nokia 6110?
Why are you even heeding someone pushing a 10 year old product as the solution to today's problems?

It's a little tougher to recommend an old phone when telecommunication companies phase out legacy communication standards and long term support for smartphone OSs is basically nonexistent.

Android support window: ~3 years (best case scenario)
iPhone: ~5 years
Windows 7: ~10 years
Windows 8(.1): ~9 years
Windows XP: ~13 years

Arch Linux: Timeless
- Poker II Brown MX

Offline MajorKoos

  • Posts: 796
  • Location: Bay Area
  • 1 life please. Extra large.
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #22 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 16:33:45 »
Linux is fun to play with, especially with containers, but its not optimal for gaming.
Great server OS though.

Offline tp4tissue

  • * Destiny Supporter
  • Posts: 12851
  • Location: Official Geekhack Public Defender..
  • OmniExpert of: Rice, Top-Ramen, Ergodox, n Females
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #23 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 17:16:37 »
Seems like they closed the Arrgh matey loophole on windoz7 to windoz10

Offline MajorKoos

  • Posts: 796
  • Location: Bay Area
  • 1 life please. Extra large.
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #24 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 17:46:23 »

Would you give me any heed if you asked which phone to buy and I suggest a 10 year old Nokia 6110?
Why are you even heeding someone pushing a 10 year old product as the solution to today's problems?

It's a little tougher to recommend an old phone when telecommunication companies phase out legacy communication standards and long term support for smartphone OSs is basically nonexistent.

Android support window: ~3 years (best case scenario)
iPhone: ~5 years
Windows 7: ~10 years
Windows 8(.1): ~9 years
Windows XP: ~13 years

Not really.
We're still speaking about a recommendation for a 10 year old architecture which has had to have things like support for SSD and touch patched in.  Things have changed a lot in the last decade.  Think about the CIA hacking tools which were leaked and caused the recent ransomeware outbreaks. 

More fundamentaly its about the difference between waterfall vs. agile with continuous delivery.  The discipline of software development itself has changed greatly since those legacy OS's were shipped. 

Offline tp4tissue

  • * Destiny Supporter
  • Posts: 12851
  • Location: Official Geekhack Public Defender..
  • OmniExpert of: Rice, Top-Ramen, Ergodox, n Females
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #25 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 18:25:00 »

Would you give me any heed if you asked which phone to buy and I suggest a 10 year old Nokia 6110?
Why are you even heeding someone pushing a 10 year old product as the solution to today's problems?

It's a little tougher to recommend an old phone when telecommunication companies phase out legacy communication standards and long term support for smartphone OSs is basically nonexistent.

Android support window: ~3 years (best case scenario)
iPhone: ~5 years
Windows 7: ~10 years
Windows 8(.1): ~9 years
Windows XP: ~13 years

Not really.
We're still speaking about a recommendation for a 10 year old architecture which has had to have things like support for SSD and touch patched in.  Things have changed a lot in the last decade.  Think about the CIA hacking tools which were leaked and caused the recent ransomeware outbreaks. 

More fundamentaly its about the difference between waterfall vs. agile with continuous delivery.  The discipline of software development itself has changed greatly since those legacy OS's were shipped. 

they already know everything,  you can assume that..


we're really just fighting on the (principle) at this point....



As for loss of privacy , then leading to full fledge tyranny by the oligarchs..


That's not such a problem for the United States, because we have the right to arms..



Guns for the people is the bottom line...    take it too far... pop pop.. !!

Offline abdulmuhsee

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 196
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #26 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 19:08:19 »
So, let's say the main game I want to play supports Linux.  How do I know which version of Linux to get and how do I know it will recognize my CPU, GPU, and wireless card?

Offline tp4tissue

  • * Destiny Supporter
  • Posts: 12851
  • Location: Official Geekhack Public Defender..
  • OmniExpert of: Rice, Top-Ramen, Ergodox, n Females
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #27 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 19:11:19 »
So, let's say the main game I want to play supports Linux.  How do I know which version of Linux to get and how do I know it will recognize my CPU, GPU, and wireless card?

get the most popular linux duh.!!

