Author Topic: SSD Advice  (Read 9545 times)

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Offline absyrd

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SSD Advice
« on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 11:53:17 »
I need a new SSD. My 80g intel is acting slow after all these years. Is intel still the ONLY way to go for reliability?

SAMSUNG 850 EVO MZ-75E500B/AM 2.5" 500GB SATA III 3-D Vertical Internal Solid State Drive for $160 shipped seems to good to pass up. Is the thing gonna **** out on me completely?

Also need ones for a friend's work laptop + desktop builds, so I don't want to **** her **** up after telling her to tell Dell to go **** themselves on their ridiculous quote for outdated equip.
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Offline jdcarpe

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #1 on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 12:40:23 »
I've heard really good things about the Samsung Evo series. I just bought one of the 250gb version, so I'm hoping it lives up to everything I've read.
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Offline absyrd

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #2 on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 12:42:12 »
I've heard really good things about the Samsung Evo series. I just bought one of the 250gb version, so I'm hoping it lives up to everything I've read.

Thanks, jd. That is all I needed to hear. It has been years since I've been an "enthusiast" and was on OCN and EVGA every day. Just figured I'd ask here. :D
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Offline Badwrench

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #3 on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 12:52:11 »
You cant go wrong with that Samsung.  It also doesnt hurt that their software package is one of the best in the biz.  Their free drive cloning software is great too: I just used it to transfer my Moms completely full Mushkin 60gb ssd to a new 850 evo.  Only took a couple minutes and that was due to the slower speeds of the old ssd.
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Offline absyrd

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #4 on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 12:59:40 »
You cant go wrong with that Samsung.  It also doesnt hurt that their software package is one of the best in the biz.  Their free drive cloning software is great too: I just used it to transfer my Moms completely full Mushkin 60gb ssd to a new 850 evo.  Only took a couple minutes and that was due to the slower speeds of the old ssd.

Oh ****! It can do that? What about windows and new hardware and reinstalling the OS because of it? No problems?
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Offline slip84

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #5 on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 13:18:36 »
Samsung has had some drama lately with drive performance in the short term: http://www.anandtech.com/show/9196/samsung-releases-second-840-evo-fix

Personally, I'm doing a few OCZ drives and Intel with NO issues.

Offline Badwrench

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #6 on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 13:50:57 »
Samsung has had some drama lately with drive performance in the short term: http://www.anandtech.com/show/9196/samsung-releases-second-840-evo-fix

Personally, I'm doing a few OCZ drives and Intel with NO issues.
Not everyone is getting that problem though - I didnt.  Not sure it affects the 850 though.

And yes adsyrd, it did a direct clone, os and all.  Didnt even need to put the windows key back in.
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Offline absyrd

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #7 on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 13:55:51 »
Well I copped my 2 allowed. We'll see how it goes. :D

Thanks all. As usual, GH is my one-stop nerd destination!
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Offline tjcaustin

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #8 on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 14:32:32 »
Samsung has had some drama lately with drive performance in the short term: http://www.anandtech.com/show/9196/samsung-releases-second-840-evo-fix

Personally, I'm doing a few OCZ drives and Intel with NO issues.

That only affects the 840 evo, everything else runs difference architectures.

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #9 on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 15:35:17 »
Samsung has had some drama lately with drive performance in the short term: http://www.anandtech.com/show/9196/samsung-releases-second-840-evo-fix

Personally, I'm doing a few OCZ drives and Intel with NO issues.

That only affects the 840 evo, everything else runs difference architectures.

840 evo  AND  vanilla 840,  AND samsung's oem drives that were essentially 840s.

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #10 on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 15:36:17 »
Heres' the deal with TLC..

Voltage degradation is a problem.. so it's not as reliable..    BUT,  if you're just playing your games and stalking females on facebook.. It' doesn't really matter..


The 850 PRO will give you the best performance consistency..  And in truth, it costs twice as much nand to produce an 850pro of equal capacity to 850 evo..   So, since the price isn't double..  Technically you're getting a better deal if you buy the 850pro in terms of silicon space.

