Author Topic: Potential community sale...  (Read 23617 times)

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Offline 1Weeb

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #200 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 03:18:27 »
Forum sites like this are what have kept me from making a GH account in the first place.

They just feel so outdated and can be confusing to navigate with all the small text and crap everywhere. Notifications suck and the chain quotes just look stupid, seriously what the fuk. I'm sure there's a more modern alternative to forums so I'd definitely love any sort of redesign better than this.
« Last Edit: Mon, 02 July 2018, 03:21:08 by 1Weeb »

Offline Belfong

  • Formerly known as Ballfong
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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #201 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 04:05:28 »
Instead of building from ground up, why not use Discourse? It is open source and free and pretty modern.
 

Offline KHAANNN

  • Posts: 1623
Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #202 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 04:39:43 »
0.1$ ecpm = 30k$ yearly

3-5$ ecpm would make millions :(

even a ****ty 0.01$ ecpm makes $15k a steal

much jelly i am
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Offline Giorgio

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #203 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 04:43:58 »
0.1$ ecpm = 30k$ yearly

3-5$ ecpm would make millions :(

even a ****ty 0.01$ ecpm makes $15k a steal

much jelly i am

we should buy it

Offline The_Boom_Boy

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #204 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 04:50:02 »
hmmm

Offline KHAANNN

  • Posts: 1623
Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #205 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 05:02:20 »
0.1$ ecpm = 30k$ yearly

3-5$ ecpm would make millions :(

even a ****ty 0.01$ ecpm makes $15k a steal

much jelly i am

we should buy it

you know like in some online games, you see some item on the market, you're like, daamn this is too good to be true, in that confusion you spend 5-10 seconds thinking, then click buy, and receive the "Item is gone/already bought" message

Well it's like that :D
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Offline dgneo

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #206 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 05:34:02 »
I'm on board to help in any way possible.
null

Offline pr0ximity

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #207 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 05:36:02 »
Please, please, please do not turn this into an enterprise dev's side project. That would be a fate worse than just shutting GH down.

Keep it hosted on reliable hardware, then get your software engineering kicks elsewhere. Find a more modern forum software if you must and write plugins for it. Keep it patched and contribute back to that open source software's mainline.

But, if you really do want someone to over-engineer a forum, at least open source it from the beginning so people can pick it up when it languishes and is forgotten.

Online tp4tissue

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #208 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 05:45:54 »
Tp4's gekHa interface looks like this..


//Recommend, should be the default after the overhaul..


Gray font on Black Back..

NO BLOAT..



Deskthority has alot more features and such, but they're not critical to communication.

Trim Gekha down to be slim.   NOT increase features which makes the interface messy.


199039-0

199037-1

Offline KHAANNN

  • Posts: 1623
Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #209 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 05:49:41 »
Please, please, please do not turn this into an enterprise dev's side project. That would be a fate worse than just shutting GH down.

Keep it hosted on reliable hardware, then get your software engineering kicks elsewhere. Find a more modern forum software if you must and write plugins for it. Keep it patched and contribute back to that open source software's mainline.

But, if you really do want someone to over-engineer a forum, at least open source it from the beginning so people can pick it up when it languishes and is forgotten.

Don't worry and no need for hysteria and passive insults, apart from all the confusion and empty talk (typical forum stuff :), Zeal is the best, I'm sure he will do what's best

He still sells Ivan Dolch DB Spacebars: https://zealpc.net/collections/keycap-sets/products/dolch - I've been buying them from him for years, that tells something about his dedication to maintenance :)
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Offline Coreda

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #210 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 05:53:15 »
Instead of building from ground up, why not use Discourse? It is open source and free and pretty modern.

For some sites it has worked but for others it's hurt the soul of the site. Doesn't help that every single Discourse community I've come across looks virtually identical. That said, out of the box its stock look with a dark theme is preferable to Xenforo's imo.

100% agree with a complete redesign.

To the people against it; do you actually use GH? It's horribly outdated and lacks tons of functionally that you should expect from any forum made within the last 10 years

I'd argue it looks more outdated than it necessarily is. The only thing actually functionally necessary is a mobile spreadsheet. In some respects like its PM categorization feature even modern board software like Xenforo and Discourse lack anything similar.