Offline Leslieann

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 3033
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #28 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 19:36:15 »
I have a copy of windows 7 from a friend who built a new PC and installed 10, so I have that ready to go.  My GPU only supports dx11, so I guess I wouldn't benefit from dx12 on Windows 10, right?  Is there any good reason to go with 10 after that?
As I mentioned, there is.
While DX12 may not be a concern now, newer tech will continue to only be on Win10, software and hardware. Hardware and software support for Win7 is not going to get better, it's going to decline. Try finding a an AC wifi card for Vista or a new HP printer that supports it, yes, they exist, but you darn well better research your options first and you may have to hack a driver to work, and don't expect a lot of support from the manufacturer.

Is Win7 fine for now, yes, but in 2 years, not so much.
Filco MJ2 L.E. w/hand milled Vortex case, custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, sound dampened,  Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs | HMMK TKL | Magicforce 68 | YMDK75 | KBT Race S L.E. | Das Pro (Costar model) | GH60 | IBM Model M (x2)

Offline Quardah

  • Posts: 683
  • Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #29 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 19:37:10 »
So, let's say the main game I want to play supports Linux.  How do I know which version of Linux to get and how do I know it will recognize my CPU, GPU, and wireless card?

Pretty much all versions will work on any CPU (if it's the matching architecture). I know Debian supports many architectures.

Any GPU is recognized at all time if you have the drivers installed.

For the wireless card, that depends of the driver; if it's closed source, you may not get it working out of the box on Debian for they have a very pro-free stance on drivers. It will work out of the box on Manjaro though.

If you try Arch Labs or Manjaro everything will work out of the box. Ubuntu might be the case as well but it's getting less and less attractive as the Arch backbone is much more interesting for a desktop user (much better package flexibility and always have the possibility to run latest software with its rolling release method of publishing software).

But really anything you choose will work or it'll require little tuning.
- Poker II Brown MX

Offline Leslieann

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 3033
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #30 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 19:42:26 »
So, let's say the main game I want to play supports Linux.  How do I know which version of Linux to get and how do I know it will recognize my CPU, GPU, and wireless card?

Hardware support on Linux is pretty thorough these days, but you can actually run and test Linux right from a USB stick without touching your hard drive and experiment and see what does and doesn't work.


As for what to get, start with Ubuntu or a derivative of it, I highly recommend starting with Mint with Cinnamon as it has a more familiar interface but still has Ubuntu compatibility and support. This is the easiest way to get started. Arch is great, but will probably leave you frustrated if you know nothing about Linux and there is no way to really test Arch, you either dive in headfirst from the high dive, or you don't use it at all really. There are ways to cheat (Manjaro or Antergos, my favorite), but those technically are not actually Arch Linux, they are pre-built distributions of Arch Linux.  Even those are a bit more hardcore than Ubuntu and derivatives as they still expect some Linux troubleshooting knowledge to get by and therefore not the most noob friendly.
Filco MJ2 L.E. w/hand milled Vortex case, custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, sound dampened,  Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs | HMMK TKL | Magicforce 68 | YMDK75 | KBT Race S L.E. | Das Pro (Costar model) | GH60 | IBM Model M (x2)

Offline HotRoderX

  • Posts: 697
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #31 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 19:46:34 »
This is harsh but the reality of it... when it comes to windows 10...

Do you use Google? Yes/No: if the answer is yes then congratulations your being tracked!
Do you use Gmail? Yes/No: if Yes Then congratulations they now know every single thing you ever sent said or done thought the account.
Do you Use the Internet: Yes/No: If yes! Congratulations everything about you is known to every government agency that cares to know... by the way if your not someone special... they don't care "winks"
Have you ever been to the dr filed out a public form... are registered with the government with a SSN or any other type of ID.. Yes/No: If Yes Congratulations your information is in a data base somewhere.

what I am trying to get at is! People think they have privacy they think they have shields etc... but the sad humble truth is.. privacy is nothing but illusion we give our selfs. There so much data floating around out there about us. The thing is thought no one cares... seriously why would anyone care about some random person off the side of the road? They don't but we like to think they do. Who cares if Microsoft is tracking your crap thought Windows? If they didn't they just pay some website! or google them self's to track you for them. Are they could pay your Debt/Credit/Bank to track you... are your Dr or million other places.