Offline absyrd

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #11 on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 15:50:33 »
Heres' the deal with TLC..

Voltage degradation is a problem.. so it's not as reliable..    BUT,  if you're just playing your games and stalking females on facebook.. It' doesn't really matter..


The 850 PRO will give you the best performance consistency..  And in truth, it costs twice as much nand to produce an 850pro of equal capacity to 850 evo..   So, since the price isn't double..  Technically you're getting a better deal if you buy the 850pro in terms of silicon space.

Too technical. GTFO
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Offline Jokrik

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #12 on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 22:42:57 »
Heres' the deal with TLC..

Voltage degradation is a problem.. so it's not as reliable..    BUT,  if you're just playing your games and stalking females on facebook.. It' doesn't really matter..


The 850 PRO will give you the best performance consistency..  And in truth, it costs twice as much nand to produce an 850pro of equal capacity to 850 evo..   So, since the price isn't double..  Technically you're getting a better deal if you buy the 850pro in terms of silicon space.

Went with this advice, didn't regret a single thing
coming from 840 EVO with **** tons of problems
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Offline Blaise170

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #13 on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 23:02:14 »
I use a Crucial MX100. I don't need any fancy features or anything, I just wanted a drive that could plug and play. I haven't had any issues with it at all and it is cheaper than a lot of Samsung NAND.
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #14 on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 23:09:15 »
I use a Crucial MX100. I don't need any fancy features or anything, I just wanted a drive that could plug and play. I haven't had any issues with it at all and it is cheaper than a lot of Samsung NAND.

There's gimmicky features on the expensive ssds for sure.  But overall you do get a faster processor and usually more nand space for reliability.

Offline Blaise170

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #15 on: Sat, 13 June 2015, 23:30:46 »
Crucial is made by Micron though, it's not like it's an inferior product, they go head to head with Samsung when it comes to flash memory. Plus Micron is an American company for any who like to buy 'Murican products.
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Offline IvanIvanovich

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #16 on: Sun, 14 June 2015, 10:16:53 »
I've been generally buying drives that use Toshiba toggle nand (Mushkin DX series, Seagate 600, Kingston Predator). Since it's been available it's been consistently at the top of both performance and reliability. So far I've only had one of them fail (mushkin Atlas), and to be fair it was being used as a journaling/write cache for my storage array which is outside the general use case for consumer grade SSD. I also do have a pair of Micron C400s, a pair of Samsung 470s and my first ssd the intel x18m still going strong.

If SSD gets slow down, you can usually get it back to out of the box speeds or very near by doing an ATA secure erase. I usually do that about once a year or so since backing up and re-copy the data back on after is a bit tedious.

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #17 on: Sun, 14 June 2015, 11:03:03 »
Crucial is made by Micron though, it's not like it's an inferior product, they go head to head with Samsung when it comes to flash memory. Plus Micron is an American company for any who like to buy 'Murican products.

No one is saying it's inferior..

But the value is there with Samsung, because of their n00b proof cloning software.. AND the fact that they're vertically integrated, which means they have much better consistency in design and production.

Offline Blaise170

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #18 on: Sun, 14 June 2015, 12:36:33 »
No I'm not saying you are wrong or anything.  :p My Crucial came with an Acronis license but to each their own.  :)
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Offline n3ro

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #19 on: Mon, 15 June 2015, 05:16:38 »
No problems so far with both Samsung and Crucials ssd's. Both 256gb mlc models, 840 pro and mx100.

Using a 2.5 hdd for secondary storage because how quiet it is compared to 3.5 hdd's.

Offline suby4me

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #20 on: Tue, 16 June 2015, 20:10:31 »
I've been running a samsung 840 pro evo on my mac for a little over a year and it still runs great. I haven't really noticed any slow down. The only thing that I did was activate TRIM for my ssd.
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Offline missalaire

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #21 on: Tue, 16 June 2015, 20:16:16 »
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #22 on: Thu, 18 June 2015, 18:57:27 »
I've been running a samsung 840 pro evo on my mac for a little over a year and it still runs great. I haven't really noticed any slow down. The only thing that I did was activate TRIM for my ssd.