Edit: it's already been sold to Zeal? Well, guess we'll see how things pan out. Wish I could export all my posts in the meantime.
« Last Edit: Mon, 02 July 2018, 05:56:16 by Coreda »

Offline wholypantalones

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #211 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 05:56:30 »
Please, please, please do not turn this into an enterprise dev's side project. That would be a fate worse than just shutting GH down.

Keep it hosted on reliable hardware, then get your software engineering kicks elsewhere. Find a more modern forum software if you must and write plugins for it. Keep it patched and contribute back to that open source software's mainline.

But, if you really do want someone to over-engineer a forum, at least open source it from the beginning so people can pick it up when it languishes and is forgotten.

That's what popped into my mind when I read that incredibly myopic statement.

Offline iMav

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #212 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 06:08:25 »
Tp4's gekHa interface looks like this..

No orange?  (I just died a little inside...)

:)


Offline iMav

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #213 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 06:09:09 »
No sale is yet final, BTW.  Things are still being worked...so stand by.

Offline amnesia0287

  • Formerly Amnesia
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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #214 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 06:39:04 »
Tp4's gekHa interface looks like this..


//Recommend, should be the default after the overhaul..


Gray font on Black Back..

NO BLOAT..



Deskthority has alot more features and such, but they're not critical to communication.

Trim Gekha down to be slim.   NOT increase features which makes the interface messy.


(Attachment Link)

(Attachment Link)

Just 2 things. First. That gray on black theme actually makes my eyes hurt. But that said, I plan to make whatever site I end up building support user theme customizing, so you are welcome to suffer if thatís your prerogative.

Second. There is some confusion on what I mean by modern. I do not mean a specific style, but rather the idea of making an adaptable ux that works on all devices. The actual UX will designed by a graphics designer, I will just be implementing that look. Ideally we will likely do a few concepts and take few polls and votes and such. Perhaps even implement a few. Because all of the data will be API driven, there are almost infinite possibilities of how the actual interface could look of function.

One of the ideas Iíve thrown around (wouldnít be upfront) would be a retro.geekhack.com page that would essentially look just like the page now, but offer all the new search functionality and other new features of the new backend.

Online tp4tissue

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #215 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 06:49:07 »

Just 2 things. First. That gray on black theme actually makes my eyes hurt. But that said, I plan to make whatever site I end up building support user theme customizing, so you are welcome to suffer if thatís your prerogative.


amnesia0287.

Your monitor is probably running much hotter than Tp4's

Tp4 is calibrated to 60cd brightness.

The monitor is 99.8% srgb @ 1.2de,



So, yea, a screenshot from my pc might look whack on your end..


But my point is,  keep it simple,  text communication really does not require a florid interface.

If we implement some of the newer forum softs, they all have very complicated features that peeps simply won't take the time to learn/use,  yet these features will take up screen real-estate and cognitive visual processing capacity by the user.


When you see a complicated scene, the mind has to suppress the information that is not relevant to the information you're after.   This is a high processing cost on the brain..



I guess the best analogy is,   lean GekHa towards Zen Garden,  vs Hawaiian shirt.







Online tp4tissue

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #216 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 06:51:41 »
Tp4's gekHa interface looks like this..

No orange?  (I just died a little inside...)

:)



Hahaha..  I'm fine with more orange, but the color replacement plugin doesn't let me pick and choose.


Offline ghostjuggernaut

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #217 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 06:53:09 »
LOL to everything in this thread.
               

Offline Brammm87

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #218 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 07:31:47 »
Just caught up with the thread and for what my two cents are worth, here they are:

- I am highly confident Zeal only has GH's best interests at heart.

- I think people are confusing amnesia and Zeal. All we've heard is that Amnesia had a grand masterplan for a while now and with the possible sale now, has approached Zeal to merge his plan into GH. We've not heard anything from Zeal about this.

- Amnesia, I think you're being a little too overzealous (heh). As fendent has said: rock the boat too much... Hell, we all spend time on Facebook and Reddit, the pitchforks are out as soon as people so much as get a whiff of change. Be very mindful of that, especially if you talk about just replacing the entire site. Hell, we're only talking about the user base. But you better make sure you still have a moderator crew to help run things. They're very used to their moderation tools and work flows, change that too much and they just might end up saying "you know, this thing we've been doing voluntarily, forget about it".

Parts of the things you're describing make a lot of sense (a nice searchable index of ICs, GBs...) but those should probably be a separate site imo. If code would be written to replace the current forum, I strongly and highly agree that it should be open-sourced from the start with a proper review process.
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Offline hayt

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #219 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 07:56:40 »
Great discussion here imo. If nothing else, this shines a light on our beloved Geekhack.