The only way to truly be secure and not tracked is to erase your self... drop off the grid stop using all forms of curacy going into public in general... ((cause someone might have a camera)) and just live off the land in the mountains staying hidden.  :p

Offline abdulmuhsee

  • Thread Starter
  • Posts: 196
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #32 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 20:43:55 »
Well, I may not live in a mountain hole, at least not yet, but I'm going to give manjaro Linux a try before windows.  If it works and plays my game, I'll be perfectly fine with it.

Offline Leslieann

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 3033
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #33 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 20:46:05 »
This is harsh but the reality of it... when it comes to windows 10...

Do you use Google? Yes/No: if the answer is yes then congratulations your being tracked!
Do you use Gmail? Yes/No: if Yes Then congratulations they now know every single thing you ever sent said or done thought the account.
Do you Use the Internet: Yes/No: If yes! Congratulations everything about you is known to every government agency that cares to know... by the way if your not someone special... they don't care "winks"
Have you ever been to the dr filed out a public form... are registered with the government with a SSN or any other type of ID.. Yes/No: If Yes Congratulations your information is in a data base somewhere.

While true, I don't think you understand the level of tracking in Win10.
Remember a couple years ago the complaints about spying on users by cell phone manufacturers installing software? Those companies could only dream of this level of spying. In fact, it's so in depth that China actually asked MS to remove some tracking systems.

So yes, they are all spying on you, but watching your neighbor while he swims or mows his lawn, is not the same as installing hidden cameras throughout the house so you can watch his every move, down to reading his credit card if he opens his wallet.


Here is the complete list, most is innocuous but hidden in it is some real gems such as keylogging. Also bear in mind, 99% of this page is the so-called BASIC tracking, which is anything but. What full tracking adds to the list is a teeny tiny bit at the end. Basically MS only put that option there make you think basic was actually basic.
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/configuration/basic-level-windows-diagnostic-events-and-fields
Filco MJ2 L.E. w/hand milled Vortex case, custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, sound dampened,  Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs | HMMK TKL | Magicforce 68 | YMDK75 | KBT Race S L.E. | Das Pro (Costar model) | GH60 | IBM Model M (x2)

Offline HotRoderX

  • Posts: 697
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #34 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 21:08:51 »
that what I am trying to say you really get the same amount of tracking thought Google alone! Then there is the case of who is tracking you?

I think people take it to paranoid levels. ok lets say Microsoft is collecting 3-4million users data ((that really small number but legit for my point))... they track everything about ya every single last thing... now! What makes person number 250... more valuable/important then person 239,999.. or person 850,000? My point is even if they agitate ungodly amounts of data... and have a computer run thought it all... they still don't really have a reason to compile data about a specific person.

its narcissistic at best for anyone to think... a company as big as Microsoft or anyone for that matter would... unless there doing something illegal! It be like someone handing you a hard drive with 4 million pictures on it and asking you to pick out 4 pictures from all of them with the same person in them. It be almost impossible task that take your entire life time. Even using a computer to sift thought and look for key things would take days. We are talking about collecting a infinite amount more data that need to be sifted thought. I know some people would say the government! Seriously why would the government care about ya? Honestly?

Privacy is important but common since needs to be applied to it special when it comes down to the amount of data being collected. The more data thats collected the more useless it becomes. Special when its a single point of collection. I worry more about Google, my Dr, My Credit Card, Bank, Etc tracking me then Microsoft. The simple reason for that is the data agitated in such a way to be easier to consume chunks if someone did want to track me which I don't know why they would. I live a pretty boring life that revolves around a lot of nothing.

This would be like installing camera's in every single house in America and then expecting someone to monitor then 24-7 it be impossible task... that just couldn't happen. Technology doesn't exist and humans aren't capable of processing that much input! assuming you had a room of several thousand people watching them 24-7 with out stop.