If it's a PRO,  then it's fine..  if it's an EVO,  you need to install the update.

Offline Bacchus

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #23 on: Fri, 19 June 2015, 03:37:56 »
evo is guarantee to last at least 5 years (since thats how long the factory warranty last). If you need something that will last you 10+ years, go with 850 pro.

Offline theryaner

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #24 on: Fri, 26 June 2015, 05:49:07 »
I have that Samsung and it's working perfectly so far.

Offline tp4tissue

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #25 on: Thu, 02 July 2015, 13:08:52 »
I keep telling people to get the PRO..

Ever since the 840 PRO,  i was telling people..  Get PRO,  because it's DOUBLE the silicon for Less than Double the Price..

I didn't think the 840evo incident was going to happen..  but this still makes just as much sense TODAY.

Offline jasondecos

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #26 on: Mon, 21 January 2019, 02:48:00 »
If I were to recommend Intel DC P3600 Series 800GB Half Height PCI Express 3.0 Solid State Drive. These drives come in a range of different sizes, and are similar in price to their SATA equivalents.

I found the best price available here but you should also check other websites before buying https://harddiskdirect.com/ssdpedme800g401-intel-solid-state-drive.html
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #27 on: Mon, 21 January 2019, 06:38:21 »
You can't really go wrong with Intel, Crucial or Samsung for the most part.
For a standard sata SSD, pretty much anything still on store shelves from them (or any reputable name) is going to be good. I've and also had good luck so far with Adata. The WD ssd also look pretty good, though I have not used one yet.

For PCI-E and M.2 it's a bit more complicated because you have normal sata speeds and then you have the newer, much faster models. That said, if you aren't running a rather recent high end system, just stick with a common, fast sata drive and save your money (go for capacity so it will be useful longer). I'm not convinced something like a 3rd gen dual core I5 and 8gigs of ram is really going to really be able to suck enough data for it to be worth the increased price to go with a PCI-E drive, not to mention the capacity sacrifice you would have to make to get it. Yes, you can buy it and upgrade the rest of the system later, but by then you could buy something faster and larger for even less. SSD drives are quickly falling in price while gaining capacity and speed so it doesn't really pay to plan too far ahead on them.

As for Pro vs Evo...
I'm with TP on this, unless you have a system than can really make use of it, it's not going to make much of a difference compared to the price difference in most cases.  Would you rather 95% of the performance and 40%+ more capacity or that extra 5% of speed that your system may or may not be able to take advantage of 99% of the time (your drive sits idle most of the time)? I'm all about performance, but you have to consider diminishing returns. And always check for firmware updates before you do too much on a new ssd (as well as occasionally!). The only SSD I've lost, and I've had many, was due to a Windows problem that a firmware fix would have taken care of. It was my most expensive one and 3 months out of warranty. On the other hand, it got me off Windows, so there's that.


For a laptop, look closely at efficiency, it can make a huge difference on battery life.
Looking at a few on my desk, the Crucial M4 SSD pulls 10 watts, the 850 Evo pulls 7watts, the Micron ssd out of a Lenovo T440 pulls 4 watts, while I have an older 2.5in Western Digital Caviar Black and a Blue that use only 3 watts. I'm not sure what the M4 pulls at idle, but I do know that the 850 pulls more at idle than the Micron does while operating, I have 2 external boxes that can't power the 850 or M4 due to the power draw. In a laptop that can't pull data like crazy anyways, you are better off with a somewhat fast but efficient SSD rather than pure outright performance or a spinner so pick wisely if you value the battery life. I've used the Crucial BX line in a few customer systems and had good results.
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #28 on: Mon, 21 January 2019, 07:02:00 »
At this point I'd only recommend 10GB/$1 Micron 2TB oem drives.

It's micron, it's 2TB,  it's cheeeep..