I wanted to comment on the userbase and trends that have changed the way GH has been used over the years:

199047-0

When I look at this data, I don't necessarily see a "dying" website as much as one where the actual amount of conversations have waned. From a page view and new member perspective, seems pretty steady. As someone who is a relatively new member of 2 and a half years, I always felt like I missed the "good ole days" of GH. That said, this site is a treasure trove of useful information, archival photography, DIY guides, and of course Group Buys. That's what I love most about the community, we make our own dank ****.

Using myself as an example, even though I have less than 400 posts in GH, I believe the majority of the conversations are now happening in Slack and Discord. For instance:

I have over 2,790 files uploaded in Keyboard Community Slack


And 347 pages of conversation in Mech Keys Artisans channel



The point is, maybe we aren't actively using Geekhack as much anymore, but the community is thriving and a GH still plays a large role there.

Before we jump into discussions around changing or fixing Geekhack, can we put our heads together to identify any insights about our community that could help better focus what needs changing (if anything)?

Offline DALExSNAIL

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #220 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 08:10:09 »
Tbh the only thing that needs fixing is the messaging.

Other than that I dont see the issue with the site. Doesn't seem terribly outdated from using it over 2 years here. It's easier to use than people are making it out to be.

Offline KeyboardUser4

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #221 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 08:29:21 »
Tbh the only thing that needs fixing is the messaging.

Other than that I dont see the issue with the site. Doesn't seem terribly outdated from using it over 2 years here. It's easier to use than people are making it out to be.

right? for now just let the major players work out the specifics. There is literally nothing we can do now that iMav has decided to sell.

GH isnt going anywhere. Don't take anyone's word on anything, other than the new OWNER.


If we want to speculate: I see zeal purchasing, bills change names, and everything remains stagnant. Good on Amnesia for having goals and ideas from the get go, being willing to share and discuss possible features, but lets be realistic, the implementation of brand new site will take quite some time.

Money will be paid, server(s) will be "moved", GH will be GH just with a new name on the bill.




« Last Edit: Mon, 02 July 2018, 08:50:27 by clasicks »
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Offline ppp

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #222 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 08:43:52 »
Tbh the only thing that needs fixing is the messaging.

Other than that I dont see the issue with the site. Doesn't seem terribly outdated from using it over 2 years here. It's easier to use than people are making it out to be.

+1

I don't think that it's too bad. Sure there are some small QoL things that could be better but hey, any website has those. I don't want some garbage "oh we're so responsive and modern" website that runs like poop.

Offline shadowrealmwarez

  • Posts: 117
Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #223 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 08:50:05 »
Is the site being sold to recoup funds that have been put into the site? Why not turn the site over to someone who has resources to host it or disposable income to pay for said hosting instead of selling the site to new owners?

Offline Zuology

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #224 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 08:50:36 »
Tbh the only thing that needs fixing is the messaging.

Other than that I dont see the issue with the site. Doesn't seem terribly outdated from using it over 2 years here. It's easier to use than people are making it out to be.

+1

I don't think that it's too bad. Sure there are some small QoL things that could be better but hey, any website has those. I don't want some garbage "oh we're so responsive and modern" website that runs like poop.

You act like this site doesn't run like garbage 20% of the time already, hours/day-long downtime, etc.
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Offline helpful

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #225 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 08:59:26 »

if they replace the mods im leaving

I will but this out there. The first offer of $15k will take it.  (regardless of any other offers)

Done.

@zeal can you replace the mods so that puddsy will leave ... please.


Offline KeyboardUser4

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #226 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 09:00:39 »

if they replace the mods im leaving

I will but this out there. The first offer of $15k will take it.  (regardless of any other offers)

Done.

@zeal can you replace the mods so that puddsy will leave ... please.

sigh... another 8 post warrior. Atleast puddsy participates.
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Offline fanpeople

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #227 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 09:01:37 »

Offline ppp

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #228 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 09:05:42 »
@zeal can you replace the mods so that puddsy will leave ... please.

what's wrong with puddsy? just because his opinion might be different from yours sometimes? :|

next people will want tp to leave.. rip oniongifs

Offline Blaise170

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #229 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 09:09:23 »
I do not have strong opinions one way or the other but a few thoughts I have from reading the first couple of pages.
  • The idea of a vendor taking over the site bothers me, even if it is someone who has "been around".
  • The site should not cost $300-400/month to run, there are far cheaper options out there.
  • The messaging does need to be fixed.
I have other thoughts but nothing that I can put into words at the moment.
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Offline hineybush

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #230 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 09:19:20 »
I'm on-board with the whole situation, I'm glad GH will still be around for the forseeable future.

