My Unfortunate Transaction with Fragil1ty

[Novus]

Thanks for your input gaizs my new monitor is kickass dood.

[heedpantsnow]

...

[drewba]

If the guy comes back to this thread (which let's be honest, he more than likely will, we all have an act for being curious) and he sees all of this stuff being posted about him, personal stuff no less, wont he be even harder to deal with and the prospect of getting any kind of a refund for OP will be a long, long shot. He was being difficult and hard to cope with before, this is just going to make things 100x worse in my opinion.

But hey, you guys do you and he will do him I guess.

Good luck OP, you're going to need it after this thread.

Agreed, shame is a powerful motivator until fragil1ty sees a bunch of people mocking him for how he looks, ragequits GH, and runs away with OPs money. He's already proven he can't handle a transaction-gone-awry in the best manner, so let's not make it harder for OP to get his money back. If this were me, I'd be asking you guys to remove the pictures stat.

Tofu thanks for posting the thread. I think you went about it in the right way (except releasing personal details(the picture should be edited)), waited a reasonable amount of time before letting the community know and did reach out to fragil1ty.

As mechanical keyboards continue to grow, situations like this one will unfortunately become more common.

[tp4tissue]

Ok guys.. Calm down..

First..   Don't get so worked up over $100..  The average lifespan is worth around 3-4 million..

So it's really a small pebble in the road..


Second..  I believe Fragility is -kids- age..  So he's not going to be especially adept at dealing with this type of social situation.  he also does not have the capital to rectify quickly.


So, chill out..  and stop the drama..   To the rest of the vultures.. shoo shoo....

[crimsonTofu]

I appreciate all the support some of you have shown in this thread but this has really blown up in a negative way. Yes I did want to get Fragil1ty's attention and make members aware of my current situation but I did not want to create a "witch hunt", ruin his reputation, or create the world's first(?) mechanical keyboard cyberbullying thread. I have messaged Fragil1ty once again and have offered to lock the thread upon his request.

[jdcarpe]

I have messaged Fragil1ty once again and have offered to lock the thread upon receipt of a full refund.

^ How it should have been worded.

[Photekq]

I believe Fragility is -kids- age..

I can understand why you'd make that assumption, going by the way he speaks. But nope.. he's an adult. He can't use his age as an excuse. Mental age, however, is a possible excuse..

[tbc]

I believe Fragility is -kids- age..

I can understand why you'd make that assumption, going by the way he speaks. But nope.. he's an adult. He can't use his age as an excuse. Mental age, however, is a possible excuse..

age can never a reason for anything someone does on the internet until you dox them.

it's REALLY easy to be a teenager on the internet.  i would know since i'm 19.

jk, i'm 25

...OR AM I? 

[paicrai]

Thanks for your input gaizs my new monitor is kickass dood.

thanks for reading my ****ing reviews in case you didnt know these keyboards were infact keyboards

[foxer]

This thread made me sick. If you don't get the full amount back, I get paid at the end of the month and I'll send you some to make up the sum, bro. His excuses were piss poor. And his arrogance is just an annoyance.

[Novus]

Guys "你搞砸了"

10/10 deflection chinese.

[fohat.digs]

i would know since i'm 19.

I will be 63 in less than 3 months.

Basic honor in business is pretty straightforward.

My stupid curiosity finally made me look at this thread and I regret it.

[whentheclouds]

i think the takeaway from this thread is: if you want to let other people know you're mad in a passive aggressive way, type in full italics

[foxer]

i think the takeaway from this thread is: if you want to let other people know you're mad in a passive aggressive way, type in full italics

Thank you for your input.

[Synjin]

Idk why but I can't seem to see the visual difference when something is italicized. Is there something wrong with my brain? Is it just me?

[foxer]

Idk why but I can't seem to see the visual difference when something is italicized. Is there something wrong with my brain? Is it just me?

[Synjin]

Lewl. I mean I can tell when I is around normal fonts but not when it is by itself.