There's no reason to buy anything else,  VERY FEW ssds will fail within the warranty period , especially a 2TB drive.. so not having warranty is moot.

Offline SpAmRaY

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #29 on: Mon, 21 January 2019, 09:55:34 »
At this point I'd only recommend 10GB/$1 Micron 2TB oem drives.

It's micron, it's 2TB,  it's cheeeep..

There's no reason to buy anything else,  VERY FEW ssds will fail within the warranty period , especially a 2TB drive.. so not having warranty is moot.

I bought an 860 evo 500gb for ~$60 for my mom for Christmas. I should have bought one for myself to.



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Offline csmertx

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #30 on: Tue, 22 January 2019, 23:26:45 »
At this point I'd only recommend 10GB/$1 Micron 2TB oem drives.

It's micron, it's 2TB,  it's cheeeep..

There's no reason to buy anything else,  VERY FEW ssds will fail within the warranty period , especially a 2TB drive.. so not having warranty is moot.

I bought an 860 evo 500gb for ~$60 for my mom for Christmas. I should have bought one for myself to.



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Damn 3yr warranty and it's 2TB.. that's not bad. Though I'm not sure how SSDs hold up to ZFS scrubbing and other file storage data integrity checking operations. Maybe Optane would be aight under those conditions.
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Offline Sniping

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #31 on: Tue, 22 January 2019, 23:39:53 »
At this point I'd only recommend 10GB/$1 Micron 2TB oem drives.

It's micron, it's 2TB,  it's cheeeep..

There's no reason to buy anything else,  VERY FEW ssds will fail within the warranty period , especially a 2TB drive.. so not having warranty is moot.

I bought an 860 evo 500gb for ~$60 for my mom for Christmas. I should have bought one for myself to.



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Damn 3yr warranty and it's 2TB.. that's not bad. Though I'm not sure how SSDs hold up to ZFS scrubbing and other file storage data integrity checking operations. Maybe Optane would be aight under those conditions.

If you're in the market for something 2tb i saw this on slickdeals today. https://slickdeals.net/f/12673444-intel-660p-2tb-nvme-ssd-229-99?src=frontpage
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #32 on: Wed, 23 January 2019, 01:38:26 »
At this point I'd only recommend 10GB/$1 Micron 2TB oem drives.

It's micron, it's 2TB,  it's cheeeep..

There's no reason to buy anything else,  VERY FEW ssds will fail within the warranty period , especially a 2TB drive.. so not having warranty is moot.

I bought an 860 evo 500gb for ~$60 for my mom for Christmas. I should have bought one for myself to.



Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

Damn 3yr warranty and it's 2TB.. that's not bad. Though I'm not sure how SSDs hold up to ZFS scrubbing and other file storage data integrity checking operations. Maybe Optane would be aight under those conditions.

If you're in the market for something 2tb i saw this on slickdeals today. https://slickdeals.net/f/12673444-intel-660p-2tb-nvme-ssd-229-99?src=frontpage

You guys are crazy to try QLC this early..

I'd wait at least 2 yrs..


Offline FreeCopy

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #33 on: Wed, 23 January 2019, 02:00:25 »
I bought an OCZ Agility2 60gb back in like 2010. It finally started throwing errors the other day(Clonezilla with a disk-to-disk image went awesome. HTPC saved!)
It's been an OS disk for Win 7, 8.1, 10 and a couple of linux installs.

I replaced it with a 950 pro and I feel almost like I got a speed downgrade. Win10 on both installs, the 950 went to an upgraded system.

Previous system was 965BE, 8gb ram, HD6950
Current system is, fx-8350, 18gb ram, r9 390

I'm feeling another upgrade happening in 2019
My Next system I might go with m.2 nvme
It will be almost strictly for gaming and my current Steam folder is under 300gb so storage isn't a massive issue.
I think 1TB should be plenty for OS and small game library
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #35 on: Wed, 23 January 2019, 21:02:02 »
Previous system was 965BE, 8gb ram, HD6950
Current system is, fx-8350, 18gb ram, r9 390
Sounds like a bad driver, bad image or incompatible ram, my guess is the ram (due to the odd size). Some boards deal with odd ram selection better than others. Otherwise everything in that second system should have been FAR, FAR faster.
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Offline FreeCopy

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #36 on: Wed, 23 January 2019, 23:57:05 »


 I got a speed downgrade.

 fx-8350



Well dar'syr'problem.