Offline MajorKoos

  • Posts: 796
  • Location: Bay Area
  • 1 life please. Extra large.
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #35 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 22:03:17 »
This is harsh but the reality of it... when it comes to windows 10...

Do you use Google? Yes/No: if the answer is yes then congratulations your being tracked!
Do you use Gmail? Yes/No: if Yes Then congratulations they now know every single thing you ever sent said or done thought the account.
Do you Use the Internet: Yes/No: If yes! Congratulations everything about you is known to every government agency that cares to know... by the way if your not someone special... they don't care "winks"
Have you ever been to the dr filed out a public form... are registered with the government with a SSN or any other type of ID.. Yes/No: If Yes Congratulations your information is in a data base somewhere.

While true, I don't think you understand the level of tracking in Win10.
Remember a couple years ago the complaints about spying on users by cell phone manufacturers installing software? Those companies could only dream of this level of spying. In fact, it's so in depth that China actually asked MS to remove some tracking systems.

So yes, they are all spying on you, but watching your neighbor while he swims or mows his lawn, is not the same as installing hidden cameras throughout the house so you can watch his every move, down to reading his credit card if he opens his wallet.


Here is the complete list, most is innocuous but hidden in it is some real gems such as keylogging. Also bear in mind, 99% of this page is the so-called BASIC tracking, which is anything but. What full tracking adds to the list is a teeny tiny bit at the end. Basically MS only put that option there make you think basic was actually basic.
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/configuration/basic-level-windows-diagnostic-events-and-fields

This looks like run of the mill application telemetry to me.
Could you point out the bit about the keylogger?

Offline Leslieann

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 3033
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #36 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 22:31:56 »
It be like someone handing you a hard drive with 4 million pictures on it and asking you to pick out 4 pictures from all of them with the same person in them. It be almost impossible task that take your entire life time. Even using a computer to sift thought and look for key things would take days.
No, it's not.
You see they don't need to identify every picture.
What MS does is they create a hash tag for each picture, this is a mathematical equation based on the code of the item.

No, they do not care about your Aunt Lucy's wedding pics, or you ebooks, but what if they wanted to see who has a copy of the Anarchist Cookbook, the Bible, or a research paper on climate change. All MS needs to do is search the databse for the hash code of that specific book. It doesn't matter if you rename it, they can identify it. This is how they identify music and video piracy, as well as verify files are intact. So yes, it does work, I can send you a hash code and a quick search on Google will find it and give you a link to download it.

Now, you may not see anything wrong with having any of those three things, but what happens if you live in Iran and Iran wants to see who has a Christian Bible. This happened to gay men in Saudi Arabia when they were outed on social media. Or in the case of the US and our current president, decides to try and figure out who is LGBT and lead a war on them (which he is all but doing). Or how about being a Socialist or having porn, being a Socialist isn't illegal, but McCarthy made it pretty darn close to it and there are senators working to make porn illegal. Not to Godwin the discussion, but it was perfectly legal to be a Jew in Germany prior to WW2 when it suddenly wasn't anymore.

So while what you have may be legal today, or you THINK what you have is legal, it may not be tomorrow and computers don't forget. Stupidly downloading a copy of the Anarchist Cookbook today could put you on a list of potential terrorists for your entire life, possibly your kids as well. Not going to happen? What about a picture of Tracy Lords in her early "acting" career when she was doing porn while underage, you may not even be aware, and then somehow cops start looking into you thinking you are a drug dealer ask MS for all they have on you and OOPS, that picture pops up, now you are a convicted pedophile, even if you are not a drug dealer.