[Huxley2500]

[tbc]

Show Image

#winning

[slickmamba]

[slickmamba]

Show Image

That is probably how he honestly feels

[HoffmanMyster]

For the record, Doxing is not okay and the images of Fragil1ty that have been posted in this thread have been removed.  It's pretty clear that what he did is not okay, but that doesn't mean he should be subjected to Doxing.

More than likely a mod would just refer to TOS

We have to avoid giving input in these cases, on an official level, due to liability.  Caveat Emptor is expressly quoted in the Classifieds rules for a reason.  That said, I personally am willing to give advice on a case-by-case basis, as a community member.  However, in this case there is very little to be done other than create a thread like this.

if they even respond.

I don't know why you continue to bash the mod team like this, but I'd appreciate if you would stop.  I always respond to your PMs, and although I can't confirm that the rest of the team does, I do know that it's really not relevant to this thread at all, other than stirring drama.  Thank you for your input

[Synjin]

I actually noticed the italics there.

[Computer-Lab in Basement]

For the record, Doxing is not okay and the images of Fragil1ty that have been posted in this thread have been removed.  It's pretty clear that what he did is not okay, but that doesn't mean he should be subjected to Doxing.

More than likely a mod would just refer to TOS

We have to avoid giving input in these cases, on an official level, due to liability.  Caveat Emptor is expressly quoted in the Classifieds rules for a reason.  That said, I personally am willing to give advice on a case-by-case basis, as a community member.  However, in this case there is very little to be done other than create a thread like this.

if they even respond.

I don't know why you continue to bash the mod team like this, but I'd appreciate if you would stop.  I always respond to your PMs, and although I can't confirm that the rest of the team does, I do know that it's really not relevant to this thread at all, other than stirring drama.  Thank you for your input

i ban everyone who PMs me... it's expected of me...

[SpAmRaY]

For the record, Doxing is not okay and the images of Fragil1ty that have been posted in this thread have been removed.  It's pretty clear that what he did is not okay, but that doesn't mean he should be subjected to Doxing.

More than likely a mod would just refer to TOS

We have to avoid giving input in these cases, on an official level, due to liability.  Caveat Emptor is expressly quoted in the Classifieds rules for a reason.  That said, I personally am willing to give advice on a case-by-case basis, as a community member.  However, in this case there is very little to be done other than create a thread like this.

if they even respond.

I don't know why you continue to bash the mod team like this, but I'd appreciate if you would stop.  I always respond to your PMs, and although I can't confirm that the rest of the team does, I do know that it's really not relevant to this thread at all, other than stirring drama.  Thank you for your input

i ban everyone who PMs me... it's expected of me...

Pm'd


And sorry to the mods they are totally underpayed and underappreciated.

[Computer-Lab in Basement]

For the record, Doxing is not okay and the images of Fragil1ty that have been posted in this thread have been removed.  It's pretty clear that what he did is not okay, but that doesn't mean he should be subjected to Doxing.

More than likely a mod would just refer to TOS

We have to avoid giving input in these cases, on an official level, due to liability.  Caveat Emptor is expressly quoted in the Classifieds rules for a reason.  That said, I personally am willing to give advice on a case-by-case basis, as a community member.  However, in this case there is very little to be done other than create a thread like this.

if they even respond.

I don't know why you continue to bash the mod team like this, but I'd appreciate if you would stop.  I always respond to your PMs, and although I can't confirm that the rest of the team does, I do know that it's really not relevant to this thread at all, other than stirring drama.  Thank you for your input

i ban everyone who PMs me... it's expected of me...

Pm'd

banned

[Michael]

[Computer-Lab in Basement]

Show Image

1000% accurate

[berserkfan]

As a guy who has more sell than buy transactions, I really do not like the seller’s attitude here. You should not deduct shipping cost if goods didn't make it into buyer's country. Problems in seller's country and with seller's own customs department ARE THE PROBLEM OF THE SELLER.

As someone who receives payment by gift routinely, I can say that gifting is not an issue for outright scams. You can always take back a gift.

I want payment by gift for three reasons. One is to circumvent pp fees, especially since I don’t expect protection as a seller anyway. Most people I do business with don’t have paypal US verified addresses (I don’t also!). Circumventing pp lowers cost of transaction for everyone.