I've been using AMD since k6-2 550. No plans to switch.

For sure there seems to be an issue with this processor and seeking through larger folders with thumbnails enabled.

Previous system was 965BE, 8gb ram, HD6950
Current system is, fx-8350, 18gb ram, r9 390
Sounds like a bad driver, bad image or incompatible ram, my guess is the ram (due to the odd size). Some boards deal with odd ram selection better than others. Otherwise everything in that second system should have been FAR, FAR faster.

Now that I'm reading this and not tired, it was supposed to be 16gb. I knew it felt weird when I typed it.

There is definitely something up though. Maybe I'll blame the MB. asus m5a99fx pro r2.0

I've used Asus for as long as I can remember and I know I'm trying something different on my next build. I feel this and the last two Asus boards were let downs.
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #37 on: Wed, 23 January 2019, 23:58:14 »
Previous system was 965BE, 8gb ram, HD6950
Current system is, fx-8350, 18gb ram, r9 390
Sounds like a bad driver, bad image or incompatible ram, my guess is the ram (due to the odd size). Some boards deal with odd ram selection better than others. Otherwise everything in that second system should have been FAR, FAR faster.

Unlikely, even with bad drivers, a new 950 would still pull way ahead of agility 2..

Freecopy prolly goin' to dem' naughty websites, got a Virus eatn' up his bandwidth.

Offline FreeCopy

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #38 on: Thu, 24 January 2019, 00:13:21 »
Previous system was 965BE, 8gb ram, HD6950
Current system is, fx-8350, 18gb ram, r9 390
Sounds like a bad driver, bad image or incompatible ram, my guess is the ram (due to the odd size). Some boards deal with odd ram selection better than others. Otherwise everything in that second system should have been FAR, FAR faster.

Unlikely, even with bad drivers, a new 950 would still pull way ahead of agility 2..

Freecopy prolly definitely goin' to dem' naughty websites, got a Virus eatn' up his bandwidth.


FTFY

This issue was noticeable before I took this machine partying online.

Maybe I ended up with one that sneaked past QC.

I actually don't know if/when I last did anything with firmware on this drive. Now that I'm looking into it. The drive is actually an 850 pro, not a 950.

Damn, I'm losing it.
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #39 on: Thu, 24 January 2019, 07:43:31 »

FTFY

This issue was noticeable before I took this machine partying online.

Maybe I ended up with one that sneaked past QC.

I actually don't know if/when I last did anything with firmware on this drive. Now that I'm looking into it. The drive is actually an 850 pro, not a 950.

Damn, I'm losing it.

Eat more vegetables Freecopy,  Clear up dat Mind-Fog

You can check your ahci driver if that's up to date,


But overall,  when in doubt,  REFORMAT..  it's easier and FASTER than figuring out what's wrong.

Offline FreeCopy

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #40 on: Thu, 24 January 2019, 17:23:44 »

FTFY

This issue was noticeable before I took this machine partying online.

Maybe I ended up with one that sneaked past QC.

I actually don't know if/when I last did anything with firmware on this drive. Now that I'm looking into it. The drive is actually an 850 pro, not a 950.

Damn, I'm losing it.

Eat more vegetables Freecopy,  Clear up dat Mind-Fog

You can check your ahci driver if that's up to date,


But overall,  when in doubt,  REFORMAT..  it's easier and FASTER than figuring out what's wrong.


Everything with drivers in system and MB are up to date, even firmware on drive is updated and speed tests are confirming the hardware is running as advertised.

I may have to do the reformat route. This Win 10 install as been running since a couple months after initial release.

Time to start gathering resources. I hate having to rebuild my environment.