You don't control the data on your computer when running Win10, MS does and THEY decide who they share it with, and they are VERY happy to share it with law enforcement and government. Court order? You don't need a court order to buy information from a 3rd party you legally gave that information to.
Filco MJ2 L.E. w/hand milled Vortex case, custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, sound dampened,  Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs | HMMK TKL | Magicforce 68 | YMDK75 | KBT Race S L.E. | Das Pro (Costar model) | GH60 | IBM Model M (x2)

Offline Leslieann

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 3033
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #37 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 23:07:38 »
This looks like run of the mill application telemetry to me.
Could you point out the bit about the keylogger?
The complete keylogger is believed to have been neutered before they published the Creators update and published the list of what they track (which was mandated by the France). MS does however admit they keylog anything typed into the address bar, even if you do not search for it. Accidentally typed your credit card in the address bar, they now have it.

So here is how to turn it off.
https://www.pcworld.com/article/2974057/windows/how-to-turn-off-windows-10s-keylogger-yes-it-still-has-one.html

But remember, MS has also admitted the settings do next to nothing, and they also reset them after updates without telling you.
https://www.google.com/search?biw=1622&bih=868&q=Microsoft+Admits+Windows+10+Automatic+Spying+Cannot+Be+Stopped&oq=Microsoft+Admits+Windows+10+Automatic+Spying+Cannot+Be+Stopped&gs_l=psy-ab.3..0i22i30k1.10818.10818.0.12217.1.1.0.0.0.0.111.111.0j1.1.0....0...1.1.64.psy-ab..0.1.110.4QSPfd50rRI


Here is a decent article on why you SHOULD be angry with all of this.
https://www.extremetech.com/computing/220588-new-windows-10-stats-show-microsoft-is-closely-watching-you-but-is-it-an-issue

"The problem with yelling “Microsoft is fine because everybody else does it, too!” is that it sets no firm boundaries on what should or shouldn’t be acceptable behavior."
Filco MJ2 L.E. w/hand milled Vortex case, custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, sound dampened,  Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs | HMMK TKL | Magicforce 68 | YMDK75 | KBT Race S L.E. | Das Pro (Costar model) | GH60 | IBM Model M (x2)

Offline MajorKoos

  • Posts: 796
  • Location: Bay Area
  • 1 life please. Extra large.
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #38 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 23:22:57 »
The text samples are used for spell checking, text prediction and such like.  The voice samples are used to train the models to recognize my accent.  The keyboard on most mobile phones does exactly the same thing for years already.  What exactly is the problem?

I'm tickled by the notion that MS is going to use CRC hashes of the files on my PC to help convict me as a pedophile so the government can come take my bible and guns.  What were the cops investigating me for again in this scenario?  Meth or crack?

Offline Leslieann

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 3033
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #39 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 23:26:49 »
And on that note....   Please people stop with the "Android and IOS" claims.
First off, all spying not equal and they differ greatly on how they treat you when you try to stop it. More importantly, there are ways to limit their ability to track you.

On computers, run Mac or Linux, yes, Apple likes tracking people, however they are actually much nicer about it and if you install a firewall to stop it, it actually stops (amazing right?). Installing a firewall on Windows 10 does nothing as MS actually hard coded some things in and then because people figured that out, also built the spying into other programs that have nothing to do with spying, for example if you disable some parts of telemetry, the driver finder errors out. This is why they say it can;t really be disabled, because they buried it deep into the baseline OS.


On cell phones I run a custom rom on my S5 that is open source and removes anything for Google to track me with. Yes, I put some back in for navigation support, but in the end I eliminated a huge amount of what Google can track. And, I have an app that can take any app and strip out the tracking, stop it from identifying me, and even delete the apps ability to connect online.  Funny thing, my battery last twice as long as a result. I even have an app that can Identify fake towers and spoof the GPS location. If I really wanted to mess with them, I could just run all my data through a secure connection though a VPN and external firewall everything off I don't like.

So does all of this work? Yes, and I have verified it with various security tools.
Filco MJ2 L.E. w/hand milled Vortex case, custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, sound dampened,  Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs | HMMK TKL | Magicforce 68 | YMDK75 | KBT Race S L.E. | Das Pro (Costar model) | GH60 | IBM Model M (x2)

Offline Leslieann

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 3033
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #40 on: Wed, 06 September 2017, 23:30:03 »
The text samples are used for spell checking, text prediction and such like.  The voice samples are used to train the models to recognize my accent.  The keyboard on most mobile phones does exactly the same thing for years already.  What exactly is the problem?