A second reason is that I have a non-USD account, and deal with people with non USD accounts. PP tries to nickel and dime you whenever it can, eg by charging currency conversion fees twice. Unless someone is paying USD from an existing USD pp balance, the seller is usually charged extra for payments from a non-USD base currency. Paying me in Singapore dollars is useless since I will still get charged currency conversion if your account is in pounds or kronor etc. Not to mention I can’t take that money out of paypal without them charging me yet again for bank transfers. So I really hate paypal and do everything I can to avoid letting them charge me.

The last reason is to cut off trivial disputes and frivolous complaints. You need to write in to claim back a gift. That's not something anyone would do unless he was either a victim of fraud, or planning to file a false claim. Most disputes are not outright scams where nothing was sent or a Cooler Master sent in place of a Filco. Gifting means that a kid using his parents’ pp account won’t be able to dispute without at least letting his parents know what was going on. It discourages the sleazy stunts that people like Pacifist and Stancato09 like to pull when they do goods payment.

Try asking my friend Henz how to take back a gift. He’s done it before on a sleazy gher.

I am also more than puzzled why many of the same people who say ‘don’t send money as a gift’ will happily participate in group buys where they pay hundreds of dollars and wait 1+ year to get their swag via proxy shippers. Paying by goods is useless after 45 days. If you want the safety of paying by goods, you also need to do your own part to meet paypal requirements: direct shipping to your paypal verified address, and to file complaint within 45 days if not satisfied. Since OP waited too long, goods payment wouldn’t have helped him anyway.

I also have my doubts about some things.

The name being tossed around, supposedly Fragli1ty’s real name, is Dxxx Kxxx-Cxxx. All 3 elements are fully Anglo. The photos that supposedly reflect his actual appearance, which Hoffman has deleted, don’t match such a name. I think some innocent netizen’s photo got used as Fragil1ty’s.

Fragil1ty has been around for quite a bit. He didn’t look good here, but I don’t think he’s going to destroy his reputation over one keyboard. I fully support the mods in editing out the Doxing. I also want to point out at the time of this post, the OP has continued to display the personal details for Fragil1ty.

The behaviour of at least two geekhackers on this thread has really disappointed me. You guys are old timers and you don't know our rules (and general netiquette) on Doxing? In the bigger scheme of things, fake clacks/artisan caps are much more harmful to Geekhack as a whole than one ugly transaction, but people did not post the forger's photos either. I would give Fragil1ty the benefit of the doubt here because he hasn't established a pattern of sleazy behaviour yet. There are geekhackers who routinely do not send stuff within 2-3 months, refuse to answer PMs and are rude and vulgar, and somehow most of you folks still happily do business with them. Somehow, when someone is able to supply rare clacks or Model F keyboards, the normal rules of good sense go flying out of the window.

On a final note I don’t understand why the seller was charged $0.57 for fees. That’s not a gift, but it is way too low for any credit card payment.

[Novus]

Fragility's signature linked to his professional website and social media which had his personal information publicy.

[Megaweapon]

I wont be paying you today as I will be paying you within the next 2 weeks. I don't appreciate threads being made about me that tarnish my reputation here on the forums

[berserkfan]

Fragility's signature linked to his professional website and social media which had his personal information publicy.

Firstly, it no longer links. At least not today; I can't find his personal info.

Secondly, if it DID link, it implied that he wanted us to know who he was in personal life/ maybe connect to him professionally in the hope that maybe some job will come his way. That makes him even less likely to scam anyone.

[ideus]

What impressed me the most is how easy is for this individual to simple say i will not pay you today; as if it were not be his responsibility, no regrets, no embarrassment, sweet Jesus. I cannot believe it.

[paicrai]

For the record, Doxing is not okay and the images of Fragil1ty that have been posted in this thread have been removed.  It's pretty clear that what he did is not okay, but that doesn't mean he should be subjected to Doxing.

honestly p glad someone did something about that because even though i think fragility is a *****ass punk that was uncalled for

[Novus]

Fragility's signature linked to his professional website and social media which had his personal information publicy.