I appreciate the feedback from you and Leslieann. Thank you!
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Offline Leslieann

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #41 on: Thu, 24 January 2019, 19:53:23 »
Time to start gathering resources. I hate having to rebuild my environment.

I appreciate the feedback from you and Leslieann. Thank you!
You're welcome.

I never image, actually I do, but only for customer systems and my file server OS. *
I don't use system folders, I used to use a folder on a second drive (now on my file server but you can just as easily use a second partition) and store pretty much all of my personal files outside of the OS. This way, even if my install fails, I could reinstall and lose very little if anything. Not only does this make it easy to reinstall or switch operating systems, it also makes it far easier to backup your data since it's almost all in one spot. Also makes it easy to click on on folder and see all your data folders in one spot, not sure what MS was thinking here.

What is easier, backing up favorites, pictures, documents, music and videos one at a time or simply grabbing an entire folder and dragging it over to your backup? Better still is to have that folder on another drive/partition/computer not touched by the OS in the first place. Then you just need to backup your browser and a few other small things (there are programs to automate this**) and you are ready to get on with it. Added bonus, backing up this way is FAR smaller since you don't have Windows and game install files included. It generally takes me 45 minutes to backup, wipe, install an OS (Windows, Mac or Linux), reinstall all my data (minus games) and be back online like nothing happened. There is always a few things to finish like games or downloading a big update, but for the most part I'm up and running and fully operational. I usually keep a local copy of game installers and programs as well to speed up the process.


*Images are great if you want to make sure you have everything, but on the other hand, images are terrible for restoring an OS.  You have tons of old files laying around, possibly corrupted files, old drivers no longer in use, outdated programs, programs no longer being used, unknown malware... Images have their place, they are great for ensuring you have everything, but I don't recommend them for actually restoring the system unless you must. I've seen them miss files, I've also seen them only get parts of a file that was corrupted, miss partition information and even  have troubles with a change in drive size, so while the system ran before, it would now no longer boot. You also should NEVER do this when going from Intel to AMD and vice versa, while newer versions of Windows is better about it, this can lead to a system not booting and again it means a bunch of useless junk laying around clogging up your system.

I don't trust images, they are not good practice as your only backup system, they are slow, big, too easily corrupted and you are restoring problems. They are meant for servers, where the data is stored outside the OS and was brought over to Windows. Servers don't change much, while your desktop constantly does and your data is right inside. Because it's slow (and often needs to be done with an external boot disk), people are also less likely to do them on a regular basis. Whereas backing up folders can be done on the fly while you are working and automated.

** Some backup automation programs I know and use
Windows - Allway Sync
Linux - Kbackup
Mac - Backuplist+
Java based, runs on all the above - Dirsync Pro

Drive image
Active Disk image (favorite), lets you mount and pull from images with an file explorer style interface right from inside Windows.
Acronis True Image
Macreum Reflect  (works well and is free, but the disk often needs to be created on the system intended to be backed up for best results)
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Offline JP

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #42 on: Fri, 25 January 2019, 12:47:56 »
Those are some good tips for imaging. I used to make images after performing a new OS install and installing driver or a short list of applications or systems tweaks to save time should I end up buggering my OS at a future date. I've had very good luck with Acronis. For Windows I've used a program called GoodSync for file backups and syncing but that program costs a few bucks.
« Last Edit: Fri, 25 January 2019, 12:50:39 by JP »
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Offline csmertx