Two things:
  • Don't make huge changes, people don't like change and geekhack's forum styling is nice for long-term discussions or threads. I'm all for the PM system being overhauled, but I'd stop short of any sort of rearrangement or altering to the base site (at least on the front/outward facing side)
  • Zeal's vendor status isn't a bad thing, but it could potentially come to cause problems down the road (not saying it will, ofc). I like the idea of his hands-off ownership, leaving the day-to-day to the existing mods. It's up to us a community to make sure certain things stay in check to promote an open, fair and secure marketplace, vendor dynamic, and general sense of community.

Online romevi

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #231 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 09:24:48 »
At least please make "geekwhack.org" and "ripster.com" redirect to gh.

Offline fanpeople

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #232 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 09:44:49 »
At least please make "geekwhack.org" and "ripster.com" redirect to gh.

Just tried ripster.com "403 Forbidden"

Offline fendent

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #233 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 09:46:04 »
At least please make "geekwhack.org" and "ripster.com" redirect to gh.

Just tried ripster.com "403 Forbidden"

Banned from own website!! Will this tomfoolery never end!

Somebody better edit the wiki...

Offline dgneo

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #234 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 09:51:52 »
imo nothing wrong with a redesign, just make these forums live behind geekhack.org/forums or something, and use the main page for the new 'redesign'.
null

Offline whentheclouds

  • Posts: 610
Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #235 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 10:00:29 »
why are so many against the idea of a Geekhack facelift? we haven't even seen any mockups yet, and the features mentioned by Amnesia can only be good things as long as he can implement them in a design that satisfies a vast majority of the userbase. he even said he'll implement a retro.gh if necessary but it's like nobody even read the posts. i don't know about you guys, but some features here are begging to be fixed, namely the awful PM system and the search function that's even worse than the phpBB equivalent. then there are the little things like the bland and low-res icons all over the site, as well as the tiiiiny go to last unread post on Spy. we're usually a positive bunch on here, so please don't overreact until we have a good idea of what we're in for.

also the swiftness of the deal surprised me. guess we gotta wait for a statement from Zeal to clear the air

Offline Ail

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #236 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 10:14:56 »
While I absolutely respect and understand the decision; if GH is sold, I request a killswitch to easily remove an account and all its associated posts from the site. Would be quite tedious to delete every post one by one.

Come on, really? Isn't this a bit petulant?

Offline TheInverseKey

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #237 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 10:42:56 »

Offline Coreda

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #238 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 11:00:33 »
why are so many against the idea of a Geekhack facelift?

Fwiw I've been using Frenir's userstyle on geekhack for the last four years, which improves the default considerably. To your point though, with a change of board software there almost universally comes a change in theme, mostly since few I've seen have the time, patience, or skills to recreate anything existing and so go with the defaults + tweaks. Just depends how successfully the spirit of the board is carried across. Part of the current charm (to me at least) is also some of the when-the-web-was-simpler stylings of the smileys and such, but I'm also using a userstyle that strips parts to their most basic so I recognize it may be easier to arrive at something that feels right with the right elements.

In a recent case one forum completed a redesign and changed the backend to Discourse and it made the single most important and helpful member's contributions drop completely overnight. But there are quote notifications, in-place loading and likes so it can be labeled properly modern. A plus in various ways but obviously shows how it can affect people differently.

..then there are the little things like the bland and low-res icons all over the site, as well as the tiiiiny go to last unread post on Spy. we're usually a positive bunch on here, so please don't overreact until we have a good idea of what we're in for.