Firstly, it no longer links. At least not today; I can't find his personal info.

Secondly, if it DID link, it implied that he wanted us to know who he was in personal life/ maybe connect to him professionally in the hope that maybe some job will come his way. That makes him even less likely to scam anyone.

thanks for your input

[whentheclouds]

He didn’t look good here, but I don’t think he’s going to destroy his reputation over one keyboard. ...I would give Fragil1ty the benefit of the doubt here because he hasn't established a pattern of sleazy behaviour yet.

very fair post but this is the wrong assessment, as photekq has already pointed out how dishonest Fragility was in a previous transaction

[berserkfan]

I see. Somehow I missed Photekq’s response. My bad. Last I remembered Photekq was still Hitler, and now his avatar is some weirdo wizard.

AG’s pretty easygoing. I can see how he didn’t get all angry and ranty when he got a damaged Noppoo. But that also meant it didn’t register with the geekhack public. AG’s got creds with me so if he’d spoken out (as opposed to OP with practically no post history) I would have been much more sympathetic.

Since two incidents make a pattern, this is no longer a one-off thing.
 
I say let’s wait the two weeks that Fragil1ty has asked for. But all of us are now watching.

Two weeks from now will also be past payday for March. Fragil1ty will have no excuse to claim he has no money prior to payday. Considering how enthusiastic the general population has been about taking out the pitchforks, feathers, tar and boiling oil, I think we can exert quite a bit of influence in encouraging Fragil1ty to make good on his commitments. Worst come to worst, he won’t be back. Bad for OP, good for us all since we have one fewer problem member.

[Novus]

Two weeks from now will also be past payday for March. Fragil1ty will have no excuse to claim he has no money prior to payday. Considering how enthusiastic the general population has been about taking out the pitchforks, feathers, tar and boiling oil, I think we can exert quite a bit of influence in encouraging Fragil1ty to make good on his commitments. Worst come to worst, he won’t be back. Bad for OP, good for us all since we have one fewer problem member.

You know there's a reason Guts was betrayed...

[paicrai]

Photekq was still Hitler

[Hyde]

Oh man I've heard about the incident from crimsonTofu but good to see that he made a thread about it and it's being sorted out.

I've actually sold him a keyboard in February too but luckily we're both local Toronto so I literally just show up at his door hand him keyboard he hand me cash and done. 

crimsonTofu is a really nice young dude so hopefully everything will work out for him in the end.

[dimmu]

Two weeks from now will also be past payday for March. Fragil1ty will have no excuse to claim he has no money prior to payday. Considering how enthusiastic the general population has been about taking out the pitchforks, feathers, tar and boiling oil, I think we can exert quite a bit of influence in encouraging Fragil1ty to make good on his commitments. Worst come to worst, he won’t be back. Bad for OP, good for us all since we have one fewer problem member.

You know there's a reason Guts was betrayed...

shots fired.

[whentheclouds]

You know there's a reason Guts was betrayed...

thanks for the spoiler

[Lastpilot]

How is this thread not locked yet?

[berserkfan]

Two weeks from now will also be past payday for March. Fragil1ty will have no excuse to claim he has no money prior to payday. Considering how enthusiastic the general population has been about taking out the pitchforks, feathers, tar and boiling oil, I think we can exert quite a bit of influence in encouraging Fragil1ty to make good on his commitments. Worst come to worst, he won’t be back. Bad for OP, good for us all since we have one fewer problem member.

You know there's a reason Guts was betrayed...

Care to tell us your interpretation of Berserk? It's a pretty complex work and I have always been interested in how people interpret the manga. There is a lot going on and none of the characters are Hollywood-flat which makes for a lot of discussion fodder.

[Bromono]

Two weeks from now will also be past payday for March. Fragil1ty will have no excuse to claim he has no money prior to payday. Considering how enthusiastic the general population has been about taking out the pitchforks, feathers, tar and boiling oil, I think we can exert quite a bit of influence in encouraging Fragil1ty to make good on his commitments. Worst come to worst, he won’t be back. Bad for OP, good for us all since we have one fewer problem member.