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #43 on: Fri, 25 January 2019, 14:02:34 »
I use a tiny 500GB HDD for backing up my SDD. So naturally I started with tarballing my system. That's how everyone starts right? ..Right?.. But at ~25GB per tarball per night, that adds up quickly. With that in mind I deep dove into random CLI deduplication 'snapshot' programs because apparently I'm a huge nerd. And tarballing a live system is almost impossible. So anyway, borgbackup, a CLI based snapshot system. To test the software I performed a snapshot and restore of a usb drive with a linux installation, and all was fine so what the hell why not. YOLO (0_0). As of writing this I've run into one bug during my six months of borgbackup usage, and that was just a minor python dependency that was well documented (several people reported in) in the upstream, followed by an update ~24hrs later. Basically a cron job fires off a script once a day at 8pm that handles what, where, and pruning unnecessary snapshots. Restoring a system via borgbackup however won't be like using gparted to copy paste a partition. Though that was how I migrated my daily system partition to the new SSD (gparted partition copy pasta <3), with borgbackup as I understand it, one would still need to install a bootloader. So basically I install a base Arch Linux system and then use borgbackup to extract the snapshot. Like tarballs on steroids, but not quite ZFS. From what I understand borgbackup was written for sys admins that want a quick way to rebuild a server, though it works the same for those that want a quick way to rebuild a desktop. As a user of a rolling release distro I'm not too concerned about (still using the USB install I restored) versioning issues. And it would be silly of me to not mention that it preserves permissions. Of course it preserves permissions. Not that tar doesn't present an optarg for saving permissions--it's just a pita to use on a live system, and iirc lacks dedup. In a nutshell I give up 5minutes of my CPU per day and I'm left with seven days of snapshots of a 60GB system that could literally fit on a 32GB thumb drive. Whereas tarballing a 60GB system would take ~4hrs a day (yikes) and cost me on average 175GB of HDD space for a continuous seven days of backups. In conclusion: more room for anime. Pretty great.
« Last Edit: Fri, 25 January 2019, 14:04:11 by csmertx »
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Offline TacticalCoder

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #44 on: Thu, 07 February 2019, 10:06:40 »
Since a few years already I'm using one of these fancy, very fast, NVMe M.2 SSD (the ones bypassing Sata altogether and directly using PCI-e lanes) as my only drive: a Samsung 950 Pro 256 GB. It has seen three years of daily use, 24/7, and says it has used 24% of its life. Motherboard had a NVMe / M.2 slot already so there was no need to buy a PCI-e / M.2 adapter.

I don't need a lot of room as long as I've got enough to store all my images / containers (for software dev). I've got about 50% of the disk used. What I do need is speed when I manipulate (like duplicate) big VM images and/or containers.

I'm so happy with my Samsung 950 Pro NVMe M.2 that I'm just going to upgrade to another Samsung NVMe M.2 SSD: either the 970 EVO 256 GB (80 EUR) or the 970 Pro 512 GB (they don't make the Pro with less than 512 GB anymore) for 170 EUR. And I may keep my 3-years old 950 Pro as a backup drive in a USB-C external enclosure accepting NVMe M.2 SSD: this way I'd get USB-C max speed when backuping.

Dunno. I'll see. Only thing I know is I'm super happy as I never had such a fast SSD previously and it definitely rocks to be having such a workhorse in my main workstation.
Now it's funny to see the benchmarks and see that my 3 years Samsung 950 Pro NVMe M.2 which already smokes any SATA SSD is already itself obsoleted by say a 80 EUR Samsung 970 Evo:
https://ssd.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Samsung-970-Evo-Plus-NVMe-PCIe-M2-500GB-vs-Samsung-950-NVMe-PCIe-M2-256GB/m700020vsm38570
« Last Edit: Thu, 07 February 2019, 10:15:46 by TacticalCoder »
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Offline tp4tissue

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #45 on: Thu, 07 February 2019, 10:15:40 »
Since a few years already I'm using one of these fancy, very fast, NVMe M.2 SSD (the ones bypassing Sata altogether and directly using PCI-e lanes) as my only drive: a Samsung 950 Pro 256 GB. It has seen three years of daily use, 24/7, and says it has used 24% of its life. Motherboard had a NVMe / M.2 slot already so there was no need to buy a PCI-e / M.2 adapter.

I don't need a lot of room as long as I've got enough to store all my images / containers (for software dev). I've got about 50% of the disk used. What I do need is speed when I manipulate (like duplicate) big VM images and/or containers.