I'm tickled by the notion that MS is going to use CRC hashes of the files on my PC to help convict me as a pedophile so the government can come take my bible and guns.  What were the cops investigating me for again in this scenario?  Meth or crack?
Yes, some of it is for that purpose, but you don't need to log it.

And if you don't think they turn this stuff over for law enforcement, you haven't been paying attention. They have admitted that they can remote in and download any file from the system for any purpose, including law enforcement.
Filco MJ2 L.E. w/hand milled Vortex case, custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, sound dampened,  Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs | HMMK TKL | Magicforce 68 | YMDK75 | KBT Race S L.E. | Das Pro (Costar model) | GH60 | IBM Model M (x2)

Offline MajorKoos

  • Posts: 796
  • Location: Bay Area
  • 1 life please. Extra large.
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #41 on: Thu, 07 September 2017, 00:33:33 »
The text samples are used for spell checking, text prediction and such like.  The voice samples are used to train the models to recognize my accent.  The keyboard on most mobile phones does exactly the same thing for years already.  What exactly is the problem?

I'm tickled by the notion that MS is going to use CRC hashes of the files on my PC to help convict me as a pedophile so the government can come take my bible and guns.  What were the cops investigating me for again in this scenario?  Meth or crack?
Yes, some of it is for that purpose, but you don't need to log it.

And if you don't think they turn this stuff over for law enforcement, you haven't been paying attention. They have admitted that they can remote in and download any file from the system for any purpose, including law enforcement.

Thank goodness I have this tin foil hat to protect my thoughts - they'll never take those!

Offline Coreda

  • Posts: 722
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #42 on: Thu, 07 September 2017, 01:10:46 »
Windows 7 also got data collection in later updates, so if you have it configured to always download and install updates then there are really no differences.
You could perhaps be picky about which updates you install ... but that would be difficult.

It's not difficult (at least on W8.1), there are articles that mention which updates brought those changes. Additionally you can disable auto installs for Optional updates. I disabled this originally due to MS auto downloading W10 when optional updates were enabled on W7/8 systems. Scummy move. I now only install Important updates.

I've seen way too many issues users have experienced with W10 to want to 'upgrade'. W8.1, despite my early sharp criticisms for various things (which do have workarounds if you look hard enough), seems to me the better alternative.
« Last Edit: Thu, 07 September 2017, 01:12:48 by Coreda »

Offline tp4tissue

  • * Destiny Supporter
  • Posts: 12851
  • Location: Official Geekhack Public Defender..
  • OmniExpert of: Rice, Top-Ramen, Ergodox, n Females
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #43 on: Thu, 07 September 2017, 08:14:11 »


On cell phones I run a custom rom on my S5 that is open source and removes anything for Google to track me with. Yes, I put some back in for navigation support, but in the end I eliminated a huge amount of what Google can track. And, I have an app that can take any app and strip out the tracking, stop it from identifying me, and even delete the apps ability to connect online.  Funny thing, my battery last twice as long as a result. I even have an app that can Identify fake towers and spoof the GPS location. If I really wanted to mess with them, I could just run all my data through a secure connection though a VPN and external firewall everything off I don't like.

So does all of this work? Yes, and I have verified it with various security tools.


This seems like a huge.... Pull and Pray situation...

If you didn't write the code yourself,   then it's grey area...  you have to put your faith in someone.


These method you've chosen operates under the assumption that  someone -other than - microsoft or google has less interest in tracking you.


But conversely, it'd be just as justifiable to say, well anyone who doesn't wish to be tracked needs to be,  Therefore, the government agency with unlimited funding splinters out ,  files for a vpn company, or makes an android rom then you willingly PAY THEM to track you.


This is already a known strategy taken by governments..   if anything it was all pioneered by the NSA..


Offline Leslieann

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 3033
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #44 on: Thu, 07 September 2017, 21:16:05 »
But conversely, it'd be just as justifiable to say, well anyone who doesn't wish to be tracked needs to be,  Therefore, the government agency with unlimited funding splinters out ,  files for a vpn company, or makes an android rom then you willingly PAY THEM to track you.