You know there's a reason Guts was betrayed...

Care to tell us your interpretation of Berserk? It's a pretty complex work and I have always been interested in how people interpret the manga. There is a lot going on and none of the characters are Hollywood-flat which makes for a lot of discussion fodder.

Brb going to watch berserk

[dimmu]

Two weeks from now will also be past payday for March. Fragil1ty will have no excuse to claim he has no money prior to payday. Considering how enthusiastic the general population has been about taking out the pitchforks, feathers, tar and boiling oil, I think we can exert quite a bit of influence in encouraging Fragil1ty to make good on his commitments. Worst come to worst, he won’t be back. Bad for OP, good for us all since we have one fewer problem member.

You know there's a reason Guts was betrayed...

Care to tell us your interpretation of Berserk? It's a pretty complex work and I have always been interested in how people interpret the manga. There is a lot going on and none of the characters are Hollywood-flat which makes for a lot of discussion fodder.

Brb going to watch berserk

*read. the series/ova will just leave you wanting for more.

[Hyde]

How is this thread not locked yet?

Show Image

I believe it is best to lock this after the matter is resolved.  :P

[Novus]

How is this thread not locked yet?

Show Image

I believe it is best to lock this after the matter is resolved.  :P

No that's not right.
It shouldn't be immediately locked even if fragility pays up.
I think it would only be fair if this was locked 3 months after fragility pays.

[tp4tissue]

Oh man I've heard about the incident from crimsonTofu but good to see that he made a thread about it and it's being sorted out.

I've actually sold him a keyboard in February too but luckily we're both local Toronto so I literally just show up at his door hand him keyboard he hand me cash and done. 

crimsonTofu is a really nice young dude so hopefully everything will work out for him in the end.

Keyboard? Yes OK Mr. Pot dealer.  Nice to know you deliver

[GL1TCH3D]

Although I think Fragility's behavior is repulsive, self-serving and contradictory. There is really no need to start this thread.The simple answer is just file a paypal complaint and let them deal with it.

Paypal only allows for chargebacks within a certain amount of time.

You need to deal with Paypal and/or your financial institution. In your case you'll get your money back.

If you chargeback through your bank your paypal goes negative and they pass the charge onto a debt collection agency

The seller is ultimately responsible responsible until the board reaches the buyer.

Not necessarily. I've had to make several transactions myself where I clearly stated that I would not take responsibility for the product after I've posted it for customs / protection issues with paypal. This is more dependent on the transaction terms.

i'm just going to 'speak up' on the pay as goods thing.

remember that this is between a canadian and a european.  NOT between american and american.

if europe to canada is as bad as canada to europe, then paying with goods [properly] would have required tracking which would have cost upwards of $40-$50 USD with proper packaging.

yes...people are going to say 'suck it up'....i'm not trying to defend one side or the other.  facts are good yes?

Going to second this.

It has nothing to really do with the fees and more to do with the power of the buyer to chargeback. The seller is forced to take tracking and this would make the whole transaction pointless as it would be cheaper to get a brand new one within NA.

Though, as I mentioned about the chargeback power of the buyer, the buyer must be more aware of this loss as well as be more careful with who to pay in this fashion





As for the situation on hand... I'd honestly like to know what problem there was with shipping.

Personally if someone gives me the wrong address to ship to, I'm not refunding that shipping money. I always verify 2-3 times with the buyer before shipping to avoid such hassles. If they screw up all 3 times then tough luck.
If however I made the mistake on the shipping forms and didn't write the correct address or anything I'll gladly take the hit and reship ASAP.

I've been on both sides of the witch hunt myself, publicly and privately. You could have honestly had good intentions and the person just gets angry at you for some reason and starts a witch hunt against you. I sold some audio gear a while back. Made sure to clarify in my listing that goods were cosmetically damaged but fully functional with picture proof. The guy gave me problems throughout the entire payment phase and after receiving the stuff he comes out and tries to put me out as a scammer. Go figure.



After reviewing all the posts made here in this thread however I really feel like frag may have just been hoping that tofu would just sit quiet until it was more convenient for him to return the money