I'm so happy with my Samsung 950 Pro NVMe M.2 that I'm just going to upgrade to another Samsung NVMe M.2 SSD: either the 970 EVO 256 GB (80 EUR) or the 970 Pro 512 GB (they don't make the Pro with less than 512 GB anymore) for 170 EUR. And I may keep my 3-years old 950 Pro as a backup drive in a USB-C external enclosure accepting NVMe M.2 SSD: this way I'd get USB-C max speed when backuping.

Dunno. I'll see. Only thing I know is I'm super happy as I never had such a fast SSD previously and it definitely rocks to be having such a workhorse in my main workstation.

In a blind test, I wasn't able to tell between nvme and sata for most desktop use cases,  The only time I could tell is during saturation copies, the nvme drive will throttle the transfer and respond to other system requests, whereas the sata might lock up until the copy completes.

But this might just be down to the drive's innate controller, and nothing to do with nvme.

Offline Leslieann

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #46 on: Thu, 07 February 2019, 20:29:26 »
But this might just be down to the drive's innate controller, and nothing to do with nvme.

NVME eliminates a surprising amount of overhead (SATA at both ends), allowing for faster access times, and there does seem to be a speed improvement with NVME over sata, the question is if it's due to lower access times, faster transfer or both. That said, you can only reduce access times so far before there is no more room left for serious gains (we're already there) and I don't think too many cpus/ram combos can actually handle the amount of data these drives can sustain.

The question is, at what point do you get diminishing returns.
Almost every laptop is going to be have trouble really pushing even normal sata speeds, but a decent desktop will probably be able to handle a bit beyond normal sata. Is it worth the money for them to upgrade? Probably not. But then you have systems like my desktop where I can easily push a normal sata drive to the limit so there is enough of a gain to justify it.
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Offline Sniping

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #47 on: Fri, 08 February 2019, 02:28:36 »
I honestly couldn't tell the difference between my sata evo drive and my HP ex920 drive. Right now my post takes up the most time during my bootup sequence, so really there's not much room to improve. This is a situation where we've reached good enough performance and to me, a drive that's twice as fast isn't twice as nice at this point.
the best keyboard is the one in front of you

Offline Leslieann

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #48 on: Fri, 08 February 2019, 20:15:15 »
I honestly couldn't tell the difference between my sata evo drive and my HP ex920 drive. Right now my post takes up the most time during my bootup sequence, so really there's not much room to improve. This is a situation where we've reached good enough performance and to me, a drive that's twice as fast isn't twice as nice at this point.
Sounds like your system is strong enough to  push a Sata but not enough to go much beyond that.
Mind if I ask what you're running?
Filco MJ2 L.E. w/Vortex case, hand milled case, custom feet, custom paint, Klaxxon key caps, lubed and o-ringed Jailhouse Blues made from vintage Cherry MX Blues, HID Liberator, stainless steel universal plate, 3d printed adapters, removable cord, sound dampened. Winkey blockoff plate | Magicforce 68 w/Outemu Blues |KBT Race S L.E. w/Ergo-Clears, custom WASD keyset | Das Pro w/browns (Costar model) | IBM Model M (x2)

Offline Sniping

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Re: SSD Advice
« Reply #49 on: Fri, 08 February 2019, 23:38:04 »
I honestly couldn't tell the difference between my sata evo drive and my HP ex920 drive. Right now my post takes up the most time during my bootup sequence, so really there's not much room to improve. This is a situation where we've reached good enough performance and to me, a drive that's twice as fast isn't twice as nice at this point.
Sounds like your system is strong enough to  push a Sata but not enough to go much beyond that.
Mind if I ask what you're running?


Hmm, yeah I actually bought the computer second hand from a kid off craigslist. It's actually really slow on POST, the whole sequence takes like 10 seconds or more. Maybe it just needs a cmos reset or something, I haven't bothered to look into it. I don't think my computer is getting bottlenecked, but maybe so. It's a 7700k, Asus Z170-a, and 32gb of 2666mhz memory. It's probably just me too dumb too notice the difference, but come to think of it, maybe it is the motherboard. Maybe worth a bios upgrade or similar?
the best keyboard is the one in front of you