That is the trick fly under the radar, without triggering alarms.
Tor triggers alarms.
Filco MJ2 L.E. w/hand milled Vortex case, custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, sound dampened,  Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs | HMMK TKL | Magicforce 68 | YMDK75 | KBT Race S L.E. | Das Pro (Costar model) | GH60 | IBM Model M (x2)

Offline tp4tissue

  • * Destiny Supporter
  • Posts: 12851
  • Location: Official Geekhack Public Defender..
  • OmniExpert of: Rice, Top-Ramen, Ergodox, n Females
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #45 on: Thu, 07 September 2017, 21:36:10 »
But conversely, it'd be just as justifiable to say, well anyone who doesn't wish to be tracked needs to be,  Therefore, the government agency with unlimited funding splinters out ,  files for a vpn company, or makes an android rom then you willingly PAY THEM to track you.


That is the trick fly under the radar, without triggering alarms.
Tor triggers alarms.


NSA is Omni-net..  they catch everything for miles..   if you never do anything they'd persecute for,  then your name never comes up..   But they've got everything they need to destroy you,  should you move against queen and country.


Hahaha.. there are no CIA  assassins..   of course not ..   Leslieann found dead, electrocuted under a rack of servers..

//investigation...  accident.. state court approved.

Offline Leslieann

  • * Elevated Elder
  • Posts: 3033
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #46 on: Fri, 08 September 2017, 02:42:45 »
NSA is Omni-net..  they catch everything for miles..   if you never do anything they'd persecute for,  then your name never comes up..   But they've got everything they need to destroy you,  should you move against queen and country.

Hahaha.. there are no CIA  assassins..   of course not ..   Leslieann found dead, electrocuted under a rack of servers..

//investigation...  accident.. state court approved.
In my experience, they usually let you know you are flying too close to the sun before they escalate.
Filco MJ2 L.E. w/hand milled Vortex case, custom feet/paint/winkey blockoff plate, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, Type C, sound dampened,  Thick PBT caps (o-ringed), Cherry Jailhouse Blues w/lubed/clipped Cherry light springs | HMMK TKL | Magicforce 68 | YMDK75 | KBT Race S L.E. | Das Pro (Costar model) | GH60 | IBM Model M (x2)

Offline MajorKoos

  • Posts: 796
  • Location: Bay Area
  • 1 life please. Extra large.
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #47 on: Fri, 08 September 2017, 10:48:06 »
NSA is Omni-net..  they catch everything for miles..   if you never do anything they'd persecute for,  then your name never comes up..   But they've got everything they need to destroy you,  should you move against queen and country.

Hahaha.. there are no CIA  assassins..   of course not ..   Leslieann found dead, electrocuted under a rack of servers..

//investigation...  accident.. state court approved.
In my experience, they usually let you know you are flying too close to the sun before they escalate.

Frederik Pohl wrote a series called 'The Space Merchants' which provides a (rather satirical) take on where this is going if we don't act.
« Last Edit: Fri, 08 September 2017, 14:36:45 by MajorKoos »

Offline bearz42

  • Posts: 21
  • Location: America
Re: Need a 64-bit OS: 7 or 10?
« Reply #48 on: Fri, 08 September 2017, 16:18:29 »
Would you give me any heed if you asked which phone to buy and I suggest a 10 year old Nokia 6110?
Why are you even heeding someone pushing a 10 year old product as the solution to today's problems?

It's a little tougher to recommend an old phone when telecommunication companies phase out legacy communication standards and long term support for smartphone OSs is basically nonexistent.

Android support window: ~3 years (best case scenario)
iPhone: ~5 years
Windows 7: ~10 years
Windows 8(.1): ~9 years
Windows XP: ~13 years

Arch Linux: Timeless


There is kind of an irony in saying that when it's a rolling release....

I love linux though. Running arch on one laptop, void on another. I've been using linux for almost five years now ans I would never go back.