This is also fixable with stylesheets and alternate graphics, as is a mobile view, and anything visual tbh.
« Last Edit: Mon, 02 July 2018, 11:05:17 by Coreda »

Offline kiwi99

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #239 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 11:45:00 »
Fwiw I've been using Frenir's userstyle on geekhack for the last four years, which improves the default considerably...

where has this been all my life, even something as simple as this is a very nice change  :))

Offline zslane

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #240 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 11:59:01 »
This site needs to continue on. We can't leave the hobby in entirely in the hands of /r/mech...  :p

Offline Blaise170

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #241 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 12:05:36 »
This site needs to continue on. We can't leave the hobby in entirely in the hands of /r/mech...  :p

Deskthority (and many of the non-English forums like KBDMania) would like to have a word with you.
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Offline Fire Brand

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #242 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 12:07:30 »
While I absolutely respect and understand the decision; if GH is sold, I request a killswitch to easily remove an account and all its associated posts from the site. Would be quite tedious to delete every post one by one.

Did I not just literally say that?
You ever thought people ainít actually reading your walls of text

Reading is too hard now?

Fine TLDR: I will follow GDPR requirements of which the right to be forgotten is one.

Is that too many words?
No that's just the right amount of words

don't be ratty with people, because they didn't read your apparently self-important statement in response to Khers then you going "Did I not just literally say that?"
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Offline livingspeedbump

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Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #243 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 12:08:38 »
This site needs to continue on. We can't leave the hobby in entirely in the hands of /r/mech...  :p

There are so many other good forums for keyboards outside of reddit.  :rolleyes:

edit: Even reddit looks like the pearly gates compared to discord.
« Last Edit: Mon, 02 July 2018, 13:08:05 by livingspeedbump »
<- My Collection (so far)

Offline sony

  • Formerly ultraidiot
  • Posts: 213
  • Location: Atlanta
Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #244 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 12:36:34 »
yes, we always have discord  :))

Offline sncbraxsc2

  • Posts: 264
  • Location: Florida
  • ⭐Domesticated Dweeb⭐
Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #245 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 12:38:38 »
Kinda crummy that not even 30 among us have been willing to donate 10$ a month. This potential sale, on the 2nd anniversary of the beloved >>>>D E A L S<<<< installation, seems to have blindsided some?? Fundraising was brought up then but did anyone do anything about it?

I dislike change but I know it may be for the best as far as growth. I hope that a thorough archive, the moderation team and some of the classic charm remain through the new ownership/site revamp.

My only suggestion is to work closely with artisans on what would make Geekhack the best/main place for them to host their sales/keep people updated. I'm not sure a better chat system could be implemented that people would prefer more than slack/discord.
Cream Damped Mods Sound Test

Quote
So, logically, ALL of the time between NOW and SpaceRock, is the Test..

Offline hineybush

  • * Maker
  • Posts: 494
  • Location: Dayton, OH, USA
  • too many ideas, not enough money
    • hineybush keyboards
Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #246 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 12:40:56 »
I'm not sure a better chat system could be implemented that people would prefer more than slack/discord.

I suggested an official GH Discord server last night on the r/mk one during discussion about this whole topic, but everyone kinda came to the agreement that it'd just turn into another server to ****post in. Maybe a simple shoutbox would work with the forum.

Offline Giorgio

  • Posts: 1841
  • Location: Italy
Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #247 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 12:47:09 »
Everytime that someone brought up the profitability of gh, he has been dismissed and told that there's no such problem and that the income was enough.

Offline Ail

  • Posts: 83
  • Location: Mysidia
  • RIP in Pape
Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #248 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 12:52:22 »
Kinda crummy that not even 30 among us have been willing to donate 10$ a month. This potential sale, on the 2nd anniversary of the beloved >>>>D E A L S<<<< installation, seems to have blindsided some?? Fundraising was brought up then but did anyone do anything about it?

Exactly, people could have been donating this entire time to keep it running status quo. Now that it is too late and being sold, people want to get upset and start offering ideas, or monetary contribution. On top of that Mav could have just took the $10,000 offer and let the site fall into the hands of someone only interested in money and not the hobby, but went the extra step to offer it up to someone from the community who was willing to beat the offer. Then when a respected member and enthusiast accepts his offer people are still mad because he isn't the guy they wanted, or that's not community owned enough for them.

I don't think anyone has a right to be indignant about this situation.

Offline DALExSNAIL

  • The User Formerly Known as 'Formerly DudeSnail'
  • Posts: 970
  • Location: Charleston, SC
  • Haha just kidding
Re: Potential community sale...
« Reply #249 on: Mon, 02 July 2018, 13:14:30 »
Fwiw I've been using Frenir's userstyle on geekhack for the last four years

I love this. Keeps the original charm of GH imo and looks very clean. Thanks!